I have a real dilemma here at the moment and I need some down to earth advice please. I have two dogs (med toy breed and lurcher) and a bitch (med type working) that has just had her first litter. I have worked really hard on planning this litter for the last two years, all health tests done plus some extra ones, own kennel name etc, working towards AB status too. The total aim of this really carefully planned first litter was to breed a girl for my Mum to have and train this time. I was then going to keep a girl from the next litter for myself when I lost my elderly small breed (his breed are very likely to suffer from MVD :( )so I still would have only three dogs. My mum lives on her own and is coming up to retirement age and wanted to start doing competitive obedience (which is what I do) and have a dog that she could train to do pets as therapy/reading buddies and just have some company, something she has wanted for a very long time.   This is a pure breed but of a working strain so neither of us show.

My girl was mated in March this year with perfect match for her but missed due to the timing of the IDEXX tests.  So she was mated again at the end of August with the same dog, using a different blood test company with same day test results.

About three weeks after my girl was mated, my elderly grandmother, had a fall and broke her hip and was diagnosed with leukemia.  By the time it was all operated on etc, my girl was confirmed in whelp and was five weeks along.  My mum was spending every spare minute traveling from Essex (where my Mum lives) to where my Grandmother was in hospital (Wiltshire) some 3 hour-ish journey.  In the middle of all this the pups were born and in the litter was the perfect pup for my mum and my pick of the litter in every way, calmer, more gentle and more aware of people than the other pups. I live in South Cheshire, so a long way from either of them. My grandmother didnt recover well and although came home briefly is now in a nursing home and deteriorating very quickly. My mum is in a complete emotional and mental tailspin and because we lost Grandad a couple of years ago, is facing the fact that we will lose Grandma soon too.  She reluctantly and sadly made the decision to pull out of having the pup completely as she felt she just couldnt cope at the moment and is just in bits.  So I put an advert up for the whole litter which wasnt the plan at all and I have wrestled with it in my head a lot. 

The pup concerned quickly found a new potential owner who was grilled with questions and I felt really upset that she was going to have to leave after all, she was meant to go to my Mum. The whole of the new family met the pup and their affluent lifestyle meant that she would have had lots of opportunities and they had all the 'correct answers'.  However during a email conversation two weeks ago when the pups were 6 weeks old, he let slip a few things that I then investigated and with which I became increasingly unhappy. On further exchange of emails and during a couple of telephone calls he became quite abusive and nasty and became a completely different character entirely which was not one I wanted for any of my pups whatsoever. I returned his deposit immediately, explaining why in detail and took legal advice as to my standing.  He has since stopped all correspondence which is good.

However the pups are due to go to their new homes after Christmas and I will be left with the perfect pup whom I admit I adore. Its almost as if she is exactly the right pup just at the wrong time, my sons and I are all really attached to her and she is such a wonderful character, she would fit in perfectly, its just the practical things that I cannot get my head around.  My heart says just keep her and deal with the difficulties and consequences later but my head is saying this:

Will there be another girl like this in any future litter - if you breed to keep one (which is what I intended to do, even if it was for my Mum) and there isnt the right sex or colour that you needed, is there always one or two in every single litter that you feel like this about that you find really really hard to let go anyway?
Not sure that I can deal with four dogs
Ive never had two bitches in the house before, there is only 2 and a half years between them - will they fight just due to hormones?
I cannot walk four dogs at once, I normally walk the two big ones and then elderly dog gets walked when he is able to.
My plan was to have a pup later when I had lost my elderly little man, so I would still only have three dogs.
My tenancy agreement (Private rental) has been expanded from two dogs to three already, not sure that four will be accepted but most probably will be
I have a tiny car, could only fit two dogs in the back as it is
I am a single parent to two teenagers who dont help much so could I give four dogs the right amount of attention, I work part time in a school so have all the holidays off.

Any constructive ideas would be helpful, both for and against, do I keep her? Do I find her another owner that will have her on a 1-2-1 but always worry/wonder about her? I dont think its an option for my Mum to have the pup later, she is just not coping well at all. 

