Hi All,

I've been looking for a 'sport' or something extra to do with Nando (9 month old GSD) apart from his general training. I have been looking and looking and not really found anything that takes my fancy. He has a nice pedigree with some showing in his lines. Many people tell me he is a show quality dog but to be completely honest with you they are just general observers we meet in the park.

Anyway.. this turned my thoughts to showing him. I think he would love all the fuss and attention as he does have this presence that just asks for everyone to look at him.

What steps do I need to take? I understand I need to attend a ring craft class, but to be honest I think his general obedience needs a bit of work before ring craft can be considered I think. What should of things should I start doing at home with him?

Also, have I missed the boat, do you need to start the training from a young pup?

Here is a picture of him. Probably not in a full show stance but it is the closest I can get! Is he 'good enough' to be entered in shows/ring craft?
http://img.tapatalk.com/516ffd64-2e55-4eba.jpg

Josh

The basics for the dog to learn in the ring is to accept a person handling him all over while he stands quietly (including checking he has testicles) and for him to stand alertly, and moving at a trot on a loose lead around the ring.

Nothing to stop you going to ringcraft, as there he will learn to be around dogs socially without them being a big deal, you will make friends and there are bound to be schedules for local Open shows which others there will be going to and you simply enter.

In the show world there is a split between types of GSD and so at championship level often based on the judge or club will depend on which type is likely to find favour.

At Open shows it often doesn't really apply ans classes are not over large at general Open shows as there are so many breed specific clubs and shows for the breed.

You won't know unless you try and an Open show will set you back less than £10 in entry fees for several classes, there's the fuel of course too.

Try to enter a few shows while he is still a puppy (entries generally have to be in anything from 4 weeks to 2 months before the show) as that way he will be up against less experienced dogs like himself, even if the owners are experienced and judges will give a puppy more leeway.

Would add one thing GSDs are often shown in a different manner to most dogs and you will need to be fit yourself as it requires a large amount of running round and round the ring. Would suggest if you have a show with GSD classes you go and watch a class or two.

Why not! I'm no expert on the breed but he looks a handsome boy and nicely attentive to you - I have no idea about the finer points of breed type (either type!!) though. Try some ringcraft, and do some companion shows over the summer and see how you get on. If you just go expecting a nice day out, making some friends, and just wait to see what colour rosettes might come your way, you should have some fun! For open shows he also needs to be KC registered, if he is that's fine, if not you can still do the companion shows.

If I owned a 9 month old male GSD Id be going to obedience classes, waiting until hes around 12 months old to have his hips and elbows scored and depending on the outcome.....start working trials training.

You will see what your fantastic dog can really do, you will be astounded, and proud of what he is capable of, it will truly open your eyes.

It wont stop you showing him but will give him ( and you) such amazing mental stimulation he will be fit for any discipline.

Just my opinion.

In a way showing 'only' does seem a waste of potential in the ultimate working breed :)

When we went to 1-on-1 classes with him, the trainer really wanted him to do scentwork etc in the future. He has a major flaw in that is recall is terrible and dispite all of my training it's never going to be something he excels at. He is definitely a dog that likes to perform as and when it suits :') I do think though that something as high energy as working trials would really keep his focus!

This thread has given me lots of food for thought so I'll hopefully be able to find a ringcraft or a working trials club that I can attend to simply spectate!

There is a local dog event aimed at long coat GSDs that has 'for fun' shows. Would that be a good place to take him or will it not be the type of standard that I should be looking towards?

When I had GSD's we joined a mountain rescue team in Wales and went out onto the mountains doing some search and rescue traing. The dogs loved it and so did we just a shame we could not continue for various reasons (Divorce being the main one LOL ) Maybe there is something within reach of you (Snowdonia nat park ?) that has a search and rescue team you could join. We only met about once a month but could practice anywhere. We often used to split up and one of us hide for the dogs to "Find" Great fun
Aileen

Have a look here :- http://www.sardaengland.org.uk/

> He has a major flaw in that is recall is terrible

I would be surprised if it was good as a 9 month old pup ;)

Your post is really reassuring! Everyone seems to think 9 months is 'old' and he should be perfectly behaved! I know it's hogwash but when someone says something enough times I'd start to believe it lol.

