Hi, before anything else please let me explain my situation as it is very complicated. I have have my bitch for 3 years now and we got her when she was 6 months old on breeding terms. She is KC registered, health tested and from a champion line. She had her first litter at 1.5years and all was well, she went to the breeder at 7 weeks gestation to settle in and whelped 7 pups at 9 weeks and the breeder took care of all costs etc. Our agreement for the breeding terms was 2 litters so this june she came into season, went to be tested and was taken to a proven stud at the peak of her heat once. 5 weeks later her breeder unfortunately passed away suddenly and we are now having her here to have the pups and we have no one to fall back on for help etc.

What I'm here to ask is has anyone had a bitch who didn't get very big during pregnancy as I am not overly convinced she is actually pregnant. She has been on puppy food for 5 weeks now and is 66 days since breeding. Her nipples are a bit larger and hanging but no milk. Shes sleeping alot and has gone off her food a bit the last few days. I've tried to feel movement and think I felt something but I don't know what I'm feeling for. I've read 'The book of the bitch' and bought everything I need for her whelping. We've set up a large crate for her and she's been sleeping in it but no digging or nesting yet. I want a vet to check her but the breeders family are  saying it's not necessary (they're priorities are a mile away from mine understandably), they'll pay for any treatment needed but not for this and I cant afford at the moment as again I never expected to have to.

Is it possible that she didn't conceive for a few days after breeding and is only having a small litter? Or does this sound more like a phantom?

I'm sorry it's so long winded but like I said we've been put in an awkward situation. I'm looking for advice not criticism as we never expected to be in this position.

Thank you in advance

Gosh can't help much as all my experience is with phantoms - seen lots of those but no real pregnancies.  Just wanted to say what a difficult situation you must be in and that you have come to a great place for advise and help.  That must have been a real shock.  I know in your situation I would be praying for a phantom as I too would have no clue.  Best of luck whatever the outcome

it could be a phantom or a small litter but you really do need a vet to advise. if the breeder agreed to pay all costs why wont the family pay for this vet check? Are they expecting to take the puppies and profit from them? if so then they should pay the cost of the check up. If they want nothing to do with it all then it may well be down to you to find the money. It may not be a situation of your making but if something were to go wrong you would be the one paying the price with the possible loss of your girl.

Take her and get her scanned, although its not fail safe it will go some way to establishing if she is indeed pregnant.

If she is, try and find if there are any local breeders to you willing to mentor/help you out.

What an awful situation to be in :(

There's advise I would have given if you posted when your breeder died, however, IMO I would be getting the bitch scanned so you KNOW one way or another IF she is pregnant or not. The families priorities may be a mile away from yours, BUT you have effectively been forced to be a novice breeder, and you NEED to know whether or not she is pregnant

With regards to not being able to afford a scan, they are usually in the region of £30 - £40, about the cost of a veterinary consultation fee. If you cannot afford this, how on earth can you afford the general upkeep of the dog?

Thank you for such quick replies, and in regards to finances I am recently out of work and registered carer for my son and also I have just had to sort out school uniforms shoes etc so this month I have nothing left, and I have food etc for the dog for weeks yet. I have pet insurance for any emergencies but not had to use it as of yet (touch wood) but reading through it doesn't cover anything to do with pregnancy. The family of the breeder have got alot of new commitments since the breeder passed and so they are unable to help but when I mentioned her maybe uaving an xray they just said theres no need and not to worry...makes me feel paranoid but at the same time if she is actually pregnant and has 3 pups I want to know that 3 is all shes having. We have a friend who lives locally and breeds dogs and she has helped us with information. Looks like I'll just have to keep on for them to pay for a check up. It wasn't decided until last week that she'd be staying with us, but they basically ran out of time to arrange someone to have her so I haven't had chance to factor in the extra cost of a vet ch3ck otherwise believe me she would have been long before now.

As someone said if you had come here sooner then we would have advised an injection to stop the pregnancy, it can be given up to 42days from mating.

