After many years and months of local felines walking past my openplan driveway (and coming in the front garden),
my powerful male dog "lost the plot" when eating his dinner, in the house, raced to the backdoor, opened it with his paw,
and ran around to the 6ft high side gate and jumped over it, racing down the lane after two white cats, who were walking
down the lane (public footpath, privately-owned lane) with their owner and her, unleashed terrier/cross/ShiTzu dog.  He has
also been into my garden/driveway many many times, peeing and attacking the side gate.    The cats have been annoying my
dogs for months:  they sit in the garden/lane/driveway, as cats do - to tantalize the dogs.

My dog legged it after the cats, who went (safely) into the hedge/brambles, and the small dog then attacked my male.
My male was bitten on the wrist (not badly - just a couple of holes) but I found out today, that he had retaliated, flung
the small dog and has inflicted a puncture wound on him.

Who is liable for the vet bill for the smaller dog ? 

I will add that I have now put the side gate up to 8ft high, and commissioned a local contractor to make me a new gate up to
8 ft high.  My dog had not previously, in the last 7 years, jumped the side gate.  I have also bought a PIR controlled ultrasound
cat deterrant gadget.

Does anyone have any further advice ?

>Who is liable for the vet bill for the smaller dog ? 

In the old days, before today's blame culture, it was traditional to pay the vet bill of the other person's animal when there was a fight. That way you were paying for the damage inflicted by your own animal.

Training your dogs to ignore the cats will make things much less tense for you and your dogs.

For a dog to 'loose the plot' whilst inside his home, just at the presence of a cat outside, is not a very relaxed state of mind for the dog to be in. If you are less tense about the cats, it will have a postive effect on your dogs behaviour towards the cats.

> The cats have been annoying my dogs for months:  they sit in the garden/lane/driveway, as cats do - to tantalize the dogs.

To be thinking like this, the cats must be annoying you, your dogs will pick up on your annoyance.

Most dogs love a chance of chasing a cat, even those of us who have dogs and cats know too well that best friends indoors can still  have different rules outside and chase their family member if they move too fast on the fences and walls. My cats learn to walk slowly and the chase is not on.

I agree with ML that you're very cross about the cats and dog coming onto your territory and your dog probably is picking up on that, although I'm sure he enjoys a good old bark at them being there too, you must use distraction techniques or put your dog in a room where he can not see you and go out with a water pistol and shoo them away, a few water squirts and the cats will stop coming your way.

Now, as to your problem, both dogs were off lead and the little one struck first according to your reply, so on first impressions it's both your faults for having dogs off lead and not under proper control, if the little one bit first your dog is not responsible for retaliating, therefore you are not responsible for the vet bills. Does this dog often bite other dogs, is there a history?

However, if your dog went onto the owners private land which I'm confused about - as it is a public footpath part on a private lane, is this the owner of the private lane? If so, then sorry, it  would be your fault if not on the public footpath bit and your bill, as your dog was not under control on private land whoever took the first bite.

Things like this often depend on how we are with our neighbours and the history behind our dogs..... for the sake of peace, if the owner is asking for vet bills it's entirely up to you if this did not happen on private land.  Morally, I would probably feel it were all my fault for my dog getting out and in his heightened state frightening the smaller dog and owner, I would most likely use my insurance to pay for the bill, although it depends on what type of insurance you may have, if you don't have insurance it could be a very hefty bill so you might only wish to offer if the owner wishes to take it further.

Police won't get involved with this, unless the owner complains that your dog made her feel threatened, it's a moral issue or one which will require a smalls claims court if on private land, via the owner.

Glad you have made your fence yet higher, sure your dog thought he was having a wail of a time, little does he know....... try to distract his attention from the cats in future, but at the end of the day he is just being a dog. ;-) And cats love to sit in driveways. :-)

> Morally, I would probably feel it were all my fault for my dog getting out and in his heightened state frightening the smaller dog and owner,

While I can sympathise, I feel the above is probably the crux of the matter. Unless it is a designated highway, there is no legal obligation for the other dog to be on a lead, and indeed even off-lead could still be said to be under control in some circumstances. However as your dog escaped, and you weren't present, then yours would probably be deemed to be out of control, unfortunately, and you would be liable.

A friend of mine was involved in a very awkward situation a few months ago, when her dogs escaped from a garden when she was visiting a friend and allegedly cornered a cat, allegedly causing it injury. There were no witnesses, and the cat's injuries were not consistent with a dog attack BUT it could have injured itself in an attempt to escape (fractured jaw). The cat owner had no insurance and neither were the dogs insured, not even for Third Party. The cat's owners were all for suing her for the vet's bill but the lack of witnesses didn't help. However being a responsible dog owner, and the fact that her dogs were deemed to be out of her control at the time, she agreed to pay as much towards the cat's vet bills as she could afford.

