Hi, has anyone recently lost their belovered companion to rimadyl side effects, as i had to have my beautiful 5yr old rottweiler put to sleep 11/4/12, he had been on rimadyl for four wks for a soft tissue injury, 10/4th within hours  after having his rimadyl with food he could barely stand, drinking loads & weeing lots, following morning my beautiful boy could not even stand, would not drink & could not even empty himself, just waiting for autopsy results to confirm.

i have but i just want to say how sorry i am to read of this you must be going thou hell (((hugs)))x

thank you white lilly for your kind words, hope you dont mind me asking, how long ago did it happen to you & was it confirmed, ie autopsy report, & did you report it to pfizer, i did, they are paying for autopsy.

so sorry carlasway that should of said havnt! :( hope you get some answers soon xx

I'm so sorry that you've lost your wonderful companion.     Horrible blow at such a young age.

Rimadyl, in common with other NSAIDs such as Metacam , can sadly not suit every dog, although reactions are pretty rare.

I had a problem with it, but the conditions were not the same as yours.    One of my beautiful bitches found a pot of the Palatable Rimadyl (don't ask how...not even for her:-( ) and ate the whole lot and part of the pot.    Straight into vets, and stomach washed out, but was devastated when her balance/brain was affected somehow, and she looked afterwards as if she's had a stroke.    Devastated, she never recovered. :-( :-(

From then on, if I needed it, I used ordinary Rimadyl (not palatable), but they don't seem to make it now.    I still use it on the odd occasion that I need it, but am still wary that reactions can an do occur, although my problem was presumably the result of an overdose.

Jo

my vet will only use it for serious illness and rarely will prescribe it .. he said he has seen to many deaths over the years with dogs that have been treated with it.

So very sorry to read that you lost your dog under such terrible circumstances.. {{hugs}}

thank you to everyone who responded to my enqury, & for all your kind words, just waiting for autopsy results, should get them soon now.

Carlasway
Firstly, I am so sorry, what a terrible tragedy, I can't imagine how you must feel.

I have not had it happen, but it happened to a labrador that was treated with it at my vets at the end of March. Within a couple of days the dog was very ill with similar sounding symptoms to yours, the Rimadyl was stopped after 4 tablets but the dog did not recover and was PTS on the 6th day from the day she was first given the Rimadyl. There was later a report in the Daily Mail about it, where our vet was calling for it to be withdrawn as unsafe, that would have been an edition in early April. The owners are also campaigning to outlaw the use of Rimadyl. If you want to contact them I am sure you can get their details from the local paper, the name of the owner (he printed it freely in his letter to the newspaper, so I am not giving away any secrets) is Robin McGibbon of Bickley, Kent. If you want to contact him about his campaign and can't trace him from that, let me know and I will give you the details of the local paper who will be able to put you in touch I expect.

I had a dog on Rimadyl for years with no problems, but I have heard of far too many serious side effects since those days that I would never use it now.

Again, I am so sorry.

Chinablue, thank you for the info, just checked out daily mail, & found the article you were refering to, cannot do anything at the moment, until i have got autopy report back, if rimadyl was the cause of my dogs demise i would be more than grateful for further info from you.

Chinablue, forgot to ask on my earlier reply to you, did your friends contact pfizer, i contacted them the day my dog had to be put to sleep and they arranged an autopsy to be done on my dog at their cost.

Carlasway
I don't actually know the people, I only know of it because it happened at my vets (and word travels fast), and it appeared in our local paper, so I don't know whether they contacted Pfizer. It seems that ultimately the Rimadyl is suspected to have caused kidney and liver failure. I also don't know whether they had an autopsy.  Unfortunately sometimes in these situations you are so upset that you don't necessarily think all that clearly until after the event, so it may be that they didn't.

Let me know if you want me to try and track down their contact details, or give you a starting point to get in touch with the paper who may give them your details, and I will see what I can do.

http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/leisure/pets/9619899.Bickley_couple_campaigning_for_drug_to_be_outlawed_after_beloved_dog_dies/

This says they didnt do a post mortem. There is an interesting comment from someone in the US who are suing Pfizer. You may be able to get your details passed on to the Burfords by the newspaper (News Shopper) to enable contact if you want to try and get in touch.