What would you do?

I would keep her and run her on as the situation your mum is in at the moment won't last forever and I am sure when things settle she will be really open to taking her otherwise if nit she sounds a lovely pup you have all bonded with her so I say keep her even if your mum doesn't end up being able to take her on :-)

Yep i'd agree with LJS

Keep her she sounds one in a million! 

I don't breed but I have two working bred mid size bitches (springer and a beagle type with extra leg)  I fit both of them and my house mates staff x in the back seat of a ford ka!  And I regularly walk all 3 plus my OH's shih tsu together.  It is possible and as others have said your mum may be ready to take before very much longer

Plus puppy will be able to walk with oldie as wont be going far for a while.

Keep her it is meant to be.  I had my best bitch back at 8 1/2 months, and thank my lucky stars. 

I had tried to be sensible in letting her go even though I knew she was what I wanted to keep, but I wanted to space the dogs out more, she is now 13 and my most successful bitch, and producer.

Even with a repeat mating you can get totally different pups and may not get what you wanted, or something may happen and you can't breed from the bitch again (had this happen with my most recent litter, had meant to keep one from the next litter, but in the event she was spayed as the whelping was difficult, and I kept my current pup with only a 15 month age gap between her and her cousin.

I now have 6 from 6 months to 13 years, but the youngest 4 are two pairs closer together (15 and 17 months) than I like and under 6 years.

I walk all together on lead using head-collars and they are a medium size (20kg) well built collie size breed.

I would keep her as well. I very much believe what my Granny used to say. "What's for you will no' go by you"

Yes - another one to agree.  Keep her - otherwise you will always wonder.  A year from now either you or your mum will look at her and remember just how close you came to letting her go . . .

I secretly think Janice may have been hoping for so many of the answers she has had so far :-)

Thank you for your replies, you see that is what my heart is telling me, dont let her go, it could be fate that she is still here, we all love her very much already, however the practical things are really not helping. Ultimately I am on my own with the boys and I cannot walk four dogs together, however as you say my elderly cavvie has roughly the same walking requirements as the pup for the first year at least.

Doesnt help that I have also been a guide dog puppy walker and only ever foster pups for rescues, so house is pretty much set up for pups. However keeping two bitches that are only 2 and a half years apart in age? Could this lead to issues even if the breed is generally not known for aggression. Do hormones kick things off?

Do I really want four dogs?  Agghghgh

Actually 4 dogs are easier than 3 IMO

If the breed isn't known for aggression then I wouldn't forsee a problem. I have 5 girls, two in season at the moment, all live together (no kennels here) and I can honestly say I have never had a wrong word between them

Yes four is the same as three so go for it.

I have had bitches mostly about 2 to 3 years between ages and have only had one issue with a rescue bitch having moments with one of my grown up from a puppy bitch but it was trigger based and not a full on dislike. It can happen with bitches occasionally but I am sure yours will be fine if they all grow up together :-)

What a predicament....... poor you.

IMO the pick of the litter should never be wasted, it needs to stay as a potential for part of a future breeding programme via show or working owners, it's a crime to waste the pick of the litter. ;-)

If this bitch who you favour is not going on to be homed with such owners, then I would suggest that you keep her for now and as the time is not right for yourself, then you keep her with the thought in mind that she is for your mother, once you are all over the worst part of the grieving process of losing your grandmother your mum will need something to focus on............ getting into competitions with this pup and having something in common with her daughter is just what she will need. :-)

I'm going to disagree with everyone else in breaking from your lifeplan we sit and think things through and work out the best time for a dog, you've done that even knowing you were having this litter so stick to it, 4 dogs may well be too much for you to handle right now, so don't put yourself under pressure long term, I would make this a short term plan, rear her for now and then let her go to your mum within the next 6 months.

