Was asked a question today and while I think I know the answer was not 100% sure I might not have missed some sort of update.  One of my big problems with the scheme (of which I am a member) is that while it requires eye testing in one of my breeds, it does not require a pass.  This means that 2 spaniels both tested as affected with HC could be mated and the offspring registered, even though all offspring are guaranteed to go down with HC.  I have repeatedly brought this up with the KC representatives, and have had trotted out the usual line about tests being subjective, and you can't have pass or fail for things like hipscores - nothing which is relevant to my question about failed eye tests.

Does anyone know has there been a recent chance in the AB rules which now make the test results relevant, not just the tests themselves?   I haven' t received anything about this, but the person I was talking with thought they had read something to say tests had now to be positive to allow offspring to be registered.  Any enlightment appreciated.

In the film made recently by the KC Caroline Kisko said that they 'expected' Assured Breeders to only breed from dogs with good results.

I registered a litter a few weeks ago, and it did ask if the bitch had had to have a C section or if she'd had any in the past.

The only evidence of a policy by the KC that I have found relates specifically to PRA rcd4 in Gordon Setters. However the advice is easily applied to all breeds who are susceptible to similar genetic conditions. It is all common sense and in fact mirrors exactly the rules we use for accepting litters on Champdogs.

http://www.britishgordonsetterclub.co.uk/Health.htm

Advice issued by the KC Official Scheme

In Gordons Carriers are clinically normal & will not go blind.

All breeding stock should be DNA tested for PRA rcd4 before breeding.

If DNA test result is Clear, there are no restrictions on breeding in relation to PRA rcd4.

If the result is that the dog is a Carrier, there is no reason not to breed from a Carrier of PRA rcd4 if it is of good quality, type, temperament & general health to avoid the risk of losing breed type. You must not mate a Carrier to an untested Dog. Do not mate to another Carrier (1 in 4 puppies could be Affected and go blind) Do not mate to an Affected (1 in 2 puppies could be Affected and go blind). Mating Carrier to Clear will result in 50% of puppies being Carriers and 50% Clear, none of which will go blind. The breeder can then identify which puppies are clear & if of good type use those for breeding. If no good quality Clear puppies result, the dog can be breed again to Clear until good quality Clear puppy(s) produced for breeding.

If Affected, a dog can still be bred from if it is of good type, general health & temperament, using a Clear. This will produce all Carrier puppies, which can then enter the breeding programme as above if of good quality and they will not go blind.

There is no need to test all puppies before they are sold as the breeder can endorse those puppies' pedigrees & have them DNA tested before breeding if either parent is Affected or Carrier to ascertain how to proceed when choosing a mate. The puppies pedigrees should initially be endorsed 'Not to be Bred From.' To do this the puppy must be in the ownership of the breeder at the time of endorsement; the breeder has to put in writing to the new owner that the pedigree is endorsed, why & under what circumstances it will be lifted and this has to be signed as acceptable by the new owner(s). If this is done the KC will not lift the endorsement without the breeder's consent.

Once the KC scheme starts those dogs that have been previously tested can send a copy of their official results to the KC to be added to the Database & have new Registration issued.

At present ID verification is not compulsory but is preferable as this guarantees the sample has been taken from the dog in whose name the test is submitted. This is done by a Vet who checks the dog's microchip or tattoo at the same time as they take the DNA sample.

We must not run the risk of losing breed type by excluding all but Clear dogs from the breeding programme. Both Carriers & Affecteds can be safely used if bred to Clear.

Thanks Mark, I rang them today  and they confirmed the reg is "as was" no change has been made.

With something like DNA tested affected, you could breed to clear and produce a litter of healthy carrier pups, who then in turn could be mated to clear, and produce statistically half clear, so thereby getting rid of the gene, but not the genetic input of the affected animal, so preserving it's good traits,and keeping genetic diversity.

I can see no ethical reason to use a clinically affected animal where there is no DNA test, as you cannot be sure any animal is clear ofthe gene only clinically unaffected, so coudl be a carrier,a dn risk producing more affected offspring.

So I see no difficulty for the KC to rule that clinically affected animals for any conditon cannot be used, unless a definitive DNA test exists that allows their safe use, ie avoiding producing affected offspring.

Brainless, this is a point I have been making with them since the start of the scheme, and I was one of the founder members!  They just trot out the excuse that not all tests have pass/fail status, some have to be interpreted, which in no way affects those that do have pass/fail!  When I rang to clarify today, just in case a change had sneaked through and I missed it was explained to me they can't really make people do anything, so best to leave the choice open and hope they have the sense not to do such a mating!

This disparity is exactly why I refuse to become an AB. My personal standards are MUCH higher than those required by the K.C. ( and I told Bill Lambert so at length last year.)