He is completely sterile, no sperm at all, dead or alive.

That's a shame :-( At least now you know for certain what the problem was.

Thanks Harley. :D

I'm glad I had it done, mainly so I know hes ok. Thank you everyone for your advice, its been a stressful few days trying to do the right thing and with all the conflicting advice. We can move on now. I do find it frustrating, especially in his breed, hundreds of untested dogs having pups, even from known carriers. And my stunning boy with all 5 tests done wont ever have pups, but nothing I can do about it now.

Oh no :(

Is it the same breed as in your profile pic? I was reading a discussion about another breed (not in your pic) that is having male sterility issues. One suggestion was to have a thyroid test, and also send blood to Dr Jean Dodds in the USA (her thyroid tests are more thorough than UK ones).

How disappointing for you, Darkstorm, but at least now you know for sure :(

> He is completely sterile, no sperm at all, dead or alive.

Oh what a shame. Did they give you any idea why this might be?

You did the right thing, such a shame it gave you an answer which you didn't want to hear :-(

He said he had never produced sperm, and never would. Just one of those things I spose.

So sorry to hear this but pleased you had the test done so you can just enjoy him.

How disappointing.  I'm really sorry.  But I suppose in a way knowing takes the stress and worry away too ........ :)

:-( Thats a shame, I'm really sorry. xxx

My vet checked my boy for me and he is fine, now sired a litter.

Yes it does. I've told the breeder who wanted to go ahead and try again next season anyway, and I think she's relieved I ignored her and tested him, and is now planning to come back later and use my youngster. It is hard when ppl are convincing you its just mother nature and saying things like even 2 proven dogs can miss and it doesn't mean hes sterile, but my gut was still telling me something was wrong.

Thanks again for all your help.

> My vet checked my boy for me and he is fine, now sired a litter.

I tried to use a lovely veteran champion male who had only ever produced one litter more by luck than design, and then the poor bitch lost all but two I think.

Anyway the boy really hadn't a clue, would just hop on and off all the time.  Eventually got a tie by holding him in place so he didn't dismount, but by this time the willing maiden bitch was going over or just being polite.

I tried him with her mother the next season, but as the owner lives in the North East and I in the South West, suggested a sperm test would e worth taking. 

Her small animal practise vets sort of threw their hands up in horror and said they wouldn't do it, but if she brought in a sample they would test it!!!  Apart from anything, surely any test would be pointless by the time she got to the vet even if she managed to get a sample by herself. 

Surely a vet shouldn't too squeamish, or was it a case of one of the disapproving of breeding vets???

Needless to say another long wasted journey and pleasant stay resulted in no puppies, such a waste.

It often happens in numerically small breeds that a male may not have any bitches suitable for him to be sued on until a generation or two makes them less related to him, but by then many will be too clueless or even sterile.

> Apart from anything, surely any test would be pointless by the time she got to the vet

At our hospital, gentlemen do not produce on site :).  As long as the specimen is delivered to our laboratory within two hours the specimen is viable for testing.
Can't say I blame a veterinary practice not wishing to obtain a specimen unless they do so regularly.  Many will not have even seen a mating so not sure I would want them to attempt it unless they had someone known to be competent.
Actually, for the cost of a cheap microscope it would be fairly easy to check the actual specimen yourself for general signs of mobility, morphology etc.

> Can't say I blame a veterinary practise not wishing to obtain a specimen

Why they are a Vet, not a squeamish lay person.  They are trained to take samples of urine, blood etc, we owners are not.

Even with a microscope I wouldn't know what a normal sample looked like.

Aren't they trained to do AI etc, or did I dream those films with vet students arms up cows bums etc?

> Aren't they trained to do AI etc, or did I dream those films with vet students arms up cows bums etc?

I am sure a lot of them will have experience in delivering AI in large animals but I doubt many will have obtained the semen as these bulls are kept in specialist units. 
I don't think it is a question of being squeamish it is a question of knowing what you are doing to ensure the safety of the animal and the person in the case of some animals.
Like you say, they train to take blood etc and no doubt have plenty of opportunities to maintain their competencies.  Outside a specialist unit I doubt they would get much opportunity to maintain any competency in this area unless they have a goodly number of breeders on their books, even then these tests are probably not required very often.

>Even with a microscope I wouldn't know what a normal sample looked like.

I think you would :)  I looked at a few samples when we used to perform AIH at our hospital and its fairly clear when the numbers are good, they appear normal with heads on tails and nice straight tails going in a purposeful forward direction and not moving in circles or lying still and that they are generally not asking directions in a properly male fashion :)