For a dog to 'loose the plot' whilst inside his home, just at the presence of a cat outside, is not a very relaxed state of mind for the dog to be in. If you are less tense about the cats, it will have a postive effect on your dogs behaviour towards the cats.

With all due respect, it doesn't work like that for all dogs. Some are just born cat killers, no matter what. Having 20 dogs and 40 cats and having kept the two species together since 1980, the thought had never even occurred to me that a dog might not get on with cats and actually want to harm them. When I had a 20 month old dog returned to me the thought didn't even as much as enter my head that cats could be problem. His mum had had cats inside the whelping box whilst giving birth. Yet this dog spent weeks not being able to relax -I swear I never saw him lay down or sleep as all he did was stand and stare at the cats all the time. I still didn't see a problem, all he did was look. Until after a few months when he suddenly grabbed a cat, shook her, broke two of her ribs and punctured her chest, all within seconds. He's not been able to be near cats since as he lunges instantly.

I blamed it on him being away from me for those vital months, even though he had been here until 14 weeks so had had cats around him for those first weeks.  So I still didn't consider it possible for any of my dogs to want to chase cats.  Yet a 2 year old bitch of mine, who has had cats around her since the day she was born, has never NOT lived here, is getting more and more obsessed, the the point of not being able to relax in the house. I had guinea pigs in a cage in the kitchen from before she was born but at the age of one she suddenly managed to get the cage down, I was in the kitchen within 20 seconds but she had managed to kill both the guinea pigs by then. Her two litter sisters, one of which has been here from birth, one which came back at 14 months, have NO such issues at all.

It is an interesting situation!   The cats are allowed out all the time by their owner, who likes them to have "freedom" and we all live on a privately owned (by a third party) farm lane, on which runs a public footpath.   We all have access rights for ourselves and for driving sheep, cattle, etc...  no mention is made in the deeds about cats!

For several years the neighbours have let their dogs get out on the lane and many, many dogs (and cats) have run into my driveway, which does not have gates due to the narrowness of the lane (one would never get the car in and out if there were gates) and many of the dogs, including the current one, delight in going up to the side gate and barking/attacking my dogs (if they happen to be in the garden) by the sidegate to the rear garden.    With the owner's consent, I used to turn the garden hose on this particular dog, to try to train him to stay away, but he did not mind getting hosed - possibly even liked it.   Owner does not agree with controlling him, although, she did take my recommendation to try to train him to recall to a dog whistle.  

He was running around the lane loose, with the cats, and the owner came down the lane when my dog (eating his dinner in the house, suddenly saw them all outside,  "spooked" and) dashed to the kitchen door, opened it with his foot and shot round the house and leapt the 6ft high side gate, which he had never done before.   My dogs have never been allowed to stray on the lane and surrounding fields, have been contained in a garden fenced to between 6 and 8 feet, and are well-trained, obedient dogs.   They do not like cats, however, and this dog was bitten by a sick feral tom cat in woods a few years ago and the resulting infection in his jaw bone took over 2 years to clear up.   The cat had attacked him - not the other way round!

The smaller dog (according to the owner) just raced along the lane and attacked my dog - biting him on the "wrist" just above his foot and my dog, who is a big, powerful dog - but not a fighter - responded by picking up the smaller one, shaking him and flinging him.   It was literally all happening in a few seconds, and, by the time I realised my dog had got out, I grabbed a lead and went into the driveway, called the dog, and he came straight back.

No-one has asked me to pay/contribute to the other dog's vet bill and I believe he will go to the vet today.   I would estimate his bill to be around £40-50 for a consultation and antibiotics.  Not worth an insurance claim.

Meanwhile, I have added panels to the side gate to make it up to 8ft and am putting up the other adjacent field fence to 8ft.  The cats still try to get into the garden and I have bought another ultrasonic cat deterrent for my driveway.   I am ordering a new, stronger 7 to 8ft high side gate.

I have put up a polite notice, in the past, asking dog owners to keep their dogs leashed and walk quietly past this row of cottages, but most ignored it and it was soon removed, and we continue to have dogs coming into our garden and pee outside the door/windows, do droppings in the garden and attack our gates/doors.  

The probable solution (no - electric fence by a public footpath won't do!) is to move again!

