Hi i was wondering if someone can put my mind at ease. I have just brought a 7 week old bernese mountain dog yesterday and she is the cutest thing, since i have had her she is very quite, she is not playing, all she does is sleep and gets up to go to the toilet and then back to sleep again. she will be awake if i pick her up but have been told to leave her sleeping as this is her growing time. She also has an issue where she walks on her front wrist, i did take her to the vet today and they said that she has just got to get used to her enviroment as its scray moveming into a new place and that the weak pasterns will toughen up over time ( how long) and if they dont she will cope with it well on her own and they dont think this is an issue. I have tried to search the net for answers but going round in circles. some say its poor diet, some say its caused by too much protein, some say heridity but i have contacted the breeder who has stated that both parents and lines have had no issues of any limb problems and she is unsure what the problem is. I have order royal canin puppy large breed to ensure she has a good diet (thats if i can get her to eat) do i buy some luposan to help strenghten the front limbs. Is there anything else i can do, give or help with to encourage good from toes. I am so confused on how to deal with her. I have another bernie who is 2 and half now and never had any issues with him. please please help me and someone show me some light. there is no opition of sending her back she is part of the family and i made that commitment to her when i handed my money over.

We have a few BMD owners and breeders on here so if you can add the breed to your title you might get more replies.  Although you could also send a PM to Merlot or suejaw to get some faster answers :)

Is she really just 7 weeks old or is she nearer to 8 weeks?  I'm not sure how much that matters to her physical development but do remember she is still a 'baby' and will need time to settle into her new home.  If your vet is happy that she is physically well and the breeders have followed the correct worming regime and that she's not dehydrated etc then I wouldn't be worrying yet.  Puppies spend hours and hours sleeping and whilst they usually ping around for a bit in between naps it's easy to forget that they spend a huge amount of time flat out snoozing particularly in the first week or two, although my gundog breed have always been great sleepers, from puppy to adulthood.

Do I gather you are also worried about her eating, what food did the breeder have her on and send her home with?  I noticed that you say you've ordered RC does that mean you are about to change her food?  Even if the breeder was using a poor quality food (hope it wasn't) it will be wise to move her over gradually just to ensure that it doesn't cause a tummy upset.  However if she's just a little bit wary of eating in her new home then that's normal - just double check with the breeder that you are prep'ing the food in the same way and stick to the same times she was on previously.  Keep an eye on her fluid intake and weigh her portions so you can see exactly how much she's eating and keep your vet in the loop if you continue to be worried about not eating.

Fingers crossed you don't have a physical issue and that she settles in soon.  Keep us posted if you can :)

Hi, Sorry you are having trouble with your pup. Did the breeder give you food to bring home ? when did you first notice the twisted paw was it as soon as you saw the pup? It should not be like that, most 7 week Bernese pups are dashing around all over the place. I would be contacting the breeders to make sure you are feeding the correct amounts. Sounds a little strange to me please PM me and let me know the details. Was this a carefull breeder you have found I wonder or maybe someone who is not so good, the breeder should be answering all these questions for you really but if you have only had the pup a day and you are worried then please get in touch.
Aileen

Hi,
I echo what Merlot has said. Some puppies like to sleep a lot but not wanting to play or run about at all doesn't sound right coupled with the leg issue. Did the pup have the problem with the leg when you picked it up or has this developed since you've got it home?
I'll leave you in Merlot's capable hands to help you, please do PM her about this
Good luck and hope you get it sorted :-)

Hi thanks for the feed back, The breeder was feeding her on more which u can get from pets corner but unfortunatly we dont have one around here so would av to order on the net, and no she didnt give me any when i got her. The breeder is really nice and is trying her hardest t help me with ideas and solutions. Ellis is 8 weeks on thurs, she is getting on with my other dogs ok, she is still drinking but has not eaten since yesterday afternoon. she was sick about 11pm and then again when i got up this morning.  she is really quite and the weak pasterns are really worrying me not sure how to deal with them.