So sorry for your news.
I remember being told some years ago that Rimadyl had been refused a licence for human use, due to liver damage - don't know if there is any truth in it.

Hi CinaBlue, i have contacted the newsshopper paper, gave them a brief history & my contact details, hopefully they will pass it on to the couple who also lost their dog to a suspected adverse reaction to rimadyl , thank you for all the info you have passed onto me, will keep the forum posted once i get autopsy results back.

Hi Lacy, while researching the drug, after losing my dog, i came across some info that stated rimadyl was taken of the market for humans, because it was causing strokes & heart attacks, dont no how true that is, as far as i am aware after doing reseach on NSAIDS, they all carry a risk of potential damage to the liver, but alas in my case, the info came to late.

Firstly I would like to say I am sorry for your loss.
I lost my first flat coat aftyer an op for mouth cancer. She returned home on as you would expect on copious amounts of painkiller( Rimadyl) th eprognosis was good. 24 hours later she died of torsion and bloat. Further investigation by me revealed that in some sensitive dogs rimadyl can be aproblem and she had displayed the sympyoms you have commented on most particularly the copious drinling. Due to the op and the bloat not autopsy was thought necessary but O have always believed that rimadyl reaction had alarge part to play

> but O have always believed that rimadyl reaction had alarge part to play

Possibly but another strong possibility would be the anaesthetic for her operation as the bowels will stop working whilst anaesthetised and an ileus may remain for sometime after which would, clearly, offer a very great risk of bloat.
It is always very hard to say just how many cases can actually be atributed to the NSAID itself as, by their very nature, they are prescribed when the dog is often very ill anyway.
I do think all NSAIDs should be prescribed with great caution, particularly in the elderly, as they are in humans, but I do not think they should be banned as some dogs lives would not be of sufficient quality without them. 

Agreed stooge in Josie's case it would be impossible to tell think it was multifactorial. Would be wary of rimadyl in the future though

Sorry to hear about your loss also, have just been doing bit of research on bloat,  and come across some info that says bloat can also occur with liver damage, and as you know liver damage is a serious side effect from rimadyl
If you suspect that your dog is suffering from liver disease, here are some symptoms to look out for:

*Gastrointestinal upset such as vomiting and diarrhea
*Loss of appetite
*Depression and lethargy
*A swollen or distended belly
*Pale or gray feces
*Discolored urine
*Jaundice
*Increased urination and water consumption
*Severe neurological problems such as seizures or aimless pacing               http://www.vetinfo.com/causes-liver-disease.html   could it be possible that your dog may of had liver damage, hope this info is of help to you. my dog hada lot of these symptoms.

> bloat can also occur with liver damage, and as you know liver damage is a serious side effect from rimadyl

I would think it unlikely that the consequences of liver damage would be apparent within 24 hours.

(would think it unlikely that the consequences of liver damage would be apparent within 24 hours. )          Because of the liver's importance, acute or rapid onset liver failure can kill a dog within 24 hours, usually due to the dog consuming a toxic substance. Chronic liver failure takes longer,   http://www.helium.com/items/1118937-diagnosing-liver-failure-in-dogs.

Your link is reading out of date :)

(prescribed when the dog is often very ill anyway) my dog was a heathly 5yr old, who only had a limp in left foreleg  he was xrayed 6 days before he was put to sleep, xray results come back negative no  tumours & no arthritis, was diagonsed with soft tissue injury.

I am talking generally and just commenting that the incidence of harm in some cases may not be as it seems.

In Response to StoogeYour link is reading out of date )  i have just checked link out again, must be a technical problem as i gathered my info  from the site approx 12.20pm

  Stooge,  i have tried the link several times since posting it earlier  still no luck so i copied and pasted link onto search bar to access the page .    http://www.helium.com/items/1118937-diagnosing-liver-failure-in-dogs

I can access it now :)  I still think it is unlikely that the damage would occur, the liver stop functioning and toxins build up sufficiently in 24 hours and others factors should always be considered.