How pregnant is she now? Puppy food shouldn't start till 42 days and daily worming with Panacur 10% at 40days till 2 days post whelping.

She may be having a phantom which because she has been fed the richer puppy food is prolonged, I had a bitch who had 4 phantoms only the times she was mated, they lasted between 5-7 weeks and then literally overnight she would go back to normal.

No point in Xrays till a week before due date as the bones are not calcified enough to show up but a scan can be done from 30 days onwards, I leave mine till about 39 days to confirm pregnancy before starting puppy food/worming. There are professional scanner which will come to your house and scan or arrange to meet you somewhere they are maybe scanning farm animals in your area, they are cheaper than a vet and more experienced as that is what they do all day.

Many dogs don't get bigger in size till the last 2 weeks when puppy growth is rapid, puppy movement can be felt then too, I lie on the bed with her and put my hand under her whilst she lies on her side, when she dozes off the puppies become active, to start with it is just ripples but as time goes by you will see and feel proper kicks.

I do hope that she is having a phantom as you need to have at least £1000 on stand by to cover the cost of emergency treatment which usually happens out of hours or over a BH, I would not be banking on the breeders family if they won't pay up to confirm pregnancy.

I hope your breeder friend can help you with equipment and advice, getting a whelping kit ready is no mean feat including nutrodrops for dam and pups for a quick energy boost and Dopram V drops to stimulate breathing in pups who are slow to breathe but have a heart beat.

I was a human midwife but still found my first litter scary, I had 2 mentors at the end of the phone 200 miles away, one was the bitches breeder and the other the studs owner, the bitch had already whelped a litter before I got her with no problems but each whelping is different.

Keep us posted on how things are going and Good Luck.

Rhodach makes a good point, would the stud owner be prepared to help at least in terms of advice etc - it's their lines in there too potentially so you would hope they might show some interest

I think the stud owner and the bitches breeder were the same person, you would think the relatives of the deceased breeder would be more helpful after all it is not the OP's fault that she has been left with this dilemma, I hope they don't expect to swoop in and take the pups to sell after all the hard work has been done.

It is also unfortunate the breed that is in high numbers in rescues and hard to rehome to reputable families who are not going to use them as status symbols or for fighting.

Quick update...we've had a juggle with money and she's on the way to the vet as we speak!! I've got a whelping kit sorted, and the stud is a seperate breeder, haven't a clue who! Done loads of research and reading this last week so feel prepared if she is having pups...no doubt it will be scary though, just waiting for them to come back with the news. Thanks for the advice, I'll let you know what is said.x

I am glad you are getting her scanned. If there are puppies you will need to find out who the stud owner is so that the puppies can be KC registered. Your breed is a hard one to find suitable homes for at the best of times so KC registration along with proof of the health tests that the stud has had are essential. I am assuming you did the health tests for your bitch and not the breeder and have the certificates etc for your bitches health tests otherwise they will also need to be obtained from the breeders family.

<<<<She has been on puppy food for 5 weeks now and is 66 days since breeding.>>>

Depending on when she ovulated, if pregnant, she could now be overdue.

Ok vet is 100% that there are no puppies...he even refused to scan her as he was that sure. And bless him he waived the consultation fee due to the circumstances. There are still good people in this world. Thanks to everyone for not giving me a hard time, really appreciate the advice you have all offered. I can now sleep easy.xxx

Good news, looks like a blessing for both you and your girl at least you are not now left to panic at being thrown in at the deep end. :-)

Kez035 I would now get your girl spayed, (3 months from now) your contract was with your girls breeder and she has now sadly passed  so that contract is over, it's not fair to put you or your girl in that position again.

Sleep well. x

Thats exactly what we're doing, already spoken to the vet about it and she will be done in 3 months like you suggested. I'm so relieved! !

Hooray, so nice to read of good people, sensible vets, and a happy outcome all round!