Hi Jane. It does sound worrying to me. Pups can have soft pasterns but they usually run about and play. Is your breeder in the UK ? I would try to get pup eating by giving some cooked chicken, raw minced beef (Freeze it first then thaw to feed) tinned pilchards etc. Royal canin in OK but not the best, can you get Fish for dogs or Arcania or Orijen? all much better foods. The best is raw if you are in the UK pets at home do raw minced blocks of compete meat which include ground bone all good for her. If pup is walking on her wrists then the vets really do need to have another look. If it is a hereditary problem she may well be unsound all her life. Please tell me more of where you got her from if in the UK?
All the pups I have ever sold have been flying around in the new owners home straight away, pups adapt very easily at 7 weeks to change so she really should be much more lively.
Aileen

Has the breeder asked to see the puppy at all?
I'd seriously be getting the pup back to the vets and seeking a different opinion as this really isn't right.
Did you see the rest of the litter? How were they? Also the mother she she walking about normally? Do you know anything about the sire? Can he be seen or can you contact his owner too if it's not owned by the breeder?

Just for information really but... If this pup was from the UK the breeder should have given you some of the food the pup was weaned onto, good breeders give some food and information sheets with dates of worming/health issues/feeding regeme etc.. You should have the Kennel Club registration  certificate, 5 generation pedigree, a toy and small piece of blanket that smells of the breeders home. Could you PM with the breeders name (Do not post on the open forum) I will be able to tell you something about them. If you really are struggling to get any food at all down then you need to be getting some high protien tinned food from the vet and watering it down to sringe into pup. Is pup still being sick? any diarrhoea?
I realize your breeder may be good but unfortunatly many are not and in that case much as we find once we have a pup home we cannot bear to part with it remember you may have it for 10 years if you are lucky and you need a pup that will live a healthy life. Not only that but pups bought from puppy farmers/casual breeders who are sickly will only add to the problems of careless breeding for money. Better that you take pup back and the breeder has the problems, it may make them think twice about breeding again! and that is the best way to stop this using a bitch as a cash cow to fund the next holiday...
Please PM me and if you like I will give you my phone number so we can chat.
Aileen

The vomiting may be due to a build up of bile in an empty stomach.

I would be worried too about a listless pup,not eating won't help with that, normally they are eager to explore every corner of their new home and have to be confined to have a nap.

I read somewhere [Pat Hastings "Another piece of the puppy puzzle"] that this deformity can be corrected quite quickly with the right diet provided it is caught early enough. I am shocked that the breeder didn't give you any food, I have always had at least a weeks worth, even if it has been a brand I wouldn't have chosen I can at least have time to gradually change to a food of my choice.

Is this the problem but in another giant breed?

http://www.greatdanelady.com/articles/puppy_feed_program_for_knuckling_over.htm

I hope she bucks up soon.

Can you google HOD and see if it's anything like that. Often when too much calcium is given to young puppies.. Could you possibly take a photo and send to merlot for her to look at?

She is asleep loads but does get up to drink so puppy milk i got today, i will try the high protien food water down and see how she getson, i am in constant contact with the breeder and the mum and dad of the pup are fit and healthy and neither off them have any hx of joint problems. it maybe down to diet and thats why ive gone onto rc, which is a food that the vets recommended. I wouldnt mind if she was eating, thats worrying me like mad now. At least she is taking the puppy milk. I really dont want to take her back, im very old fashioned and believe once you get an animal its your resonpiblity from when u accept it. the other pup that was left was happy and plodding around, i am upset about her not giving me any food but nothing i can do about that now. is cheese good for her coz i gave her 2 pieces the other day. she has just woke up and took herself outside for a wee, she is sooo good. she hasnt eaten now for good 24 hrs but will try the syringe thing, thanks guys its so niice having the support.

No rodach she walks on her wrist, they are not bowed or nuckled under, the vet has no worrys about it and we need to sort out her diet, thats y i thought i woudl use the vets recommended feed of rc. now just to get her to eat xxx i will keep u all informed of ellis journey. watching her now walking in she seems to walk less on her full wrist xx thanks again x

Do you mean her whole foot, bask as far as the stop pad, is flat on the floor rather than just the toes? Is it one foot or both her front feet?

its both feet aand goes to the cak of her foot and the calious part is just above the ground.

> im very old fashioned and believe once you get an animal its your resonpiblity from when u accept it.