Only in fear, do I walk along this lane with my two dogs, leashed always, as the small dog (above) is often around loose, and runs at us.  For the last few months, I have found it expedient to take them in the car, for a short afternoon walk, further out in the countryside away from this dog.   I have explained to the owners that if and when he attacks, I am going to have a job hanging on to my two (joint weigh 130lbs or so) if they do not like him attacking at close quarters.   In the past, I have had to shout at the owners to call him back, so I can get back along the lane to my house, without him attacking.     Several terriers and terrier crosses have grabbed my dog's throat when we have been out on walks and, as a result, I have had two badly broken fingers, torn thumb ligaments and torn knee ligaments/cartilage, from holding my own dogs, when others (out of control, but most owners think it is funny!) attack.   Consequently, I now walk virtually only in remote, muddy woods, where we meet wild animals, rather than dogs!!

Thanks for the input:  interesting situation and I will "wait and see"

  

> The probable solution (no - electric fence by a public footpath won't do!) is to move again!

You'd need to check the legalities of it, if being used in an open plan area, but you can get devices that squirt water that are motion activated (we were looking into them to stop cats stealing our pond fish).

> eating his dinner in the house, suddenly saw them all outside

would it be possible to obscure his veiw in any way, either by a blind at the window/door or some screening (bamboo?)/solid fencing in the garden?

My last dog was highly reactive to things outside, he was very territorial  and would also chase any cat with a view to catching it that he could (this was not a territorial thing - he'd go for cats whilst out on a walk), blocking his veiw of things helped a lot. We put a solid 6ft fence all around the garden so he couldn't see the things he would react to which helped a lot re. cats (would previously chuck himself at the chain link fence at a cat).

> we continue to have dogs coming into our garden and pee outside the door/windows, do droppings in the garden

We've an open-plan front lawn, it's always littered with other peoples dogs poop Why??? I don't understand how somebody could allow thier dog to walk on somebody elses garden in the first place, let alone leave poop on it! I sometimes fantasize about finding out where the owners live and leave one of my dogs huge steaming motions on thier doorstep - (I'd never do that, but it's a good stress-relieveing day dream!).

We all have access rights for ourselves and for driving sheep, cattle, etc...  no mention is made in the deeds about cats!

That will be because in law, you cannot make any orders about cats. They are classed much the same as wild animals -it's no more possible to ban a cat from going somewhere then it is to ban a squirrel or rabbit.

> We've an open-plan front lawn, it's always littered with other peoples dogs poop mad Why???

Careful placement of more motion-sensored water guns?

2 Things I would like to add.
1.  Cats have no rules or liability.  They are free to roam wherever, whenever.  Sounds great right?  But with that, it means you can run my cat over and leave him to die at the side of the road with no liability either.  Swings and roundabouts.  If your dog had caught the cat and injured/killed him, there is nothing the owner can do about it.
2.  I wouldn't think you are liable for the vet bill.  Her dog was off lead same as yours so no responsibility.

> Her dog was off lead same as yours so no responsibility

? My neighbour's dog used to run out onto the road and attack dogs whether they were on the lead or not (nearly killed a puppy) - I don't think people around here would be very pleased if you told her that she had no responsibility :) She did comment to me that it was the owner's fault for walking past her house ..... :(

She has finally put some sort of fence up and the attacks have stopped, I think (hope). I never walk that way just in case :(

Six foot or eight foot....it won't make a difference!  My blackie can scale more than that quite easily.  Try putting a section (the top 1.5 = 2 foot) that leans inwards;  if that fails, get a length of plastic pipe, cut in to it lengthwise and slide over a single strand of wire nailed to the top....this will stop him getting a purchase as it will rotate.

Carry a big stick, pet corrector spray and/or water gun to deter the terrier.  

Oh Daisy, I think you got me wrong.  I don't think it's right!  But I'm pretty sure that if both dogs are off leash, then BOTH are out-of-control.  Had the little terrier been on-lead, it would be a different story.

AND, if I'm really honest, it sounds like OP's dog has maybe terrorised that lane for a while?  I wouldn't be happy with that dog living in my street.  Sounds a bit manic when it is so wound up over cats/other dogs, that it sounds like a danger TBH.

