I am phoning the vets this morning as I am. Now starting to worry ;(
Holly is 8 years old has never had much of a problem health wise, people that meet her think she is a puppy and her 5 year old daughter is the mum!
She is a small build bmd.
Sunday went for our usual lead walk as fields too muddy, walk took about 40 mins.
All day Sunday seemed fine, got up Monday morning and holly struggled to get off her bum to stand, helped her up and she managed to toilet normally in the garden sodding as she walked.
Decided to rest her, pain killers suitable for dogs etc
3 days on and she not improved at all, she's eating fine, wagging her tail, not seen her drink yet but have been leaving fresh water close to her so she doesn't need to get up.
I am baffled as the walk we did she never hurt herself she never pulls on lead she walks right by me all the time.
I am going to book her in at the vets this morning but please if anyone could give advise experience I am worried.
I think she mY have injuries her hind legs some how, she is normally very happy dog but if you go. Near her rear end she grumps which is understandable if she is in pain and discomfort.

Sounds like she has hurt her back in some way. The vet is the right way to go. Fingers crossed it is something the vet can help with.
I know how you feel having a 10 1/2 yr old who has very wonky legs.
I hate to say but the last Bern I lost went off her legs one day and was diagnosed with a tumor on her spine. Our thoughts are with you
Aileen

Hi aileen I off to the vets at 1020 ;( fingers crossed for a simple treatment x
My first Bernese became unwell 2 weeks after his 8th birthday it was cancer x

Cancer is horrible. I have lost 3 to it. That is part of the reason I am off to Holland this time for some better documentated longevity. We cannot pick up on the cancers but I have thought long and hard and decided that to use stock who have had longer lives may go someway towards helping.
Maybe it won't but I will give it a go.
We have all out toes fingers and paws crossed for you.
Aileen

Agree with Merlot about cancer in BMD. I have had 3 and not one of them got to 7, so devastated that I gave up on having anymore. They are STILL my favourite breed but could not live with the heartache........

Fingers crossed here for it to be nothing serious.

You were unlucky Tigran I have had 6 one died at 10 1/2yrs (Old age) one 9 1/2yrs (Cancer ) one 7yrs (Cancer). At the moment I have 3 generations one 10 1/2 one 8 and one 2. Also one who was re-homed at 18 mth due to not getting on with her Mum, who is now 4 1/2yrs.
My line seems to be good at the moment but time willl tell.
With Bernese we need to look not just at hips, elbows, Eyes, elongated soft pallett etc.. temp and type but at longevity as well.
Aileen

We are back.
The. Vet reckons holly has arthritis in right hind leg and front left leg, joint supplements to begin with then if no improvement anti inflammtories for life with regular blood tests.
Her heart and chest all good, vet was surprised at how young holly looked at how her heart and chest is for a 'mature' old girl!
Holly is wobbly on her feet, not too bad though so fingers crossed the joint supplements will help her out.
Good luck with your new breeding ideas aileen, I really do think we need some fresh new lines over here.
Thanks for your posts, I know BMD's have a shorter lifespan then some other breeds, but my home is not complete without a Bernese mountain dog! Xxx

Really hope it is arthritis and she picks up now on the right meds.. I nearly decided against the breed at one point due to the lack of longevity..
I wish you all the luck Aileen in your plans, all very exciting and a kennel I admire for where you are travelling to :-)

I hope the diagnosis is correct, unusual for arthritis to cause such a rapid deterioration in her mobility, it is usually more gradual.

Keep us posted on how she does on the supplements, they may take sometime to kick in.

> The. Vet reckons holly has arthritis in right hind leg and front left leg, joint supplements to begin with then if no improvement anti inflammtories for life

Buster has artritis in both elbows. Last year he got his leg caught in the throw-over as he was getting off the sofa and he fell off. He seemed OK at the time (despite frighteneing the hell out of me as I thought he must have broke all legs with that fall!) LAter in the day he started having some problems, seemed a little stiff in the front, but not too bad.
The next day it was horrible. He got on the sofa and when he tried getting back off, it was like his front legs couldn't take his weight anymore, I had to try to take his body weight while he got his rear end off, then the limping he was doing was awfull. I called the vet out to the house on an emergency visit, I was in floods of tears thinking Buster had come to the end as, to me, the limp looked like it was devastating and hopeless.