Well yes, and that's admirable if the puppy was a gift but you've paid for a healthy puppy.   The fact that this is a living creature makes no difference and the breeder should be taking this puppy back for a closer look.  If you had been sold a faulty car or a house that was unsound you'd be looking for action from the person that sold it to you...

Do let Merlot know who the breeder is, so she can give you the benefit of her experience.  It's so important to buy from the only the best breeders and these are people who would be asking you to take the puppy back to them so they and their vets can give you a second opinion.

Did you arrange insurance for this puppy?  As the condition has arisen within the first 14 days then it's very unlikely that you are covered for it so you also need to be prepared for ongoing expenses if this develops into a condition that cannot be resolved with diet alone.

Does she look like this puppy, sorry not my picture but the nearest I could find .
http://s199.photobucket.com/albums/aa195/merlot_bucket/?action=view&current=Daisy.jpg
Thjis may correct itself with a good diet, may not it is the luck of the draw! If it is worse than this then I would think she will have a long term problem. I would be more concerned to get her eating well at the moment, pups need lots of small meals and to go 24 hrs without is a long time for a pup, try grating some chees onto the kibble, soak it well and feed a little warm, add a bit of cooked ham anything to get her interested, you can get her onto whatever you want to feed once her appetite is better.
Aileen

I echo what Aileen says, if the pup is not from a good breeder then your better letting it go back to the breeder to deal with it's issues, and sourcing a puppy from a good breeder with the kind of back up you should expect.

Poor breeding practises need to be discouraged, and the best way is by hitting the breeder in the pocket to deal with any issues.

On the kennel club registration certificate against the parents names should be the results of health testing schemes.  Hips at the very least should have been scored (though with a large breed I expect elbows should be scored also), and the total scores be under about 20, and elbows be no more than 1/1, but preferably 0/0 or 0/1.

I don't know if the breed are supposed to be screened under any DNA or the eye scheme.

Remember problems with a Giant breeds especially  can be very expensive to treat.  This is also a breed with a regretably short lifespan, something good breeders are trying to tackle.  So if the breeder has doen a poor job you and the pup will be the ones paying for it.

What food were the pups reared on?

Just hips and elbows are required at this time Brainless

I was looking at the photo Merlot posted and been reading more about sub/luxation of the carpal. It looks like with the right food it can be helped depending on the severity of it.

Anyone who buys a puppy deserves it to be healthy, every breeder I've had one from states in their contract that any issues found from the vets within a few days of having it can
Be taken back for a full refund... I don't think I could manage a dog with this issue that is evident so young, not unless I bred it myself which would be different..
I hope MadCollie comes back to us on this... Hope the wee mite can
Be sorted without the need of an operation.. As already mentioned by Merlot this is hereditary..

> I read somewhere [Pat Hastings "Another piece of the puppy puzzle"] that this deformity can be corrected quite quickly with the right diet provided it is caught early enough

I have personal experience of this (carpal laxity).
Buster at 6 months old showing very weak pasterns

After switching to a LOW protein diet, here he is one month later.

However, the problem can be from malnutrition as well as over nutrition. see here

Thanks for all the help, I have just taken Ellis back to the vet, several people have been round today and recon that im paranoid, but she has slept all day and when she went to get some water she vomited it back up at 18.15, i called the vet immedaitly and she was seen straight away. she has a temp of 39.8 and has an infection, she has been given amoxilcare injection and the vet states that if she is the same or gets better just come back tomorrow at 4 but if she is worse then she has to go back in the morning and they will check for parvo. she has had her injections on the 13/08 so i really carnt see this as been the case and she hasnt had poorly poo. its just the eating. the vet said that she would not want to eat and after the anitbotics start to work she will feel better. so hopefully that will sort that one out.
As for the poor i noticed she was walking a bit better today and yes she did look like the one in the pic, but she is a lot smaller. Can i ask how do i know which way do i go with her food high protien or low. the rc is high at 30 % and this is what the ver has recommeded, thats where it gets confusing.
I understand what u are saying about the breeder and i dont want any fuss, i just want Ellis to be ok, the family have fallen hook line and sinker for her and at this point in time she is the most important thing to me. The breeder has only one bitch and got a stud dog to breed with and she said that she wanted her 2 year old to have one littler of pups. She is as upset as me about Ellis and has offered to take the pup back, but how do i know that she will do everything she can for her, how do i know she wont put her to sleep, this is what scares me if i send her back, i had trouble with my telford a bernie when i got him as he got an infection and ended up on a drip within the first week, maybe its something that im doing i dont know. your surport is helping me though, the tips are great and i will look into the diet and find oout which is best for her to bring up her carpals, i did mention to the vet again tonight which was a different one to yesterday and she said that its weak carpals and just need strenghening and can be done with diet. thanks again everyone

