Just wondering if anyone can help me as i cant find much information on the internet and the vet didnt give me any straight answers only that my dog was to go back in a weeks time to have another scan as she is 36 days from her first mating and at her scan we saw about three puppies but the vet said he couldnt see any heartbeats and thought he would see them by now.My dog isnt sick and has started to thicken round the sides of her tummy.We have to wait till next week for another scan and im concerned for my dog incase the puppies are dead.Is it possible the heartbeats can be seen later and sometimes are not seen at this stage?

>concerned for my dog incase the puppies are dead

Your bitch would have reabsorbed the pups at a guess.

The puppies are very clearly inside her she is getting bigger and they where seen on the scan just no heartbeat was seen.

either the scanner wasn't very modern, or operator efficient, or the pups have died and will be absorbed.  Only time will tell.

Once again, why all this scanning!!!   Scans will only confirm, or not, a pregnancy at the time of the scan and are not reliable in terms of how many either.   Unless you have a need to know (mis-mating = a termination) I strongly urge you to wait.   Going to the vet's office, for the majority of dogs, is stressful and at a time when the pregnant bitch doesn't need stress.   Plus the risk of infection - sick dogs go to vets.    For me, far better would be to give her her full time, and when/if she goes a couple of days over with nothing going on, then take her in for an examination and x-ray to see whether she's empty or not.    Right now you are just stressing her, getting no proper answers, and lining the pocket of your vet.    We have never done scans prior to whelping.

Time will tell - for sure.

ps   Bitches can reabsorb at around week 5, some or all, if conditions in the uterus are not right.

Once again, why all this scanning!!!   Scans will only confirm, or not, a pregnancy at the time of the scan and are not reliable in terms of how many either.

Vital to know there isn't one single pup as then you are virtually guaranteed to have to book a c-section. I know two people in two very different breeds who did not scan and ended up with one single pup that died as it could not be passed naturally -one in a breed where you would expect at least 7 or 8 pups normally. Not to mention that with so many novices breeding these days, a lot wouldn't have a clue if their bitch was pregnant or not..... I always scan JUST to make sure there are more than one. And I always know the bitch is pregnant before I scan.

I would be seriously considering whether my bitch was suitable for breeding if she found it stressful to go to the vet's ...

And some scanners (sheep scanners generally) will come to your home, or you can go to theirs, and they can be very reliable on numbers.

I've always used a wonderful lady based in Milton Keynes for scanning. She will come to you or you can go to her home. Never had any problems, she's very accurate with numbers due and dates. She's very good with the dogs as well.

I'm sorry, but I'm sticking to my guns when it comes to all this scanning.    I've had small litters, including a singleton puppy, and yes, nothing happened for 48 hours over her due date.  However I didn't leave mine over about 2 days beyond the due date with nothing happening.  I took my bitch in to be examined, if necessary given a shot to get things started, and/or x-ray.   There would have been NO possibility of not knowing about a singleton, or small litter.  

Scanning isn't necessary.   Again unless the bitch was caught and there was a need to know, to make a decision about a spay/shot to stop a pregnancy.

I don't accept that bitches with a good temperament won't be stressed by a vet visit either.   For one moment. Surely living a peaceful life at home, rather than being bounced around in a car, even if happy to see a vet, is logically going to be far better for her.  And again, sick dogs go to vets (somebody come out to the bitch would be marginally better but a positive scan doesn't mean the bitch will carry to term).    I have always preferred to get good matings, probably one is enough, but usually two, and then sit it out.   I do wonder whether people are branwashed re scanning - or have more money than I do!!   Lucky local vets but if you want to throw good money away, so be it.

However I didn't leave mine over about 2 days beyond the due date with nothing happening.  I took my bitch in to be examined, if necessary given a shot to get things started, and/or x-ray.   There would have been NO possibility of not knowing about a singleton, or small litter.

How? Neither of the bitches I mentioned were overdue. Seeing as a bitch can go into labour from day 56, how would you know if she was overdue or not? If labour SHOULD have started but didn't due to there only being one pup? How would you KNOW it was just one pup? With just one, there could be problems even if the bitch started going into labour bang on time. One of the bitches I mentioned had to have a caesarian as the pup was too big to be born, but by then it was already dead. The other got it partway out then no more and the vet could not even do a c-section so had to cut the pup into pieces to remove it. A scan could have prevented both scenarios. And you should NEVER give oxytocin unless a pup has been born already.

If you don't trust your vet surgery to not infect your pregnant btich, then presumably you also would never dare to walk her, or bring unvaccinated pups to be vaccinated etc etc. Maybe you should change vets to one you can trust. (Especially if they offer oxytocin before any puppy has been born.)