The vet didn't think it was as bad as I did!! He had metacam and I cut his walks back for a few days, forcing him to walk slow for a 3rd of the distance he usually has (IME stopping walks completely is not a good idea for arthritis as it leads to more problems). It was proably about 2 weeks before he was back to normal (with no metacam after the first week).

With arthritic joints, a little knock/twist/jar that wouldn't effect a healthy joint does appear to cause lots of discomfort as it seems to increase swelling at the joint, but can often be eased back to pre-injury (IME). Fingers crossed your Holly will be back to her usual self in a week or 2.

As for joint suppliments Busters vet recomended I  put him on cod-liver-oil in addition to the Glucosamine he was allready on.

Hi again everyone, I need some advice experience again :(
Holly seems to have got worse since the vets, she is hardly getting up now unless I encourage her and help her back end up, then once she is up she is very wobbly and sometimes holding her tail up and kinked down and the end of it???
The vet said if she does not improve on the joint supplements then anit imflamatory medicine will be needed with regular blood tests, I know joint supplements can take a few weeks to take but its upsetting seeing her struggle like this.
I am not too keen on the anti inflamatory medicine as I am worried of the side effects hence why the vet needs to do regular blood tests every 3 months?
I am givng her Arnica 30c, has anyone tried other naturual remedies for Artirtis?
Holly is insured so the vet bills are not an issue.

Forgot to say Holly is also taking codliver oil and Glucosamine as well as the Arnica

I think if she is in that much pain then anti imflammatory medication is the best course of action. You can use this in the short term until the joint supplements kick in if you are worried about the side effects.

I would pop her back to the vets.

I agree with LJS, she needs to see the vet.
Anti-inflamatories will really help her, they do not have to be life-long, if we hurt ourslefs and have an Ibuprofen tablet to ease the pain we take them for as many days as we need them, not expect to have them every day for the rest of our lives :) . As I said before, Buster has had metacam for arthritis, as an adult he's never been on Metacam for longer than about 10 days (had a 5 week stint on Metecam as a pup when he was first diagnosed with elbow displasia).

If you are really against anti inflamatories (which is the first choice for arthritic pain as the arthritis causes swelling, the swelling causes a lot of the pain), then there may be some other pain killer she can have to help her out.

I personally wouldn't be giving arnica if anti-inflamatories are a possibilty. As you know there are possible side-effects to anti-inflamatories, the quicker they are spotted the better for the dog, so I wouldn't want to be giving a suppliment that has the potential to cause digestive/stomach problems for fear of increasing the risk of side effects from the anti inflamatory or masking the symptoms - without checking with the vet.

Called  vets booked her for blood test and collecting anti inflamotories this afternoon.
I am not against anti inflamotories it was the vet telling me she would need regular blood tests if put on anti tablets and would be on them for life. I think I am so worried about her I can't think straight! She is my world.
Fingers crossed these help her be her normal self

I know it is awful when they are ill but I do think short term this will help this current crisis and then longer term once she is feeling better you can discuss her longer term treatment.

Hope she starts to improve x

I sadly would also agree with cancer due to the breed and the suddeness.  Glad you are getting bloods done.  Hope it turns out that it isn't as serious and she improves quickly on treatment.

Anti Inflamatories [give with food or after food]will help her to stay mobile which is very important with arthritis, I personally don't have any confidence in supplements[ I was diagnosed in the late 70's with OA in my left knee,now all my major joints] I have tried each one as they have appearred, the Glucosamine caused me to have raised blood sugars but luckily a friend warned me of this and I was able to monitor that weekly and stopped taking it, no great loss as it hadn't helped.

I hope she picks up for you soon as it is a worry to see them so debilitated in such a short space of time.