I have a great concern that a 7 week puppy had an innoculation, they don't normally start until they are 8 weeks old. Further to this no puppy is fully vaccinated until they've had their second or third jab depending on course taken. Has your puppy been out at all since you got her home? Sounds like whatever she has it's from the breeders..

You probably know this now but just because you want your pet bitch to have a litter is not good enough esp if you have the stud dog too. Does the breeder know about their parents history and any health issues? Is your pup KC registered too?

Sounds like its going to be a whole before your girl is up and about and I'm seriously questioning this breeders ethics! Offering to take the pup back is a good thing and I'd be making sure that if the insurance doesn't pay for the vets treatment then the breeder takes some responsibility. As for handing pup back, well that can be decided when she's out of the vets, now it's the time to make that decision, either way what the breedr does with said pup should not be a concern of yours unless she's an untrustworthy person, if you are questioning this then I wonder why you got a pup from her??

All in all I hope your girl pulls through ad I don't mean to sound harsh but with any breed of dog you need to do your homework, especially if youve gone through health problems with your older Bern!!
You can eradicate all problems but you can certainly put things in place to stop them :-)

With this issue re the carpals I'd not even consider RC, it's expensive grain.. You need to look at a decent food, and many are less than RC... A friend took on a puppy with joint issues and with feeding Arden Grange large breed puppy and hydro sessions she's got him round to the best she can... Don't overdo on calcium either..
Merlot has already mentionned other brands of food to consider

hi sue, I came on here for advice not be had a go at, the puppy is here with us now and that is my main concern. My older berneie is 2 and half and a very handsome strong boy, i keep him lean and trim and well maintained and he has very good manners. I did my homework prior to getting telford and was well up on my game. He had an infection and became dehydrated in the hot weather when we first got him. I am very anxious about my boys when i tragically lost one at 7 years old and im paranoid about all my animals. The breeder is not how u r making her sound, she had 8 puppies and the rest are all ok, im committed to my dogs the moment i say yes. I have an old collie who is 14 and i rescued him at 1 year old, he had a bad attitude and bit 4 kids in the first week (nipped). I was told to have him rehomed or destroyed and we as a family knew he was our responisbitly no one elses as we took him on, so we sold our house and moved to protect him, with love and kindness he has never bit anyone since and is very loyal and is my boy, so please i dont mean any disrespect but please dont have a go. I came on here for advice not to be told off nad made to feel inferior.
Me coming on here was about ellis nothing else. she has an infection which she might have got from the breeders home with all the coming and goings of people looking at the pups, she was vaccinated by a qualified vet and they can be done between 6-8 wks, i have confirmed this with other vets. I have also phoned her vet to confirm it was all ok at the vet check. I work in the public eye and i am in many peoples house and thats y i question people about what they would do with a pup if i sent her back nothing to do with the breeder its about me and ellis and how i feel, nothing more. I was also told by the vet a good balanced puppy diet will sort ellis feet out as well as other people, they sell rc so i brought rc, i went on the advice given by my vet, what was i supposed to do. like u said before i dont mean to sound harsh but ellis comes first, not my bank balance

I think you are great for keeping this pup no matter what. Even if the breeder was unethical and it was the wrong breeder to buy from-- which I am not suggesting is the case here since I know nothing about it-- how anyone could hand the puppy back as if it was damaged goods is beyond me.