When we took Nando to the beach today we let him off his lead for the first time in a loong time. He came back if he could see a dog in the distance but we put him back on the long line. We really do need a pictures forum here as I took some lovely photos on my phone!

When Nando gets switched on to tracking and searching, he will be very unlikely to want to run off from the fun. They get very focused on the task and the rewards they get really drive them to please their handler.
Recall will not be a problem :-)
A 9 month old GSD is just a big baby!

He's definitely a big baby! He is the soppiest dog we've ever had.

Everyone seems to think 9 months is 'old' and he should be perfectly behaved

If its any consolation my first shepherd was about 9/10 months and a soppy puppy handful most of the time
................ and people said when he gets to a year he will settle

.................... so he got to a year

................ and people said when he gets to 18 months he will settle

.................... so he got to eighteen months

................ and people said when he gets to two years he will settle

.................... so he got to twenty two months...............and developed an adult brain in about a fortnight :-D :-D

There is light at the end of the tunnel its just quite a long tunnel with Shepherds!!!        my middle shepherd and current one both grew brains by eighteen months
Chris

I have a 14 month old Elkhound who acts and thinks like a baby. 

In this breed I tell everyone they are puppies until two years old, and then not true adults until 4.

They can work, and pick things up very quickly, bore easily, but you won't get that work ethic and concentration until they are around 3 to 4 years old.

>Everyone seems to think 9 months is 'old' and he should be perfectly behaved!

9 months is only just out of Minor Puppy classes - to expect adult behaviour from such a baby is preposterous!

It makes me sad to think he won't be his silly puppy self when he grows up! I feel very differently when he is being a very silly (read: slightly annoying) puppy but now he is nice and calm I don't want him to be grown up! haha

9 months is only just out of Minor Puppy classes - to expect adult behaviour from such a baby is preposterous!
I agree! Try telling that to people we meet in the park ;)

Yet they would probably baby an adult small breed. :( or think it funny nwhen it misbehaved.

> Yet they would probably baby an adult small breed.

Totally agree...for some reasons bigger dogs are expected to grow up and be more 'educated' because of their size, way before smaller dogs are. I guess it's just the size thing, and I do think it's unfair, as many bigger dogs are labelled as unruly when in fact their owners can be working with them dawn to dusk.

Just wanted to add, I don't often think much of GSDs, to me they just look fat and clumsy compared to Malinois <grin> and I really don't like  the banana backs (ducks for cover here) but gosh, YOUR dog is STUNNING, I'd have him myself in a heartbeat!!!

Marianne - have you seen any of the current lines of working GSDs (forget the show types). Not wanting to create a divide but they are dogs that look like they can do the job and have the physique to do it. I could grumble about their colour and big ears but I might well prefer one of them, through looks, than some of the working line Malinois.

Tell me about it! The amount of times people have taken great delight in telling me my dog should be better behaved, when they can't even get control of their toy breed dog!

Thanks Marianne, I am a bit bias but he is definitely a handsome dog. I was very careful when selecting his breeder as I wanted dogs of his type, not the 'half frog half dog' GSDs that you sometimes see, or even worse the over sized HUGE ones that look like a Burmese Mountain Dog cross!

Sorry but is this :- http://www.burmesemountaindog.org/

the BUrMese mountain dog you mean ! LOL Try BerNese
Aileen

Nah Josh I think the heavy huge ones your thinking of look like Leonberger or St Bernard Crosses.

A lady I know from obedience has the hugest ugliest headed dog I have ever seen for a GSD.  He is Jowly wrinkly and heavy in the head with huge floppy ears.  His feet are like flat dinner plates and he is so slab sided he steps on his own feet.  His only redeeming feature is a soppy friendly temperament, but he isn't very bright.

I'm another middle of the road fan.  I like to see daylight under them, more compactness in body, and good but not excessive angulation and no banana back.  It would help if they showed the dogs four square like every other breed.  If their construction is balanced they should be able to stand this way.

What does slabsided mean? I'm often left puzzled after reading breed standards, some of the terminology is baffling when you're not used to various breeds :(

> What does slabsided mean?