Hi Carlasway
I hope you have some luck. The good thing about Robin McGibbon is that he is an author (definitely) and ex journalist (I think), so may be able to make himself heard a bit more than us mere mortals.

Stooge, I disagree that Rimadyl is often prescribed when a dog is 'very ill'. NSAIDs are usually prescribed for arthritis or some similar ongoing but non life threatening condition, hardly what would be classed as very ill.

I found it interesting that Pfizer were recently required to list 'death' as a possible side effect in the USA upon the instruction of the FDA, and that they have paid out thousands in compensation claims there already, albeit without 'accepting' responsibility.

There is no doubt that some dogs are sensitive to Rimadyl, and that sensitivity can be extreme and tragic in some cases, I have no doubt of it in my mind. As I said, I had a dog on it for years without problems but I wouldn't touch it now. Frankly there are a wealth of other NSAID's with very good track records and no reported deaths, so we would not be depriving dogs of pain relief if it were banned, which I believe it should be. One death is too many IMO.  

Carlasway
I just had another thought. You might want to write to Paul Grant, the vet involved who is seeking for the drug to be banned. I am sure that he would be interested to hear of your experience too. Look up Tender Paws, Addington Road, West Wickham. He is very kind, and you never know it may help if he decides to take it to the RCVS.

How many young, fit dogs suffer arthritis generally?

How many have HD? There's your answer.

> How many have HD? There's your answer.

I don't know how many.  Are you saying a good percentage of young, otherwise fit dogs are medicated for arthritis? 

If they have HD, yes, because they're in pain.

I don't doubt it :) but I was asking about the frequency and I would still question that NSAIDs are not much more frequently used in more mature dogs that are therefore more likely to have moved into the era of more medical problems and it would be wrong not to consider this when trying to evaluate the risks and benefits of using them.

Hi furriefriends, i came across this article and thought you may  want to read it        8/6/99 Death #57: Vet Makes Diagnosis of Gastric Torsion; Necropsy Shows Symptoms Consistent with Toxic Reaction to Rimadyl
Breed: Chow Mix (female, "Maggie Mae")
Age: 5 years
Reason for Rimadyl rx: pulled ligament
Dog's weight and dosage taken: 70 lb, 75 mg 2x daily
When reaction occurred following initial dose: 4 weeks
Symptoms: violent vomiting; inappetance; paralysis on last day of her life
Date of death: July 18, 1999
Vet informed about side effects: NO; insisted Rimadyl could not cause side effects
Remarks on Dog's Rimadyl Experience: "Maggie was in very good health until Rimadyl. A week before she died, her appetite diminished. We thought it was due to the hot weather. When she began vomiting violently, I called our vet, who told me to give Maggie Pepto Bismol. She vomited that as well a short time after we gave it to her. I asked the vet if he thought Rimadyl could be the cause. He said, 'No way.' Maggie seemed to be getting progressively weaker, so on Sunday morning, we drove her 35 miles to the emergency clinic. Her blood pressure was so low, they couldn't even get a blood sample from her. The emergency clinic vet really worked to save her, but, at 4:00 that afternoon, Maggie died. I had been a loyal client of my vet for 30 years, but he's lost me now. He kept insisting that Maggie's death was caused by gastric torsion until the necropsy report came back. He finally called to tell us that the necropsy showed the kind of evidence that is consistent with Rimadyl toxicity. We miss Maggie so much. We raised her on a bottle. There will never be another Maggie."
phoneswa@zebra.net 

     

Chinablue, thanks for the further info will write to the vet.

So sorry for your loss,one of mine was prescribed rimadyl for lamness,after being on this drug she started to vomit and was poorly,only been on it a couple of days,took her off it just in time .thinking of you.

