Anxiety, 6 bites in 5 weeks. I don't think so!!

A dog with anxiety that is not managed correctly, is a dog that bites. Nikita is an extremely knowledgable behaviourist.

>we took no nonsence from her

Dogs don't do "nonsense", so do you mean you "showed her who was boss?"

>Anxiety, 6 bites in 5 weeks. I don't think so!!

Anxious dogs hide away; dogs with rage don't.

Did she bite with no warning? My Mums last cocker, a solid black started behaving strangely age 6yrs old, my father had recently died and I spent 5 weeks staying with my Mum in Scotland, I had my golden cocker with me, the had such great times when they were younger, my dog was about 18 months older but this visit was a nightmare of Bruce going for my dog every time he saw him.

Mum battled on for 5 yrs of him turning on her, she moved nearer to me but things didn't settle, Mum had to put a board between him and her to back him into a room to calm down, the nice dog we once knew had gone, one day Mum got bitten badly and without telling me took him to the vets again, he had seen several who mentioned cocker rage, the vet told her that PTS was the best option for them both, over 10 yrs later she still feels guilty, I have told her she did all she could for him and didn't take him at the first sign of trouble.

We had several cockers growing up and they were all golden except Bruce and he was the only one to  show this problem.

The Blacks and Goldens were mated together to keep the colour, if you mated Golden to Golden the resulting puppies would be lighter in colour. Goldens mated to Blacks kept the deep rich coat colour, so both colours would carry some of the same genes.
I think there is confusion about anxious or nervous dogs and rage syndrome, if you have seen it is totaly different and not a question of showing the dog who is boss. Which in my experience never works anyhow. If you show aggression to an aggressive dog you are likely to only make the situation worse.
A cocker with full blown rage syndrom is not an aggressive dog !!! They can be perfectly well trained, and affectionate dogs one minute, and a sudden change comes over them for no apparent reason, I have heard theories about chemical changes in the brain, or brain pattern changes.

The problem is that the tendancy has been for vets to label every grumpy cocker as having rage syndrome. When it was actualy quite rare and a lot less prevelant now due to the action breeders took in the 70s & 80s. But there were always those who continued to breed from dogs with the condition, and it still crops up from time to time.

The main problem is that as they are a very attractive and popular breed people buy them who do not understand that they are an active gundog, they need an active lifestyle with plenty of mental stimulation and good basic obedience, and socialisation, just the same as most breeds. A lot of the show type dogs would still carry most of their working ability and some kennels still have dual purpose dogs who can work a field one day and be in the showring the next.
There are the exceptions and I have met some who are real couch potatoes, but that is down to different personality traits, in a litter of pups some will be lively and energetic, some more laid back, but that is where a good breeder will place the puppies in the most suitable homes. Problems arise as there are a many BYB breeders out there who have little knowledge of pedigrees and can sell puppies easily because they are popular and cute.

Yep there is a world of difference between a rage syndrome dog and a dog with even the severest of behavioural problems - with the latter, there is SOME 'tell' there somewhere, they don't just behave aggressively for no reason but it might take a skilled behaviourist to figure out what the trigger or reason is, and it might well have morphed into something YOU don't think is a valid reason.

I hear about and get called about quite a few spaniels (not just cockers but predominantly working cockers) who have owners who think they have a dog with rage syndrome - in 10+ years, not one of those dogs has been 'ragey' - I have been able to find a trigger, work back through what has happened and get the owner to SEE what is really going on.

Cockers unfortunately with their sharp smart nature AND their gundog desires to carry stuff around, suffer quite badly and quite easily if mishandled, from resource guarding, and they can very quickly become so bad they will guard a ridiculous object from a long distance. That is commonly the real issue - the dog is guarding something and that something is a/ small and not identified by the owner as worthy of guarding (a scrap of tissue for example), and b/ so far away that the owner cannot see it, or is not aware that it is there...

Unfortunately in these cases people leap to the rage conclusion, when really the answer is the wrong training and frequently the wrong dog for the situation.