You may well have another bitch/dog in another litter that you also fall in love with, so there is a chance that your original plans can fall into place, if another litter does not produce one as good at least this one will be with your family competing and you won't regret it, and if she turns out to be a great example she may well also be able to be included in future breeding plans, so again another plus in keeping her close to you.

I agree with others - sounds like you were meant to keep her, I'm a great believer in things happening for a reason. I think you will always regret it if you don't :)

I have 6 all bitches. 

2 1/2 year age gaps are fine as far as I am concerned, the 15 and 17 months age gaps have been more of an issue re having two madcap youngsters at a time. 

The older pair are now 4 1/2 and 6 and not a problem, the older one has had three litters and the second is shortly having her second, so any issues would have come to light by now due to small age gap.

If they are only medium size I can't foresee an issue with walking four, as I alone manage with 6, and you sound younger than me.

Even numbers are actually better as you can sometimes take out two and still leave two with company.

She sounds perfect, I'd keep her,  you'll adapt!

I would probably keep her but I think there is always something in the litter you feel that way about.
i disagree about 3-4 being no bother.  I've had 9 dogs at the one time, which was far too stressful but fun at the time.  I recently got my numbers down to 3 which was perfect but decided to take on another large breed so am back up to 4.  I don't like having 4.  3 was much easier.  3 didn't seem such a houseful.  But...I've got 4 for the next few years so I will make the best of it but it does stress me out sometimes.

I think a lot depends on the dogs themselves - I always say that my boy is more trouble than my 3 girls put together, I love him to bits but he's so independent :-D

Some things are just meant to be. It sounds like you are an exceptionally sensible person that would cope admirably with another dog because you are simply very responsible and caring. It's a bit like when I never thought I'd cope with more than 1 child and now cannot imagine not having 3, plus 10 dogs!

It honestly honestly sounds like you'd really regret letting her go in the near future. I would definitely hold onto her for a few months and see if you bond as well as it sounds like you will.

It's all very well thinking you could have one from another litter later on but there is the very real chance you may not get the chance again.

I definitely think you should keep her x

I'm with the majority, keep her at least for now. Perhaps tell your mum that her options are open for a few months, see if she feels up to having the puppy perhaps once she's fully housetrained. But of course eventually you will bond so much that you won't want her even to go to your mum. But although going from 3 to 4 was a bit awkward for me, mainly it was because my two younger ones are quite close in age, so it was almost as bad as having 2 puppies (did that once, never again!!). Your oldie can be walked with the puppy at least for now, and even when the puppy can do longer walks than the oldie, there's no reason why you can't do a short walk every now and then when the oldie feels up to joining you.

I was in a similar situation, my mum was to have a puppy but her situation changed and could not have her.
She is still here :) and took me from 3 to 4 dogs.
Mine are all girls and the cap between the two youngest ones is 1.5 years. My girls are 5, 3.5, 2 and 6 months.
I would have liked a bigger cap between the two youngest as the second youngest is mad immature one!
The two older ones have had few issues when in season (hormonal and all have seasons at the same time) but they are imports so have not grown up together and never have they had big nasty fights and are fine when not in season (both have also had pups so hormones have been flying in this house at times, but no issues there, just season times). 
Although 2 girls from the litter went to homes where they will hopefully continue the line, I had to keep something to myself or what would have been the point of the litter? I had the puppies temperament tested and ended up keeping the "easiest calmer" puppy...

My two are 15 months apart.  Hard in some ways but I was pretty much still in puppy mode when I got the second and she has been the easier puppy anyway.  The 2.5 year old is still madder and less mature than the 15 month pup!  They don't scrap neither is aggressive anyway and have a mutual understanding about food and treats - you don't touch mine and I won't touch yours unless you leave it unguarded!

If she is meant for you it will work out and if not then she will be perfect for your mum when the time comes.