I can see you have become very attached to Ellis, however that does not change the fact that some people breed for all the wrong reasons. Those of us who are carefull and spend time and energy breeding properly for the good of the breed and take the fact that our pups are going into homes to be much loved pets very seriously, we aim to breed a nice typical dog that looks like the breed you fell in love with and is happy healthy and sound. The fact that most owners only want "A PET" still means that you should expect a well bred healthy puppy that is the typical example of the breed. I show and occasionally breed and I sell my pups as pets first and hope that some will make it into the show rings to win and prove they are good Bernese, but they are pets first and my responcibility to the new owners is to make sure they are healthy. You have a pup who has a front leg problem and within 2 days of arriving home is poorly. The breeder must accept some of that is her problem. I think she should be helping out with the vets fees at the very least.
As you have only had her a couple of days it is most likely she had the infection at the breeders, most infections have a 7 - 14 day incubation time. I would ask the breeder to warn the other owners that they may be incubating some infection. The soft pasterns may well improve with a good diet. Suejaw is right in that RC is a high grain food and Ellis needs a well balenced diet with a higher meat content. The emphasis on offering her a properly balenced diet is what is needed now. I do not doubt that your vet has suggested RC as they will have a contract with RC to sell thier food, the next vet along in your town may have a contract with Hills Science diet and they would suggect that as they will get commision from evry bag sold. There are better diets available, as a Bernese she will have different needs to say a Lab or a tpy breed. Orijen is very good as is Fish for dogs but if you really want to do the best for Ellis a raw diet is excellent but it does need some research before you start to feed it.
No one is having a go at you but we are concerned for Ellis and every pup that has problems. Maybe your breeder tried to do the best for her litter and now is the time she needs to help you out. It is easy to see that you have some concerns about her or you would not worry about her taking Ellis back and putting her to sleep. The breeder should be as worried as you and be offering to help out with the vet fees.
We would like to see you get Ellis over these problems and for her to have a good life so please try to understand we are not picking on you but are a little wary of the breeders intentions.
Did Ellis's parents have thier hips and elbows scored? It should have been done at the very least even for a pet litter.
Aileen.
My offer still stands if you wish to chat PM me and I will let you have my number.

To Zan.
Because every Pup sold from a poor breeder just encourages them to breed more. By returning a poorly pup to an unscrupulous breeder it hurts them in the pocket...the only place that may stop them breeding poor sick deformed pups again. Do not think for one moment anyone likes the idea but by bying these pups we are just perpetuating an evil trade. I would not suggest this pup came from such a breeder but many do, the breeder could be helping with the vet fees as this pup must have been harbouring infection prior to sale.
Aileen

i totally understand where u are coming from with the breeding situation and i of all people support good breeders over money breeders. unfortunaltly, i have brought ellis and this is not her fault, she is the sweetest thing and i just couldnt give her up, it goes well against my grain and ethics. I am in contact with the breeder and hip and elbow scores was done, she is someone who is concious of good food and made me very aware of what we feed our dogs, i think she may ahve lacked on ellis protien thats why i see this foot problem. the vet said its nothing to worry about it is all about diet, i have this rc and i av boiled chicken to add to it and as we speak ellis is up drinking and eaten a good amount of chicken so for the first time in 2 days im smiling. I could never be a breeder, i couldnt give the pups up, i would see them as my responsiblity but im jsut a massive dog lover, i also pay to rscpa, and battersea evry month from my wages as well have a sponsered dog, thats how daft i am when it comes to dogs, n that is why ellis stays faults an all.
i will make sure the breeder is told and aware of mine and ellis`s torture over the past 2 days. i know u r trying to help and thank you. just wish i would av gone somewhere else to buy a pup, but i carnt go back in time and change things coz if i could i would never have lost my pedigree border collie at 7. and he was the best thing that ever happened to me, if he was a bloke i would have married him lol, thats how much he meant to me, he has left me paranoid when it comes to my dogs, good or bad i dont really know but for ellis im the perfect home for her....

You asked how you decide whether to up or down the protein, you need to find out the content of what the breeeder has been feeding because if nutrition is involved it won't be due to what you have fed for the past few days as the problem was there when you got her, if the protein content was low then you need to raise it, if it was high then lower it.

I have never had a giant breed but from what I have read they need to grow slowly so there isn't excess pressure on her bones,tendons and joints, exercise should be restricted to the 5mins per month of age and be confined to the house and garden till 3/4 months old. Keeping her weight under control will help too, is she the right weight for her age and size?

Hindsight is a wonderful thing and telling you that you made the wrong choice re breeder is not going to help the pup, you know that now and need help and support to move on.