I scan, and will continue to do so. My girls are not stressed by a vet visit, we pop in regularly to see the receptionists when they are young and they grow to be happy to visit at any time. Its all part of our socialization regime. They get "bounced" around in the car at least twice a day so are used to it and settle happily, no stress. I never scan for numbers just for pregnancy conformation. Then we know for sure, at 4 weeks we can have a rough guess at numbers but do not rely on it. The rest follows then, upping food and  ensuring a good mixed diet to support puppy growth and Mothers needs. My vets are happy to support me through the pregnancy from mating to the day we wave the pups off to new homes, they do not take advantage of me...I am a good client and they respect that. I have had a singleton litter, we knew this at 4 weeks and scanned a couple more times to be sure. The pup was born by C-Sect safe and well. If we had not scanned I would not have known she was pregnant and could have easily lost her and the pup as she never went into labour naturally, she was 55kg and had plenty of room to hide a puppy...
These tools are available to be used to make breeding a litter safer and I see no reason not to give my girls ever care and try to avoid problems.
Aileen

I always scan but my vet never even attempts numbers other than the obvious we see. I am a good client of theirs and as a rule do not think they are taking advantage of me. When I took her in for the canine herpes jab she is so unstressed, she jumped up on the counter in the reception room to the hilarity of everyone including my vet who said that was something he had never seen before! Because she is used to going up on the grooming table as well.
I also would rather know for sure so I can treat her accordingly although equally I know people who do not.
Personally I think it is a "modern" advantage that we can avail ourselves of and why not use it.

I always scan but my vet never even attempts numbers other than the obvious we see. I am a good client of theirs and as a rule do not think they are taking advantage of me. When I took her in for the canine herpes jab she is so unstressed, she jumped up on the counter in the reception room to the hilarity of everyone including my vet who said that was something he had never seen before! Because she is used to going up on the grooming table as well.
I also would rather know for sure so I can treat her accordingly although equally I know people who do not.
Personally I think it is a "modern" advantage that we can avail ourselves of and why not use it.

Ditto Aileen, we take pups and adults to the vet just to socialise or to weigh them, and of course the van is like a second home to them and everything FUN happens after a van ride -a nice walk, a show, a training class etc. I used a sheep scanner once, it took me a lot longer to get there than to my vet which is just 10 mins away, she charged MORE than the vet and was no more accurate on numbers and crucially she failed to spot a dead puppy during two different pregnancies. My vets are absolutely wonderful and there's always such excitement around all the staff when you bring a bitch in for a scan. I'm going tomorrow for one!

I'm really not sure what I'm arguing about here. But .....  Gestation in the bitch lasts for 62/63 days, usually taken from the first mating much as conception may not have taken place right then.   When mine have gone for that length of time, plus a couple of days, then I'd assume any puppies they have need to come out.   At that point I take them into the vet for an examination, perhaps x-ray and perhaps a shot to get things moving.   Day 56 would clearly not be 'overdue'. 

"And you should NEVER give oxytocin unless a pup has been born already."    Really?   How strange that in many of my litters, oxytocin, or a pit shot, WAS given to get things moving, safely.

"A scan could have prevented both scenarios."    And an x-ray, done after the due date - far more accurate than scanning -  would have shown this too.

As for not trusting my vet surgery etc....... that's plainly not the point (much as there are very few vets I do fully trust these days!!!).   Where I walked my pregnant bitches was out in the country, with a very small dog population anywhere around ...... and when I had puppies, if they went into the vet for vaccination (which wasn't always the case - quite often I had my vet come out to do that in my home) they were contained in a big crate and put on the table on my towel for their vaccination.   Minimising risk?

If people want to scan, that's their choice.  I just wanted to point out that it's really not necessary!!! ?

But there's no point continuing this really and apologies to the OP for high-jacking their thread.

>"And you should NEVER give oxytocin unless a pup has been born already."    Really?   How strange that in many of my litters, oxytocin, or a pit shot, WAS given to get things moving, safely.

To be strictly accurate, oxytocin should never be given before the cervix is fully dilated. In practice most breeder aren't familiar with digital examination of their bitch's cervix, but if a whelp has already been passed then you know for sure that it is.

Taken from Oxytocin datasheet:
"Oxytocin-S is indicated for:
- stimulation of uterine contraction to facilitate parturition in the presence of a fully dilated cervix"

"Contra-indications, warnings etc.
When Oxytocin-S is used as an aid to parturition, cervical dilation must be confirmed prior to administration to prevent the risk of foetal death and possible uterine rupture.

Hope this clarifies things. :-)

Just had my bitch scanned so now know there are several pups and she likely took from the later mating which was useful to know. She was happily eating her favourite treats and we are now on our way home. Cost at vets £21.79.

I had to scan at 5 weeks 4 days as I saw a small amount of watery blood. No pups. Vets costs....£77 & told she's having a split season.

"To be strictly accurate, oxytocin should never be given before the cervix is fully dilated."

I promised myself this was enough, but reading this.... and thinking back, oxytocin/a pit shot was not given with my bitches until they'd started having contractions but had not progressed.   Secondary uterine inertia. And it certainly wasn't given until my vet(s) had examined then, and presumably found the condition of the cervix.    And yes, although on one occasion out in Canada when there was a blizzard going on outside and I couldn't go too and from our then vet without risking life and limb, they gave me 3 shots to give her and sent me home with her - I gave her one, but then took her back as I knew the risks and didn't feel confident to do this myself more than once.   In fact when I took her back, they went for a C.Section.