>KC have allready started restricting the amount of sections a bitch is allowed(rightly so)

Which has got to mean that I am ahead of the game at last!  :-)

For literally years, I have refused to have more than one section out of a bitch.  Remember, it is important to really understand the difference in breeding these smaller dogs.  As Barbara so rightly points out in her breed, there are bitches that have whelped naturally, and only required sections due to malpresentations etc.  What my vet terms as bloody bad luck.

With the Chis I have always homed whole litters as pets simply because mum has needed a section, or had inertia.  I am not saying this applies to other breeds.  I am saying that in my experience over the years it has proved to be the right thing.  But, naturally, it does take years.  At the very beginning I kept a bitch out of a bitch that had inertia.  Lesson number 1!  Said bitch  also had inertia.  I don't know if this is passed down the line by males as well as females.  I have just never taken chances.  I knew all along what my aim was.  I will point out that the bitches are spayed and kept as much loved pets.  So, although I have a lot of dogs, I don't have a lot of breeding dogs.

Bear in mind that my mentor shows, breeds, and judges.  Apart from visiting when I have litters, and pointing out what I should keep, I also visit them and have a critical look at their youngsters.  Four years ago we both chose the same bitch out of two litters I had bred.  She was the right size to show, and I decided that this was the bitch that I would use IF my vet agreed.  I have obviously, in the past bred correct size show pups from large bitches. 

It is incorrect to assume that a small bitch that can self whelp will not be to breed standard.  It is something that someone with no experience of the breed may think.  They are assuming it alters the outside of a bitch as opposed to the inside.  If that makes sense.  God, I could write a book on this flippin' subject! 

It's probably easier to understand if I mention a bitch that I bred from years ago.  She weighed 9lbs!!!!   Breed standard is 2-6lbs and, although the KC changed the wording of the required size over 2 years ago now, I was already breeding to the 4 - 6lbs that is now the standard.  The 9lbs bitch had what one would term "child bearing hips"  but she needed a section.  She was spayed, and I learned my lesson.  She was too narrow inside, even though she was broad in the beam.

It is why I have such a close relationship with my vet.  He admires what I am trying to achieve here.  Even though I know he must get fed up of me getting him to check what I am not able to.  I would always doubt myself anyway.  He is used to feeling the insides of dogs all the time.  Oh yes, and he does my eye tests for me.

Probably most on CD won't know, but I don't keep smooths (too aloof for me), and have only ever bred Long Coats (far more like a Yorkie in temperament but far easier to housetrain.)  But longs take so very long to reach real coat quality.  Although my mentor shows babies, I know one particular show kennel that will only take a pup to ringcraft, but it won't be shown until adulthood.  I think coats reach their best around 3 years to be honest, but that is only my opinion.  I am sure that some breeders won't agree.  But this post is about my own observations.  Just to be clear.  :-) 

I have only been to a few shows with my mentor over the last few years, due to an illness that has deteriorated because it was undiagnosed.  Wonderful what a change of doc can do!  But hey, I have always been better at choosing the right vet.  :-)  I don't intend to harp on about it, and I hate disclosing personal stuff.  But the last ditch attempt is Mycophenolate Mofetil and I haven't long started the drug.  I need to have bloods taken every 14 days to monitor things, as it can cause liver damage.  I have my hopes pinned on this one.  But if it doesn't work, and I don't get a dog in the show ring, I will still be working on what I intend to achieve.  Yes, it is a long road.  I don't have a litter every year, and the pups produced have to be right for my needs.  But I adore this breed that have never been in a handbag, and play on the compost heap with the Collies, because they are allowed to be dogs.

Can I have a boast now?  Recently had a person visit who does competitive obedience with BC's and keeps Rotties.  I didn't know when she arrived with hubby that she is also a temperament assessor.  I was making coffee, and they had followed my gang up the garden.  I received an email after, saying the tots are a credit to me and how amazingly everybody gets on.  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  Now that is worth smiling about.

jean :) :) :) well done!!

> Actually, in my breed it isn't necessarily that they might be too small to be bred from, just that a larger brood bitch would be considered more suitable. But said larger bitch would not do as well in the ring....

Ive opted to avoid this thread as there are so many old arguments here BUT
I cannot let this factually incorrect statement hang out there in the ether.

As someone who actually owns last years Top Brood bitch in your breed...Cavlover..... a small ( at the lower end of the weight scale)- toy - example of her breed who has won well right up to a RCC.....  and had all her puppies naturally with NO vet intervention at all...I feel I must put this straight.
"a larger brood bitch would be considered more suitable. But said larger bitch would not do as well in the ring"

Other than commercial breeders ( who may feel size is linked with maximum yield) I cannot think of a single ethical breeder who would think this.

> It is incorrect to assume that a small bitch that can self whelp will not be to breed standard

Why would anyone assume that?  I can not sure we can assume the opposite either :). 

It is only something I have been told Tooolz.....
Edited to say - there are still plenty of show people who do not show every bitch they breed from ... for whatever reason? And they are people you would consider reputable :-)

Fabulous Jean, you should be very proud :-)

It is only something I have been told Tooolz.....

A rumour, in other words. Like all the ones going about saying "It's no point showing as it's the person on the other end of the lead that is being judged, not the dog."

As I said earlier -breeding from an incorrect size only gives you pups of an incorrect size so why would show people do it?

>there are still plenty of show people who do not show every bitch they breed from ... for whatever reason? And they are people you would consider reputable

There are plenty of people who own books but I wouldnt call them all intelligent.

I only breed from bitches which adhere well to the breed standard and can prove it. Im pretty familiar with that standard but know of many, many people who treat dog shows like a large raffle, they truly believe they may get their lucky ticket pulled and win......giving no regard to the fact their dog may not be of sufficient quality to deserve it.

They just cant see it, they have no eye.. and instead of using the show ring as a quality contol system, they think they know best and breed regardless.
These same people can be seen decades later, moaning that 'faces' win, 'their dogs are not in the right hands' or 'my litter by my Trixie to my Bobbie are as good as anything by those champions'.
Our breed is full of them, grinding out pet puppies whos bloodlines just conveniently all hail from a very small geographical area...no point wasting money on a fab dog 500 miles away...... right?

"'my litter by my Trixie to my Bobbie are as good as anything by those champions"

Well, such people are just ignorant aren't they?

I have and always will, travel many miles for the right dog.... you would indeed have to be very lucky to have a suitable dog for your bitch in your own immediate area, I suppose it does happen, but seldom. And I take any advice offered to me by an experienced exhibitor very seriously ;-)