You will not cure nor prevent a rage syndrome dog from having 'rage' outbursts by being 'firm' or 'no nonsense' or anything else with him - some of these tactics CAN however cause a dog to become very resource guardy/possession aggressive!

My top tips for cockers would be  - buy from the background/lines that suit YOUR lifestyle - if you cannot offer work or an accurate recreation of work, don't buy a worker!
Always teach them to swap items and retrieve from day ONE.
Never EVER chase and chastise them for picking up stuff and running around with it - thats a sure fire way to create a resource guarder.

Absolutely possible, if it's a severe problem - and hiding the way you described could easily be a severe problem.  When my Soli came home, had I not been extremely careful and handled her just so (and been studying behaviour to know how to do that) I'd easily have had twice that many bites in that time, maybe more - she had a severe anxiety problem.

I also have a collie here now who will hide like that - last night through stress she started guarding her water bowl, and having gotten her away from that for everyone's safety she proceeded to lie on her bed and not let me anywhere near.  I'd have been bitten if I pushed it.  Again - pure anxiety, stress.  There's nothing medically wrong with her that I'm aware of - just a very bad start in life.

Fact is, true 'rage' (whatever it is) has no trigger - the dog simply attacks - you have described a very anxious, stressed dog and that is a trigger by itself.

Please note that this example happened 44 years ago! I have made only a brief comment about the problem with this dog. I am not surprised that so many people out there know so much about this problem and can comment with so much knowledge!!
I am making a statement that the problem of "Rage syndrome" was known a lot furthur back than anyone else has mentioned !

Rage syndrome was certainly known about 40+ years ago. :-) I myself was bitten (nearly lost my eye) as a child by a golden cocker in the early 1960s - but it didn't have RS, it was simply untrained. However the behaviour you describe doesn't fit the syndrome - cockers which bite are still being mis-labelled as having RS when in fact they have a totally different problem.

and according to Dr Jean Dodds, undiagnosed Thyroid problems are the most common reasons for unprovoked aggression, and also a major cause of fits.

I have only described the day of collection 44 years ago!!  No furthur information has been given other than bitten 6 times in 5 weeks!

>I have only described the day of collection 44 years ago!!

Understood. :-) And you've perfectly described a very anxious dog.

The further information was a dog that was hiding behind a chair and took considerable persuasion to come out - that is an anxious dog and IME, the sort of behaviour that can very easily lead to bites and certainly the level of biting you experienced :-)

I'm not saying rage doesn't exist - it does in some way but I am of the belief that it's either an epileptic type syndrome or undiagnosed thyroid trouble (or possibly even a brain tumour or similar in some dogs), I just don't believe that the dog you described had rage of any cause - it does not fit.

Anxiety, 6 bites in 5 weeks. I don't think so!!

Hmmmm....so you have never heard of fear aggression or anxiety?

>Anxiety, 6 bites in 5 weeks. I don't think so!!

Yes, I would agree with the anxiety/fear diagnosis.  Any dog which is hiding under a chair when you go to see it, is demonstrating that it is terrified of you.  If it then goes on to bite you 5 times in 6 weeks, I think it could fairly easily be said to be fear aggression.  :( 

I've had a lot of dogs through my classes over the years - working and show cockers - and almost all of them have been great confident dogs.  The tiny few which haven't been, have been clearly under-socialised and fearful and have learnt to snap in response to feeling threatened.  I've seen no evidence that 'rage syndrome' exists, as a separate classifiable entity than fear aggression. 

However, I do think that different breeds and lines within breeds, have different thresholds for when fear tips over into aggression.  Some dogs can be extremely timid, yet you know that they would sooner curl up in a ball than be aggressive.  Others will, at the first hint of something overwhelming, respond with a snarling aggressive display.  Different dogs have different thresholds, and it wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that there are some lines of cockers which are more reactive than others.  It's still fear aggression though, not 'rage syndrome'.