Sheilaxx

Thank you for that carlsaway very interesting. I think there was every likelhood that rimadyl contributed to her death but I never considered an autopsy and it wasnt suggested no doubt because the fed saw it as clear cut case of torsion. It wasnt until a few days later when someone mentioned it that I researched rimadyl and found the concerns particulalry from american research.
I woud be very wary of using it now giving there is so much evedience against it and you would never know until it is too late that a dog could be susceptible.
Sorry my experience connot help you research but i would like to see more testing done on this drug to confirm its safety
Chinablue just noticed you comment about Paul Grant I know his surgery ( we must live nearby each other) so will contact him to see if he wants any info from us
l

Stooge
How many young, fit dogs suffer arthritis generally?
Well, I would say plenty when you consider it is prescribed as an anti inflammatory which can be a whole host of injuries and conditions. I have just persuaded a friend of mine to take a 6 month pup with an injury off of it! JG makes an excellent point about HD too. Regardless of that, even with older dogs that may be taking it for arthritis it doesn't mean they are 'very ill'. Many are in perfect health apart from that non life threatening condition.  As I said before there are a whole range of other NSAIDs available that do not have these serious reported outcomes associated with them, so it would hardly be depriving the canine world of medical treatment. I think the point here is that this thread is discussing situations that enable us to evaluate the risks and benefits of this particular medication and the risks outweigh the benefits when there are alternatives available IMO.

However, it is personal choice and if you choose to use it then that is personal freedom at work.

Furriefriends
Indeed we may! We may even know each other. It would be great if you could send him your information as well. So sorry to hear of your terrible experience, sad and tragic.

> I think the point here is that discussing situations that enable us to evaluate the risks and benefits

Do you really think we can do that when we have no idea of the statistics of its uneventful use or reported adverse reactions?
Even hearing peoples anecdotal evidence does not seem to lead us all to the same conclusion :)  Certainly, in many of the case studies offered I really can't see how people seem to have excluded other factors, but they do.
As, I say I would use it with caution and the data sheet does list the contraindications and risks but it does provide a good medication for others.

we may do is that a black gsd in your avatar ? or have you got my WHispa lol
Will contac Paul and see if he is interested

Stooge
I personally have my own baseline for making judgements, you will have yours, others will have their own unique measurement. Mine includes drugs in which there have been many reported incidences of death shortly after use, anecdotal or not. I haven't heard of 'anecdotal' deaths of dogs on the other NSAIDs. Call that a simplistic comparison, but it isn't rocket science to me.  It includes evaluating information about the drug company which has paid out thousands of dollars in compensation claims against the drug for the death of dogs (I believe over 3,300 claims paid). Drug companies will not accept responsibility (and neither will many vets) if they can possibly avoid it. I am one of those who had an uneventful use when my dog was on it thankfully, it doesn't mean that had I known then what I 'know' now, I would have opted to use it, I wouldn't. I would be weighing up the risk. I don't like that risk.  If there were no alternatives to Rimadyl I would agree that the risk would have to be taken in some situations, but that's not the case.

I cannot see any unique benefit that Rimadyl has over the other NSAIDs so, for me, I cannot see the reason for it being considered a good medication for any dog, when those 'possible' risks are factored in. My opinion, mine alone. But now have a vet who is saying yes, I believe Rimadyl was responsible for this dogs death. Power to him, they don't often stand up and be counted.

Furriefriends - Yes, that is a black GSD and not it is not your Whispa LOL. You don't have a Chihuahua as well do you?

> I haven't heard of 'anecdotal' deaths of dogs on the other NSAIDs. Call that a simplistic comparison, but it isn't rocket science to me

I'm afraid it's not science, no :)

We have a system for reporting adverse reactions and I think we should always use that but I think it is wrong to campaign for a drug to be discontinued simply because we have not heard of other NSAD being equally risky.  For all you know you may be limited the market choice to one with worse statistics!
I believe the scientific evidence should drive these things and we should use the systems that are in place to assist that.

Stooge
That is your belief system, and that's fine. Read a little about our reporting system and how and when vets decide to use it, if at all. Nice if things worked the way they were meant to, sadly it doesn't always happen that way. Unfortunately many vets will not accept that a drug that they have administered could be at fault, whether it is Rimadyl, or something like a vaccine reaction. Many are far too cosy with the drug companies too. So they will not report it. The Daily Mail article does I believe point out some of the flaws in our adverse reporting system.