The opposite really of well sprung.  It means that the dog is flat in the ribcage, so seen from above the body and chest is narrow.

> It would help if they showed the dogs four square like every other breed.  If their construction is balanced they should be able to stand this way.

Yes, I know the standard (I think?) calls for a sloping topline or something but I often find myself looking at them stood for show and thinking the exaggerated stance just makes them look totally unbalanced, all front end and head and no back legs at all! A lot of them would look much more balanced if stood normally.

I don't suppose you'd link to a photo of a slabsided dog and a well sprung one? Pretty please?

Not a picture of a dog but does think help you visualise it?
http://www.prt-jrt.com/spanning/spanning1.html

hehe thanks Stooge, I googled after posting and got to that site too! It helps a little! :)

Hehe.. I do wonder how many breeders get asked for own of these, as in not the incorrect spelling/pronunciation but the descriptive of one, lol...

I would be interested to see how Nando does been biased towards long hairs and have seen pics of Nando since very little and heard all about him he is certainly one standard coat that could change my mind. Would love to see what "judges " think I also dont like the slopping back with almost no back legs
I do however agree that showing would be good but also using the gsd wonderful working talents coul dbe the better way to go .
As afellow gsd owner oh yes what a long tunnel until they grow up Whispa is now 4 nearly 5 and what a beautiful adult temperment he has developed yes still has his foibles but he is now a man !

He's a real beauty!

GSD's aren't my breed but I would be proud of him if he was mine.

I think I would try him with some kind of work...it would be a shame not to.

Sorry Josh, he is a lovely looking GSD, good strong rear to him and non of this over sloped back end.. Not seen one like this in a long time..good luck if you do show him. There are many obedience, shutzhund or working trials clubs in the north west. Most are GSD dominated too.. Normally a google search will bring up details :-)

See Josh I told you he was lovely and good specimen and now you have heard it from the real knowledgeable people. have a go and then do some working stuff as well. AS for you study well no time for that lol

I have found this club;

http://www.wats.org.uk/

(The word 'Alsatian' puts me off but I think the club goes back a looong while so I'll let them off ;) ) which looks quite good. I think I'd have to do the KC bronze award before they'd let me do any agility or obedience with them, but I am taking it that I'd need to move onto working trials from obedience so I may as well get started with the basics?

Here are a few more pictures of Nando for all your help.. he is in his new harness and looks like a police dog IMO!
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a332/josh7456/photo3-2.jpg
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a332/josh7456/photo2-2.jpg
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a332/josh7456/photo1-2.jpg

Go along on your own unannounced one day and see what you think. You may not like the 'feel' of the club or the training.

Have you a BAGSD branch near you? And have you looked to see if there is a Schutzhund group you can get to? How about looking up nearby trainers to see if any have done, or do, WT?

Don't go to a club simply because it's the only one you can get to, or the most convenient to get to. I am sure other people as well as myself, will back that up with their experiences.

Have you looked to see if there are any Working Trials in your area? Go along to look if you can.

With regard to showing, Companion shows [used to be called Exemption shows] are a fun way to get experience and usually benefit a charity as well. They are informal but almost always have people who show "properly" as competitors or organisers. Great for getting Nando used to the whole idea of being in a ring with other dogs, and getting you used to moving out with your dog in a ring - I was petrified the first time I was asked to do a triangle with my dog, last year - but better there than in a more competitive atmosphere.

As it turned out we didn't do so badly because I had been to a few 'proper' shows and watched what was done, so I tried to copy what I'd seen, and we'd done some garden practice as well. In fact one lady turned to me afterwards and said "Your girl moves really well" and that meant more to me than the Best Veteran rosette and cup we took home... because it meant my inexperienced handling had still allowed her to show herself to advantage... gave me a huge glow of pride :)

I second the suggestion re. Working Trials - there's another thread running on here with some ideas re. where to look.  It's a really friendly sport which strengthens your bond with your dog and really challenges his brain & body.

Thanks for all your help, I've looked for Schutzhund and to be honest it's a little while away. I can't have access to the car all the time and I do work weekends so I can't get to it anyway. I'm not too keen on Schutzhund in the first place, to be honest.