I could do with some advise.  I am looking to get Roxy (small working springer) spayed in the new year, preferably about end February time (as about right for between seasons).  She will be 2 and a half, I have no intentions of her ever having a litter, she has phantoms after every season which really take it out of her and leave her ratty with the other dogs.  I know from my previous collie bitch that phantoms tend to get worse as they get older.  I don't want to keep putting her through that 3 times a year, and having experienced a pyo (again in my collie) I really don't want that for her.  I would rather do this while she is younger as they tend to recover better.

However, I have no experience of post spay incontinence.  It worries me as she is a terrible sprinkler anyway.  I have never had a bitch have this, I know it exists but I have also never had one that piddles like Roxy!  What is the likelihood of it?  Has anyone any first hand experience?  Any advise that may help prevent it?  Or help dealing with it (just in case)? 

If it makes any difference my vets are excellent surgically, spayed 2 dogs and 1 cat for me and you can barely see any of the scars

As far as I know, the best way to prevent it is to not spay until aged over 2 for medium to large breeds -so that is in your favour. I have a friend who has a bitch closely related to mine and she is incontinent. She had to be spayed due to pyometra aged 18 months. She has to have daily medication which has to be adjusted now and then.

I had no less than 3 of my bitches spayed last year. The first aged 5. I would have done it a couple of years earlier but just never got round to it, and I was always certain I did not want to breed from her. The second aged 2 -no choice as she developed pyometra. The third is the mother of the other two, aged 7 ½ -as she will be 8 soon and won't be having more litters. Touchwood, no problems with any of them.

Hi Roxylola

I've had experience with spay incontinence in an older setter. She started "leaking" about a year after the op and it was soon controlled with daily medication.  The drops were called Propalin and I don't know the latest meds available but it was just a question of getting the right dosage to stop the leaking and it was never a problem after that.

Because I had heard about it and was aware, I was on the look out for leakages and dealt with it quickly once it started. It was her damp bed in the morning that alerted me, along with the slightly whiffy smell. There were never any puddles and she seemed totally unaware.

I recently spayed my GSD bitch and had my springer booked in to get spayed at the same time but when we got there, Our springer had decided to have a full phantom with milk!! So she is now on a major diet and exercise to get her ready for the end of January.
Anyway, I specifically asked the vet about spay incontinence as I worry about it having had a few bitches with the problem and I thought it was maybe a surgery thing but was told it was nothing to do with the actual incisions or anything, it was a lack of hormones that cause the leaks.  Some dogs get it, some don't it's just your pot luck.
The good news though is it is very cheap and easy to treat.  Propalin worked for our old bitch and we got her right down to barely anything at all.  I wouldn't let it put me off spaying.
Coat changes are more of a concern for me.  I don't want a springer that looks like a sheep!!lol

It's good to know that it is easy enough to treat.  And interesting that hormones cause it.  And yes, coat worries me too!  She has a lovely worker coat at the moment - never needed to trim her or anything.  My old collies coat went very thick, she was pretty senior when she was spayed though (not that it makes a difference I suppose).  But my beagle has not changed a bit for spaying, nor did my lab. 

I am glad I have left her entire for as long as I have as she was just a big baby even at 18 months.  She is a lovely little dog and a big part of me does not want to mess with her but it is not worth the risk of Parvo etc and also, not worth the trauma (to her) of being pestered by males.  Despite my best efforts she remains convinced she is a small person in a furry suit and refuses to entertain strange dogs!

> risk of Parvo

I suspect you mean Pyometra...

I have never had any have post spay incontinence, my youngest spay has been 4 years old & they all hold their water until very late in life. Our eldest will be 16 in Feb & she does have the odd accident but I put that down to her getting hold of a Nurofen packet when she was about 5 & digesting around 8!!

Our springer is 6 but she's been getting worse with her phantom pregnancies.  In fact, she was last in season in August and is spraying milk at the min! I could murder her!lol  And she is the same, a fab figure and worker coat.  I'm just hoping it doesn't tangle easier!

Oh my, my beagle is a monkey for that sort of thing too!  And yes I did mean pyo - got it right in my first post and ahd a moment there with the second!