I hope you see a big change in her over all condition following the treatment from the vet and she starts behaving like a young pup should.

Keep us posted.

Jane,
I apologise, my frustration regards this breeder boiled over. I'm not having a pop at you and I do wish you all the best in little Ellis making a full recovery. If you google the food More it should hopefully have all the details on the pet shop website. If not then I'd give any store a shout for them to get you the nutritional advice. Do you know if that is all she was feeding the pups or if she added anything else, say like goats milk, tripe etc? Do you know how long they had been on the complete food prior to you collecting her? Also did the breeder soften the food with water to make it easier for puppies to eat(just trying to cover many bases here).

Any news on what is actually wrong with Ellis, is it Parvo?
Again please accept my apology as this clearly is a trying emotional time and I appreciate that and I've not helped with having a dig at the breeder, but do hope you understand where I am coming from. I think Merlot put it in a better way :-)

>exercise should be restricted to the 5mins per month of age and be confined to the house and garden till 3/4 months old.

The limited exercise advice is spot on, but I'm afraid that keeping a puppy (of any breed) confined to the house and garden till 3 or 4 months old is a recipe for behavioural disaster. :-( They need to be out and about for socialisation just as much as smaller breeds; it's just much more difficult because they're too heavy to carry far for long.

It was the size thing that made me wonder how you would get a pup before fully vaccinated out and about, I have seen owners of large breed pups struggling to carry them into the vets for vacs and then keep them off the floor.

Even using a baby buggy they would out grow pretty quickly.

I can fit 3/4 of my dachsie pups into a puppy/dog carrier till they are 8 weeks old, then I take them out 2 at a time till they are fully covered by their vacs and walk out for the limited time and carry back.

> The limited exercise advice is spot on, but I'm afraid that keeping a puppy (of any breed) confined to the house and garden till 3 or 4 months old is a recipe for behavioural disaster.

The breeders advice for me when getting Buster as a pup was no 'walk' other than for the purpose of socialisation, ie. no walking for the sake of excersise, but lead walks to get used to lead walking & the big wide world, socialisation is sooooooo important. I wouldn't walk him for 5 minitutes per month of age though, howver, I would happily walk him 5 mins to sit on the grass next to a busy road and spend an hour there.

> To Zan.
> Because every Pup sold from a poor breeder just encourages them to breed more. By returning a poorly pup to an unscrupulous breeder it hurts them in the pocket...the only place that may stop them breeding poor sick deformed pups again. Do not think for one moment anyone likes the idea but by bying these pups we are just perpetuating an evil trade. I would not suggest this pup came from such a breeder but many do, the breeder could be helping with the vet fees as this pup must have been harbouring infection prior to sale.
> Aileen

Merlot-- I absolutely agree that no one should buy puppies from unscrupulous breeders.  No one could be more against such an evil trade as I am. However, the deed is done and the OP has bought the pup, who is now part of her family, and I think it is admirable that she is going to keep her. It isn't even clear that the breeder was unscrupulous from what is written here, but if s/he is, returning the pup to him or her would not bode well for the pup.

It is heart wrenching to read of your worries with Ellis. I hope things soon begin to improve rapidly.   I guess that you haven't yet contacted "Merlot" even though she has offered her help several times. If you prefer, why not contact someone else who is a committee member of the Bernese Mountain Dog Club of G.B ?  The contact details can be found on the club's web site. There are some very experienced people at your disposal who will be very willing to try to advise.

Hi all, i av an update on Ellis. I took her to the vets monday, tues, wed, and thurs, it was only thurs when they all started to believ me and that something was the matter with ellis. She had an xray on thurs morning and they found her abdomin all cloudy so ? peritinitis, She then had emergencey surgery to try and save her life, when she was on the table, they found that she had one kidney only and this was 3 times as bigger than normal, it was hard and looked abnormal, ? tumors. the vet said that her chance of surving was alittle as 10% and even if she got over this she may only live to 4 months so the kindess thing to do was to let her go. she was put to sleep at 14.45 on thursday. i was devestated, they also said that there was signs of her been unwell but unfortuntaly they missed it, like the weak pasterns, which wasnt weak but she was too weak to stand on her full feet. The breeder is as devaeated as me and has refunded me all the monies, the pup fee and all the vet fee. she has also offered me another pup free of charge when she has another litter next year. I want to thank you all for your surport but no one could av guessed that she only had one kidney and the other was tumours. I had an amazing 4 days with her and feel cheated by him upstairs, the breeder i feel sorry for she is gutted that her vet never spotted anything even though the pups went 4 times before been homed. I was just unlucky and if these pups was born in the wild she would have defo died, but due to the care that the breeder gave to ensure all her ppups was looked after she managed to get ellis to 8 weeks x

So sorry to hear this and in one so young.  Well done to the breeder for doing the right thing. 