Stanley my BMD has been on 1  Rimadyl a day  for two years after his wobbly legs episode, he obviously  needs them as  I have tried to cut them out to no avail I have to accept that he has a problem, I think it is his back he is 6 1/2 but he has had no problem whatsoever on these , he also gets in the morning 4 yumove tabs and an omega 3 tab, goes out twice a day and runs about if he can be bothered! I think you have to bite the bullet and if the anti inflammatory gives relief go with it, I know we all what too not treat our BMD,s naturally but sometimes they may need a bit of of help..good luck hope things go well xx

I'd be getting a referral to a specialist if it were me. Fitzpatrick I'd go for especially as you aren't that far away!!

Thanks everyone, normally I am full of advice and calm for others, but I seem to have gone into worry mode with my special girl!
I am waiting for hubby to get home with her meds, she has managed to move out near the open patio doors and is stretched out asleep. I just can't believe how sudden she became virtually unable to get up and walk :( everything is crossed for a cure xx

When Stanley's legs went it was overnight he had every test going at Newmarket but nobody has given me an answer and he got better himself, I always took him out everyday but on grass so it was easier for him.. just give it a few days!

I'd be getting a referral to a specialist as well-- this sounds too sudden and severe to be arthritis. You are lucky to be close to Fitzpatrick!! too far for me.

Any human who has arthritis young or old will also tell you the same, some days and seasons there is hardly any stiffness or pain and then some days/weeks it can cause stiffness and aching.

I agree with everything ML has said, in a few days she will probably be walking almost normal, just keep her exercised on flat ground as much as you can, one of my mum's girls now 13yrs started with stiffness occasionally in her back legs and once her legs gave way just like this at 10yrs.......... also from sitting in her chair, why is it always first noticed from a chair or sofa? :-)

It is a shock as most older dogs who get arthritis it just slowly creeps up, but with this girl it happened just like this too, she was medicated for a week just whilst she walked normally again, then my mum took her off.

Today at 13 she can still sprint across a field and walk happily with no side effects in and out of bushes following the other dogs, but give her a walk for longer than 30 mins and you can see she begins to slow and struggle, so she just does short walks with us now.

My mum only medicates when needed and tbh it has not been that often, she shows no signs as long as not pushed over her own limits, so that is something you will need to work out, what starts to cause pain and what exercise time limit she needs, cold, winter days etc can cause it to flare up too.

Don't worry she will come out of this and hopefully have many pain free days and normal walks, although with arthritis some have it worse than others, just keep an eye on her and fingers crossed she will also still be able to enjoy her walks as long as not over-pushed, once aware it is much easier. :-)

I know the meds will take some time to kick in but I would be asking for X-rays &/or referral to a specialist.  Your vet can't be 100% sure without X-rays and if Holly has some damage to her spine for example delaying treatment might make a difference.

We are back to the vets this morning as holly needs the blood test urgently.
She has also developed a round marble type lump on her front leg never noticed it before ;(
And this morning when I help her up she seems to be leaving a clear coloured puddle on the floor :(
Will up date soon

Poor you, you must be worried sick and poor Holly :(
Best of luck at the vet.

ETA, it may be worth taking a urine sample with.

Continuing to keep fingers crossed, will keep checking back for updates. xx

Oh no I hope it is nothing too serious x

Well we are back again.
Temperature normal urine sample normal, heart chest and stomach normal. Which is great.
Bloods taken paid extra to get results tomorrow morning, vet still thinks its arthritis
Lump on leg not much concern at moment will take sample of it when we go back, vet thinks clear fluid holly leaving behind is normal virginal discharge even though I expressed my concerns about the amount of fluid and the fact poor holly is really starting to smell of urine, she is not showing any signs of pyomerta, I know what to look out for as my Gemini had closed and my first dog had open pyomerta.
So now we wait for the blood results,,,,,,,,,
Would really like to bath her as she so stinky bless her, but would be unfair as she can't stand up for very long :;(
Will update tomorrow when have the blood results.

Glad you have updated us, all seems good lets hope for a speedy recovery!

All good so far, fingers crossed the bloods come back clear.

