hello, wondering if anybody has experience on above subject. it is only intended as light-hearted discussion :)

those of you who have bred two or more litters from the same bitch, do you find they whelp on the same day of the gestation period from the first mating.

In my breed, (cobby toy breed) it seems that this is relatively uncommon. i myself have never bred two litters from the same bitch, i would consider myself a novice. However a lady i know, who has a larger working type breed states her bitch and her three litters whelped every single time on day 62 from the 1st mating.

I have also heard of other breeders stating their bitches, toy breeds, whelps every time on day 56 with pups being perfectly sized and viable.

any experiences appreciated

Reading the title I thought you were going to mention 2 bitches whelping together.

The only bitch I have had 2 litters from whelped on Day 63 from second mating and Day 63 from her first and was mated on the same days in her cycle each time.

Quick answer No, and my girls have two or three litters.

As I don't routinely blood test for ovulation, then no I cannot say any of my girls have whelped the same day from first mating.

I have had girls whelp from day 58 to 67 from first mating, usually multiple matings over as much as 6 days, only occasionally 1 mating.  Interestingly the 58 and 67 days were both from only one mating.

The rest have tended to whelp from 61 to 65 days, from the first of multiple matings.

It is a fact though that normally a bitch will whelp +/-63 days from Ovulation. 

The closest I have got to same day is the litter I have at the moment. It's the third one for this bitch. First was 59 days, second was 59 days, third was 58 days. The other bitches have varied more.

>I have also heard of other breeders stating their bitches, toy breeds, whelps every time on day 56 with pups being perfectly sized and viable

I have a toy breed which frequently has an 8 week gestation.  I wouldn't exaggerate and say every time.

However, yes 100% viable.

> I have also heard of other breeders stating their bitches, toy breeds, whelps every time on day 56 with pups being perfectly sized and viable.

It's not just Toy breeds, there are others, from what I have read.
And there's a reason for that - not that they don't need as long a gestation as others - they have exactly the same.. but other things can *appear* to give a shorter pregnancy.

There are two variables involved - Firstly the timing of the ovulation, which can be almost instantly afterwards, or even before the bitch is ready to stand. Or several days later (the sperm can stay alive for some time).

Then you have the timing of the implantation when the fertilised eggs take their place in the uterus and start forming properly. That again can vary.

I am used to breeding cats where the ovulation happens during mating or shortly afterwards (up to three days later, also varies). This means there is nowhere near the variation in gestation term seen in dogs - who will ovulate whether mated or not, and often some time before they are mated whether they stand or not.

Jap spitz are often 57 to 59 :)

i find it really interesting, thanks for your responses.
i was shocked when my girl whelped on 59, whereas the other dam i have whelped on day 62 and the pups born on day 59 were pretty much the same size ext. :)

my friend shows/breeds toy poodles (if i can say that??) and her dam sadly lost her litter as she whelped on day 55 from 1st mating, and the puppies were hairless and underdeveloped. however, i have heard of toy breeds who whelp on day 56 from first mating with fully formed puppies.

I suppose like suggested it depends on the ovulation time as to the ACTUAL full period of pregnancy.