RIP Ellis.

So so very sad.

So very sorry to hear your sad tale, do hope you soon get the pup you desire and it proves a healthy and sound example. As you say not really anyone's fault why not contact someone on here who have offered to help once you feel you are wanting another pup I am sure they will be able to help.

I'm so sorry madcollie. RIP Ellis x

That is so sad,RIP Ellis.

Good on the breeder for returning your money.

I hope when the time is right you find a new healthy pup.

So sorry to hear such a sad outcome. The poor little pup is free from pain now - you did exactly the right thing, upsetting though it was. Sometimes nature gets it wrong and there's nothing anyone can do, Sleep well little girl.

So sorry to read your sad update. Poor little Ellis. x

I am so very sorry to have this sad news. I am sure you are heartbroken. RIP LIttle Ellis.
Great news that the breeder has been there for you and done the right thing. Well done.
Aileen

Such a sad outcome, I'm so very sorry.  I can only imagine how hard it must be for you and your family to have lost your puppy so soon

My thoughts are with you x

So sorry to hear your news.

Well done to you and the breeder for doing the right things. What a horrible thing to have happened.

So very sorry to hear the sad news, you tried so hard at least you did everything you could for Ellis.
We had a similar experience quite a few years ago now with a pedigree kitten, the vets did all sorts of tests and kept her in for nearly a week, it ran up a very large bill, then she was sent home with heart medication, but she was too ill to take the tablets, we took her back to the vets and this time saw one of the older vets, he kept her in again and they did a urine sample.
The vets had done all sorts of expensive tests and samples but a simple urine test would have showed up the main problem and the kitten would not have had to suffer for so long. We had to have the kitten pts. We were all very upset, we made a complaint about why the test had not been done when we first took the kitten to the vets, and they made a substantial reduction on our bill.
I know that money has never been an issue, and you just wanted to get your puppy well again, but I do think that her condition should have been diagnosed earlier.
I wish you well, and hope that you get another puppy soon, one that is healthy and you can shower all your love on, you will never forget Ellis, but you will make a great owner to another lucky puppy in the future. Run free little Ellis.

So very sorry to read this post.. Ellis was very lucky to have had you in his very short life and to have had all the love you gave him... RIP Ellis..

Been following your post and I'm so sorry for you....Poor little Ellis RIP   So very sad :)

Oh goodness, just seen this post.. I'm so very very sorry for your loss x

What a terribly sad outcome for you and for little Ellis.

I am glad the breeder refunded your money and the cost of the vet bills, though your puppy should have come with 6 weeks free insurance.

When you feel the time is right for another puppy I hope that you will ask for a recommendation on here for a good breeder to go to. I think deep down you realise that whilst the breeder of Ellis may have been very nice, some things were not the best they could be. I was surprised that you said she has offered you a pup from her next litter as originally she had told you she wanted her 2 year old to have one litter of pups.

I think you were terribly unfortunate, Ellis even more so bless his little heart, but please don't repeat the mistake.

I did wonder whether this could even be a case of JRD which is hereditary and affects the Bernese Mountain Dog. There is a genetic test for this. The breeder is going to repeat this breeding regardless, without ever knowing whether this is a product of the mating of these two dogs. For me.....I would not want to see this mating repeated.  I think you should be feeling sorry for you and Ellis. You may not have 'just been unlucky' this may be the result of poor breeding, and this might happen again, and someone else will 'just be unlucky'.  This is why everyone was repeatedly talking about good breeders.

I am sorry that you had this experience, I know this a terrible time for you but now is the time when you need to question whether you were 'just unlucky' or whether it was more than that.