It does sound as if you shouldn't rush into making a decision - I understand your concerns about going from 3 to 4 dogs but I'm going to agree with many of the others that it might be sensible to keep her.  At least for now

Realistically you're not going to want to be looking for a home at this time of year.  Christmas is hard enough without adding a difficult emotional decision into the equation
2.5 years is a pretty good age gap and there's no reason to assume you'll get problems as she matures
You already do two different walks a day to accommodate your oldie

If you can afford the extra costs associated with having her then perhaps there's no reason not to to try...

As time goes on you'll probably find it easier to split the dogs according to their fitness levels and exercise needs.  There's no doubt that walking three or four dogs together requires manners, good training, and eyes in the back of your head if you're letting them off lead, but it isn't hard.  I regularly walk my three on long walks with a mix of close to heel and off lead exercise.  Actually having 3 dogs from which to choose your pups walking partner is quite an advantage.  You'll be doing a lot of 1:1 training with the pup but each day she'll be able to do a short period of walking with your dog of choice.  Some days you'll want your puddle confident dog, other days you'll want the best mannered, traffic aware, most bombproof etc.  It's great when your existing dogs will model the behaviours you want!!

It's a hard decision to grapple with and there's probably no easy answer but I suspect you have to choose the course of action you can most easily live with.  Things may change with your mum over the next year too...  Good luck with your decision making xx

We had a similar situation, mum was in whelp when we found out we were expecting child no2, sensible head on we will keep from her next year etc etc...

Favourite girl who stood out to me straight away and by 2 weeks, she had a name and I was saying to OH how lovely she was and how she is a toy breed dont cost too much to feed etc etc, he was really stern at first and said no. She was advertised and a real show prospect, several buyers and familys came forward but were timewasters or because i am an unknown in the pug world didnt think she was worth the risk as a show dog if she didnt mature so went to more well known breeders and affixs. Due to this she was one of the last 2 remaining and her Brother had an eye injury, which resulted in him losing his eye so he is staying in the family. My OH dad who adores the ground he walks on and who has been having alot of medical issues meaning he is unable to work for the past 4 years so has really brought some happiness and purpose to his life again.

We lost their mother when she was 12 weeks complete shock and cause unknown, her fate is sealed and she is staying put.....
and she is a promising youngster for her show debut in feb, if i can get her to calm down and keep 4 feet on the ground!

Dont always expect next year to go how you plan, best laid plans go to waste.

id say keep her too but youve got to be %100% sure!! but if it was me she wouldnt be going anywhere :) x

Just an update on this really, there is a possibility of my Sister having her as a family dog. She has always been a cat person (bred burmans and got UK Grand Premier which was the first one ever in that colour) two of her three 17 year old cats have died in the last couple of months so we have been talking a lot about her having the last girl and doing what my mum was going to and competing in obedience.

They are all coming to see her on Boxing Day, so we shall see what happens.  A lot of it depends on how my small nephews (6 and 3) react, although they are very animal friendly children - must be in their genes.  Five adults, three children and 3 dogs and eleven pups Boxing Day lol, will be buffet food all day I think!

I am sure you will do the right thing by her, enjoy the bedlam.

If at all possible I would keep her! there may not be one the same in the next litter. If it got to much your mom may! on seeing her and if the worse happens to your nan, would be an excellent companion for her, also just what she may need when on her own. A reason to carry on.
Also remember all your puppies belong to you!! untill all the money is paid and the dog signed over.

What happened during the visit?

I took my sister, her hubby and her two children out for a walk with the dogs on Boxing Day. It was raining, we went past a pond and my girl took a flying leap (as they do) straight into all that lovely water.  I thought if my sister wont do rainy walks and cant deal with labradors jumping about in water then there was no hope.  Didnt start off well when she asked if I had an umbrella lol then squealed when the swamp monster exited the pond. She didnt like the wet dog smell and just couldnt get her head around the fact that dogs needed to be walked every day come hell or high water.  Needless to say pupster is still here...however she firmly has her paws under the table and we shall just see if she finds a new home quickly.....cos she might just get too old to rehome you know.....and then she might just have to stay here.....;)

Sounds to me that she is in the perfect home now!