Hi All,

Hope you don't mind me posting in here?

We're looking for a puppy to buy and have found two remaining pups bred by a family as apposed to a breeder. They've provided KC registered numbers/names but don't appear to have registered any health screening information for them. Is there anything I should be worried about buying from a hobby breeder/first time breeder?

I've asked them the relevant questions about vaccinations etc. The pups are with the mother, the father was a stud dog.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers

Well it really depends on what breed they are and why the litter was bred. Does the breeder show or work their bitch, what health tests should have been done and is the breeder a member of the breed club.

Let us know the breed and we can say what tests should have been done if any - don't worry about vaccinations plenty of time to do that when the pup is with you unless this is an older pup in which case you would want it socialised as well.

Have a look on the KC website. You can find the breed you are interested in and you should be able to track down what health tests are recommended for that breed. Then the parents should have had the appropriate tests done, with good results. The puppies themselves might only have had tests done if their breed is susceptible to any conditions that are testable for at such a young age.

Many breeders these days only have a few dogs, unlike in years gone by when there were more large scale kennels. A small scale breeder may well not have their own stud dog and will mostly use an outside dog. This is usually a good thing as it means that the breeder will have had the opportunity to choose a dog that should go well with their bitch.

Hi,

Thanks for the reply.

They're Staffordshire Bull Terrier pups.

As far as I'm aware they don't show the bitch. This is the first litter they've had. According to the seller, both parents are KC reg. They've been vet checked, but when asked for a letter they claimed not to have one.

Wormed every 3 weeks and come with their 1st and 2nd injections. Flea treated etc.

They're living in the family home, so I guess used to human contact and children visiting through the week.

Obviously this is all what they've told me in our correspondence.

The price has been reduced because they're the last two to go. I understand that buying through assured breeders is the safest option.

Thanks

How old are they?

Or may have used the dog down the road. Question them on why they used that dog. All dogs used for breeding are stud dogs.
Make sure you get registration certificates copies of health certificates etc before committing to buy and handing over any cash.

15 weeks

Ok, they said they can provide these.

What kind of process is involved with KC registration? What's the criteria for being allowed to register?

KC registration is extremely simple and straight-forward when both parents are KC-registered with no endorsements on their pedigrees.   I've always sent off the registration forms once the puppies eyes are open (no particular reason for this time frame - but always did) - and generally the documentation for the new owners was back well before the puppies left for their new homes.   Only the breeder can register the puppies with the Kennel Club.

You say that you have gone for a family-bred puppy rather than getting one from a breeder - but this really is skewed thinking.   The people who have bred the puppy, using their own dogs are no less breeders than someone who shows or works their dogs, either in the show ring or obedience trials!

There are other registries which "register" puppies - but apart from a pretty certificate, it should not necessarily be relied upon ...

BTW - from personal experience, I would strongly advise AGAINST taking two puppies from the same litter (or even two puppies of the same age).    It's not just double training, it's double training squared - and you find that the puppies form a bigger bond between themselves than with you.

Ok, thanks for the reply, but I think you've misinterpreted what I have written.

I didn't choose family bred puppy over a proper breeder. They were local, right time, breed etc. We contacted several breeders but they didn't have any pups.

Also, we're only looking to get one puppy as a family dog. Not interested in showing or breeding etc.

> I understand that buying through assured breeders is the safest option.
>
>

It can be but not necessarily always. I am not a KCAB but offer well reared puppies & many of the same things assured breeders do(& always have).

I have to say that just because these are the last remaining puppies that the price shouldnt be reduced. I have had extream difficulty in getting correct homes for my recent litter & they are 4 months old. I would not reduce the price, just to sell them, they have cost money to rear the extra time..if anything they ought to be dearer(they are not though, same price as an 8 week old).

OK - I understand!    I would suggest that you read up the breed standard/health checks (not just vet checks) for staffordshire bull terriers, and check whether the two dogs are clear - and ask to see copies of the parents' pedigrees.

Please be careful as its not just health tests but also temperament .
The health tests are HC-HSF4 and L-2HGA and should be Hereditarily clear with both tests.
HTH

Nessa

p.s the tests that are yearly are PHPV and PPSC.:-)

Thanks all. Advise taken on board.

If the parents have been tested as Nessa pointed out the results of these tests will be on the KC registration certificates of the individual puppies against the parents names.

If both parents were clear for the two DNA tests then against the puppies registered name it will show hereditary clear for that condition.

Unfortunately the Staffie is the most over-bred and casually bred breed out there, with most bred in the way this litter is, the owners do not have the necessary knowledge of the dogs behind the parents to make good breeding decisions.

Every good first time breeder should be relying not only on their own research but be backed by mentors within their breed who do know all about the good and bad points of the grandparents great grandparents etc.

To do this I would expect them to be involved with the breed club/s and in a non working breed being shown.

Anyone else is just slinging two dogs together to produce puppies, which may or may not have good health, temperaments and typical breed characteristics.

There are lot so less serious health issues that a good breeder will take into account in addition to official tests.  the tendency to Demodectic mange, slipping patellas etc etc.

15 weeks

At that age you have far more to worry about than the necessary KC registration, health tests of parents, worming and vaccinations. At 15 weeks of age the breeder MUST have started socialising the pups, such as trained them to walk on a lead, taken them out and about to get used to people (of all ages and looks), other dogs, other animals, traffic, travelling in a car, all sorts of different sights and noises etc. This is an absolute MUST as if you buy a 15 week old pup that has spent its entire life at the breeder's home and garden, you will most likely be buying a dog with a lot of problems, whether they show up now or in future.  Any breeder can get stuck with pups until older, and then we must start training and socialising them. The most vital socialisation period for a puppy is roughly between 8 and 14 weeks of age.

Yes I would expect them to have been to training classes etc.

If DNA is done then it would come back on test as clear not hereditarily clear.

Nessa

You misunderstand, I was referring to the puppies registration certificates, which there is no excuse for them not to be to hand.

If parents are clear then the puppies DNA status is annotated hereditary clear (though of course one or both parents could also be hereditary clear if their parents were tested clear).