> I wouldn't be happy with that dog living in my street

It's a GD :( They live on a ramshackle smallholding and for a long time made no effort to fence the place. The dog used to wander over onto our land, fortunately it was at times when my two were indoors. We have since fenced our side. They have put some very low 'fencing' (odds and ends of mesh etc - no higher than about 2-3 feet at best) amongst the hedge the road side. This does seem to keep the dog in, but when they go out they leave the dogs outside and I do worry that one day the GD will find a way out :( I know this is a horrible thing to say, but the GD is at least 5 and so, hopefully, won't be around for too many years :( :( There are lots of people in my village who won't walk their dogs up our road which says it all :(

My new PIR-activated cat deterrent in front garden/driveway is working a treat!  Peace reigns here, dogs have calmed down, and the puddycats are perfectly happy going elsewhere, i.e. in the field beside my rear garden (my fencing is between 6 and 8 ft and will shortly be raised to be 8ft all round, plus little thingies, not spikes, on fabric, put on top.   New 8ft side gate - smart wooden one - will be under construction and fitted in a few days' time.

No-one has come round to ask me to pay for injured dog's vet bill: but he was off-leash (doing his thing, as per usual) and just seized the opportunity to "have a go" in person at my much bigger and stronger dog, to prove that he is "just as much man as a big dog".
He now has time to reflect on his philosophy, but being part terrier, may still be very feisty.

The nice man at local electrical supplier is also going to help me rig up a PIR detector for my much-more powerful fox deterrent, so I can aim that into the field boundary by my rear garden.

All our windows overlook the front area or the field, so we cannot block everything out.   The cats have plenty of places to go:  they do not have to be snooping round my property!

AND, if I'm really honest, it sounds like OP's dog has maybe terrorised that lane for a while?

Ditto,

Unfortunately, because the terrier x has always been allowed free reign on the lane it believes that this is it's territory, and is defending it, something the owner should have reigned in instead of letting the dog get above his station and just wander around on other people's property, most of us would not let our dogs annoy neighbours like this.

I have a similar problem with a farm dog (also terrier) left to roam lose, with two others who are fine, but the terrier may or may not go for some of the dogs walking through the land on a public footpath. It is important for the dogs to be socialised well with each other from puppyhood, the terrier in my case does not bother my girl or any dogs I may walk past with as they have known each other from pups and been allowed to mingle and tbh a quick shhhhhh from me stops the terrier if he decides to have a growl. But, I have seen him go for other dogs.

In our OP's case she is responsibly putting her dogs on lead to walk through the territory which also is her dogs too, mixed messages for all concerned, perhaps if they had also run free as pups and been encouraged to be friends with the terrier neither would have issues right now, also having the dogs bark at each other through the fence is building bad blood, I don't know how old the dogs are and whether that can be fixed?

Obviously the cats also view all properties in that area as their territory too, animals do not understand, fences and garden rules and cats are free to roam wherever. If the terrier x is bothering other properties it should be contained on it's own property tbh, that may well be something to discuss with the owner as she does not own the lane or the land surrounding either, if she did different story.

Everyone with dogs has to think of their neighbours. I don't think it is now unreasonable to ask the terrier x owner to contain their dog so that it doesn't go on our OP's home and fence bark and go on OP's territory anymore.

> AND, if I'm really honest, it sounds like OP's dog has maybe terrorised that lane for a while?
>
> Ditto,

Not sure if you are referring to the same but I think Cracar is referring to the OP's dog not the terrier :)  I agree people should not be allowing their dogs to enter the OPs property and foul it but I do think they should be allowed to walk the lane and I am not sure it would have made any difference to the OP's dog if the terrier was on a lead or not in its reaction.
Whether the terrier acted agressively or defensively we cannot know but I have to say I would have been terrifed if I was there when a "powerful male dog" which had "lost the plot" emerged into the lane so, to avoid any charge of Dangerous Dog, I think the OP is doing the correct thing it ensuring it cannot happen again.

Yes, I was refering to the OP's GD not the terrier although I doubt the terrier was blame-free. 
My old dog doesn't like other dogs/cats around her territory but I have a wooden 6 ft fence around my boundry line so she can run up and down barking all she wants, she can't do anything worse!  I think it's my responsibility to keep her safe FROM HERSELF!!lol

> it sounds like OP's dog has maybe terrorised that lane for a while? 

Actually it is the neighbours dog that has terrorised the lane, the OP's dog got loose for the first time due to the provocation of the cats.

Knowing how wound up my Inka gets with the cats that torment from the half of the back garden mine are fenced off from I can understand it, though thankfully she has never tried to jump it, but I have to go and shoo the cat (often it won't go until I chase it out).

I also have to leave mine shut out of the front room when I go out, for the same reason, cats in front garden.

Solid fencing helps a lot, I boarded over the side gate to stop mine seeing out to the street, when outside, and all boundary fences are solid.