Hi, I'm sure everyone's experience is different and here's mine to add to the melting pot.  I have a 6.5 year old, spayed at 20 months (3 months after her first season)  She doesn't have a problem with incontinence.  We had a  bitch come to us at 6.5 years, already spayed, who died at 14 and she never had a problem either.  We currently have 2 x 10 yo, one spayed at 8, no idea when the other was done (she's a rescue) and neither of them have a problem with incontinence.  My vets advised to make sure they still had the same amount of exercise, relevant to their ages, to maintain fitness which I've done.   Don't know if that's helped keep the problem at bay or not. I think if you're not going to breed from her then the advantages  of spaying outweight the disadvantages but it's a very personal choice.

Touch wood, of the 7 bitches I have had spayed (all as mature adults at least 5 years old at time of spay in current breed and at 2 1/2 for the Groenendael). 

All have been fit individuals of medium size breeds, not weighing over 50 pounds as adults.

Fortunately in both with breeds there were no disadvantageous/hugely noticeable coat changes.

unfortunately every spaniel I have known, of whatever kind, has had the most dreadful unmanageable coat after neutering.

unfortunately every spaniel I have known, of whatever kind, has had the most dreadful unmanageable coat after neutering.


My 3-year old cocker spaniel which is most likely half working/half show was neutered before her first season and her coat is fine. Yes, it does need a bit of stripping every few months to keep it tidy, but other than that, her coat is still deep red, only her longer leg feathering is lighter (but doesn't mat that easily). So not ALL spaniels go horrible and I believe working coats tend to keep better than show type coats.

This summer
https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/1043883_10151510121513520_1300648324_n.jpg

Last winter
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-updhaoBN1VA/USDF7PGTPxI/AAAAAAAACyY/A0u-Upte_lc/s400/Phone+012013+006.jpg

I've had two dogs with this now - Soli, my old dobe who was spayed at ~2yrs old, and Saffi, my lab who was spayed at ~5yrs old (both done before I got them).  Soli's needed total control with propalin, but I did find that food made a huge difference and I am not the only person who has found this.  Raw feeding meant I could half the dose, but generally speaking, the less processed and the higher meat content the better for her.  Saffi is raw fed for other reasons but she only leaks periodically - only twice that I've actually witnessed, but I know she has had a few other times as well.  Only a tiny amount each time, and she's completely unaware it's happening so she's not on any meds (Soli found it very upsetting).  I suspect the food link is the key with Saffi too - she does have some small bouts of being kibble fed and although I've not connected the two, I suspect it's those times that trigger an episode.

I am hoping the fact that she has never been clipped or stripped to now will be in my favour - clipping certainly is a slippery slope, and I can't keep her entire just because she has nice fur lol!

Interesting about the food Nikita, I feed a mix of raw and kibble but would not be totally averse to going raw if need be.  I suspect it would upset her, she always checks herself if she has any sort of stressful or excitable (or any other emotional) experience to see if she peed!

> but I did find that food made a huge difference and I am not the only person who has found this.  Raw feeding meant I could half the dose.

Its strange you should say that as I had on old crossbreed who used to leak and had to have Propalin. (she was spayed at 6 months. Before her 1st season as that was what my vet recommended. Never again).

Anyway when she was 10 I changed all my dogs on to raw including my old girl. After the change she stopped leaking and I was able to stop the propalin for the rest of her life.

I'd suggest the benefits of getting her spayed now, far outweigh any risk of spay incontinence.   And the risk of mammary, ovarian or uterine cancer, or pyometra is always there with unspayed bitches.   Most of our bitches were only spayed on retirement, which meant around 5 years and none had any problems with incontinence - we did have one with mammary cancer by age 12, sadly.   I took my Whippet in to be spayed when 6 months but was advised to let her have one season.   He suggested doing it at 6 months could lead to spay incontinence, and/or bone development problems.   So although I needed her to be spayed because I had an elderly entire male at the time, who was suffering with cancer and didn't need to be anywhere near a bitch in season, which he'd have known about even if she was the other end of the house, I waited, and made arrangements for a local kennels to take her for me when she did come in.   By the time she was 11 months, with no sign of any season, I took her back and asked him to go ahead with the spay.   He did and now at over 5 years, she's fine.

If I were you I'd go ahead with your girl, but I might talk to my vet about her 'sprinkling' (bless).   There may be a medical reason for this (immature bladder?) which he can sort out at the time?    For sure having false pregnancies, and the need to confine all the time, is a pain.

Coats - some of mine would grow a thicker coat (bitches) and the two males needing castration for prostate problems definitely did (Bassets).    My Whippet's coat is unchanged.