You can stick with your scientific evidence, I will stick to my own non-scientific approach of deciding whether to take such risks with my dogs.  Again, one dog that has died as a direct result of Rimadyl is one too many IMO, and I think there are far, far more. Everyone is entitled to their views, and to discuss these possible deaths and whether they may be due to a drug reaction. At best, it may alert people to the events linked to Rimadyl, and allow to them 'non-scientifically'  decide whether they too wish to take that risk.

> I will stick to my own non-scientific approach of deciding whether to take such risks with my dogs. 

I would totally agree with that but campaigning for others not to use deserves real evidence.
There will always be dogs, or humans for that matter, who react adversely to drugs but equally there will be others who lives are improved and prolonged and therefore the risks and benefits should be properly assessed.  Whatever faults people may find with our current reporting systems I cannot imagine a "belief" system would be an improvement.

Yep I do and a flatcoat but more likely to see the chi with Whispa. Gosh I hope they were behaving. Although Paul Grant is not my vet I have heard good things about him and know he favours the more natural approach to treating dogs and also is happy for people to raw feed unlike some vets 

Furriefriends
I believe I may have met you and chatted with you briefly one day at Sparrows Den a while back with Whispa and your Chi! Yes they were very well behaved LOL. I have two GSDs, my black boy and a black and gold LC girl too. I think we remarked how similar our two black GSDs were!

Yes, Paul Grant is very much a holistic/homeopathic vet and an advocate of raw feeding. Not in the pockets of drug companies or the dog food companies LOL.

My method is not simply a random 'belief system' it is to some degree evidence based, not least of which is the number of reported deaths due to Rimadyl reaction in the USA (as reported under their system of reporting adverse reactions to the FDA). My belief system is how I choose to interpret that knowledge and information to make my own decision, and balance it against using another NSAID which has no reported deaths associated with it. But here I just risk repeating myself.

In Britain, animal pharmaceuticals are licensed and monitored by the Veterinary Medicines Directorate (VMD), a branch of the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs.
It runs a system of reporting bad reactions to drugs called the Suspected Adverse Reaction Surveillance Scheme (SARS), but this is discretionary, not compulsory.
Harvey Locke, past president of the British Veterinary Association, says there might be a case for making reporting mandatory, but adds: 'There would need to be strict guidelines laying down exactly when a report should be made. At present it is up to the discretion of the vet.'
Mr Locke, in common with most vets, believes carprofen is perfectly safe in most cases, but he and his colleagues have no way of knowing how many animals are reacting badly to it. Here's why.
Carprodyl, the branded carprofen that was given to Abby, was given a licence for Buckinghamshire-based Ceva Animal Health in 2008.
Potential side-effects listed on the Veterinary Medicines Directorate website include 'vomiting, soft faeces/diarrhoea, faecal occult blood, loss of appetite and lethargy', which 'in very rare cases may be serious or fatal'. It also lists rare incidences of gastro-intestinal bleeding.
However, as side-effects do not have to be reported to the VMD, there is no way of knowing the true scale of the problem.
'I have treated dozens of dogs where these drugs have upset their stomach, but this would not come under SARS reporting,' says Mr Locke.
Disturbingly, when I repeatedly asked the VMD how many adverse reports it had received about drugs containing carprofen, I was initially told 'it would not be simple' to find out. Later I was told I would have to make a Freedom of Information request for the figures, which could take six weeks.
In the U.S., adverse reaction figures are freely available from the FDA to any member of the public. In Britain, pet owners are told the figures could be 'commercially sensitive' -- even though the same drug companies operate in both countries. excerpt from Daily Mail.  Please note the section that says reporting is 'up to the discretion of the vet'. One has to question why such information requires a Freedom of Information request. If such information is protected from the public rather than being freely available FOR the protection of the public I think a belief system may actually be an improvement.

Whether you agree with it or not, anyone has the right to campaign against something that they believe has been harmful. It is then for the appropriate bodies to decide whether or not to do so. If you have shares in Pfizer, you need to take a view as to whether they might be successful and whether it will affect the share price. Up against such a big drug company - I doubt it very much.

Carlasway
Another thought that occurs to me following my above post, please make sure that your vet DOES report this under SARS. Make a request to that effect.