> poor holly is really starting to smell of urine

is it possible that she is having less trips out for a wee?? It may be that she is reluctant to walk so is trying to hold it and it's then too much to hold or is leaking out with the effort of moving? The reason I say this is when Busters elbow got bad as a pup, he started to wee in his bed while he was laying in it instead of bothering to get up for a wee.
You could sponge her off, to help get rid of the smell and make her more comfortable, the urine can scald her skin, I used to wash Buster while he was laying down as he would be covered in wee after he'd weed in his bed (and being a male, it would be all over his belly & chest too).

If it is possible that she is not going to wee outside as much as she should be doing, then you could try to make sure she does get out more often even if it means that perhaps you support her weight (using a towel as a sling under her for example) ?

I know it's really hard to do, but try not to worry and be too much of a fuss-bag with Holly as she'll pick up on your nerves. Of course you want to make sure she knows she's loved and is comfortable, but do it with a positive attitude if you can :)

Thanks mastifflover x
It could well that she is holding on for the toilet, I am taking her out at intervals but maybe I need to do more often.
I feel a bit calmer now, as urine etc is normal.
Will post again soon thanks to all for your support xxx

Fingers crossed here,hope things are sorted soon,such a worry for you.

Sheila xx

Paws & fingers crossed for you both, good luck.

Well the results are in and blood test is all normal! Phew!!
Vet has upped holly dose of anti inflamatories and holly has made a good attempt to get up without assistance.
She sleeps a lot more but is eating normally and drinking so fingers crossed we will make more progress as the medicine helps ;) xx thanks again for the support and advice everyone x

> Well the results are in and blood test is all normal!

Fantastice news, that must be such a relief for you :)

>holly has made a good attempt to get up without assistance.

More good news :-D
Things are looking good, I hope Holly makes a speedy return to her usual self.

Wow had to share this!
Hubby and I sitting in lounge reading, when hubby sees holly in the garden! She walked back indoors and walked around us wagging her tail as though to say 'hey look what I can do' oh thank goodness! Xx

Wow had to share this!
Hubby and I sitting in lounge reading, when hubby sees holly in the garden! She walked back indoors and walked around us wagging her tail as though to say 'hey look what I can do' oh thank goodness! Xx

That is great news, meds must have kicked in and allowed her to get mobile which will help her joints and her mood.

Great news, she must be feeling so much better.

> She walked back indoors and walked around us wagging her tail as though to say 'hey look what I can do'

Ahh, bless her :) Thats' fantastic news :-D

Great to hear of such an improvemet and as Rhodach has said, her being mobile will help her even more.

Seeing them be able to move about after being so low and crippled feels like winning the lottery doesn't it :)

Wonderful news keep going Holly xx

Briiliant news.what a relief,

Sheila

Well we are back to the vets in the morning ;(
Despite a slight improvement it doesn't last long, she try's to get up nut ends up shuffling her back end instead, I help her stand and sometimes her back legs give way and she's down :(
This morning she ate a little of her food took her medicine I helped her into the garden and she managed to toilet, she hasn't really moved from the spot she flopped in after that despite my efforts.
She is still wagging her tail still try's to roll on her side for belly rub, I just don't understand it, 8 days ago my holly was going for walks, rolling on my rug in the lounge after I hoovered it and following me around.

It is possible it is pain and like a sensible girl she has decided not to move because it hurts, ask the vet if you can try a course of Tramadol as well as the NSAID that is what I have my old boy on and it has made a huge difference.

Ahh sorry to hear that let's hope vet tommrow can sort something keep us updated xx

Thanks jackie, I think you are right, I will ask the vet tomorrow.
She is still eating and drinking so fingers crossed the vet will give her stronger pain relief.

Think it may be worth a try you will know if it is working within a few hours. My lad is prescribed two 50mg of Rimadyl and up to six 50mg a day of Tramadol and weighs around 25kg - in fact I only have to give him a 50mg Tramadol 3 times a day to keep him active and happy. Oh! Should have said he is 14 years 5 months, been on Rimadal for about 5 years and Tramadol about 6 months recent blood tests showed all internal organs working well and in normal condition.