Hi guys,
just after some much needed advice really. We have a litter of puppies now 8 days old. Unfortunately we lost the smallest pup from the litter on Tuesday. We put it down to the fact that she was weak and never really nursed well from the bitch from day one. She was very slow to get going after birth and I never thought she would last as long as she did. She did seem to pick up with the help of Puppystim and we also topped her up with a bottle as she wasn't feeding too well from mum. Anyway she stopped feeding on Monday, went quiet and looked like a floppy doll. Our vet gave her saline injections to rehydrate her and she was given antibiotics but sadly she pased away on Tues morning. Last night I noticed another puppy, a big strong pup not feeding as vigourously as it had been. Over the night it went quiet and has now stopped feeding just like the last one. I am fearing that its the start of Puppy Fade Syndrome and can't bear to lose another puppy. We are heading back up to our vet now with this puppy. I am at my wits end. I haven't had the bitch vaccinated for CHV as she had a litter last time with no problems. Not sure what to do really :(

CHV does not survive well when the temperature is above normal body temperature, which is why ti affects puppies whose body temperature does not reach adult for the first three weeks and the pups are unable to mount a fever response.

So keeping them really warm will be of some benefit.

This article may be useful: http://showdogsupersite.com/kenlclub/breedvet/vhr2.html and this: http://www.2ndchance.info/herpesvirusdog.htm

Thanks Barbara, we have the whelping room nice and toasty and I have a room thermometer in the room as well so I can monitor that it doesn't drop. Bloody gutted that this has happened :(

There are several past threads on this subject on the forum. Have you run a search using the facility to see if they hold any help/suggestions? Please keep us posted. I am sure everyone will be wishing them well.

Thanks Admin, I will certainly keep you posted.

I was obssessed with making sure the whelping room/area was very warm for those first few weeks, crate in front of the gas fire when Mum didn't want to be upstairs during the day after the first week, I had read that this was the only way the pups could fight off this infection.

I hope the rest of the pups thrive, the weather at the moment is so changeable it is harder to maintain those higher temperatures for pups but allow Mum to cool off when she wants to.

Keep us posted.

Don't know much about Fading Puppy but a friend of mine had her litter and had exactly the same problem as you. First puppy wasn't doing too well for a week then they lost her. As soon as they did another puppy (who had been fine up to that point) starting doing exactly the same thing. This time i urged her to go more quickly to her Vet, who was rubbish, and so I took her off to my Vet. My Vet noticed that the back of the palate was quite sore and said that if they are taking the teat in and then it is sore then they spit it out. (Now I suppose that the infection could have been caught from the first puppy) He put her on Synulox drops immediately, puppy stim and told her to syringe feed very two hours. The 'pup' is now about 18 months old and I am convinced that if it hadn't been for my Vet she would have lost her. I realise that this may not be the same scenario but if your Vet is approachable then maybe he can take a look at the back of the palate and see if he believes it to be sore. I have got everything crossed for you.

We have recently gone through something very similar with our litter. Puppies stopping feeding, going quiet and limp and subsequently dying within a couple of days. We had a post mortem done on one pup and the results came back as indicative of herpes virus. I'd urge you to look into giving the pups blood serum from a bitch recently vaccinated against the herpes virus. Our remaining pups have done brilliantly so if this could be the problem with yours it could save your pups too.

I have everything crossed for you, I know just what you will be going through and wish I was able to help.

X

Hi guys, thanks for the replys really appreciate it.
Took the poorly pup to our vet yesterday, she had saline injections and antibiotics but this morning is no better. My vet said it does look like Herpes virus but can't make a diagnosis until unfortunatley the puppy dies to see what exectly we're dealing with. I have her seperarated from the other pups in another room on a heat pad and have been trying to feed her every 2 hrs but to no avail. I have scrubbed the whelping room from head to toe in disinfectant and am changing my clothes regulary. He has started the other pups on Synulox drops just as a precaution to ward of secondary infection  and its just a waiting game really. I did tell him about people who have had blood serum therapy and he asked me to gather as much info as possible as he would be willing to give it a go if it is herpes so any advice of anyone who has had it recently done would be greatly appreciated. Is it possibel that some pups won't be infected? The remaining 7  at the moment are feeding well aged 9 days.
Please keep my pups in your prayers.
Thanks x

Just to add if it turns out to be herpes and we need a donor does the donor have to be recently vaccinated against CHV and how long? A friend has a bitch who had a litter Last Oct and she was vaccinated against CHV would she be suitable? Do you only inject pups if they are showing signs of fading or do it as a precaution once you know its litet mates died of herpes? Sorry for all the questions but my head is spinning and I keep watching the pups for the next one to fade :(

We were told the donor needed to have been vaccinated during a recent pregnancy and ideally be around 4 to 8 weeks post whelp and not be on antibiotics. Once you recieve the blood it takes the vets a couple of hours to spin it and get the serum.

All the pups should be injected with it as a precaution as it'll give them immunity.

Even if you don't know for definate it's herpes you can still do it, I wouldn't wait for a post mortem. When we had ours done the results took about 6 days to come back so it's a lot of time wasted.

It's such a nightmare and I so feel for you, I know the dread of watching and waiting for another to go quiet.

I hope you can find a donor. We had a fantastic person help us through champdogs. A poster called snomaes and also jayne.sbt also very kindly offered to help, maybe you could pm them and see if they are still in a position to help.

> I hope you can find a donor. We had a fantastic person help us through champdogs. A poster called snomaes and also jayne.sbt also very kindly offered to help, maybe you could pm them and see if they are still in a position to help.

Just thinking aloud - someone on here recently mentioned having chilled semen sent by courier from Europe, so if you can't find a local donor, maybe blood or serum could be sent to you by courier somehow?

Hi, I cross posted for you on orphaned puppies fb group.

Have pm'd you King of Bling

Hi guys,
sorry just getting back to you all now...had a postmortem done last night on the last pup that died. The puppy had an grossly enlarged liver, kidneys and all other organs looked normal. He said that looking at the liver it is indicative of a bacterial infection but as he's not a pathologist and he has taken samples to be sent to a lab and we will have results back on Monday. In the meantime I still need to find a donor as he isn't 100% that its not herpes. Thank you everyone for your support, soo lovely that there are soo many good people out therea nd I really apprecaite all your hep and support don't now ghow I would be getting through these days without you all. I have rang every other vet surgery in N.Ireland I can think off but no one seems to use the CHV vaccine. I am ringing ANCU vets in Newry this morning as a last resort. I have had a kind offer of a lady in UK who has offered to send blood and this may be my best bet as if taken today we will have the blood tomorrow by courier where my vet can then spin it down. I am hoping that it isn't herpes but I just can't sit and wait till monday because if it is it will be too late.
xx

Found a donor in Scotland just need a courier any ideas?

Aother thing does anyone know how much blood is to be taken from the bitch? x

Fedex?

I would ask your vet about how much..

Royal mail do a special delivery as well just checked.

Steve Dean writes about this in this week's Dog world, with a new therapy:

Dog World Article

Just wondering how the rest of the pups are doing? Hoping things are going well. x

Fingers toes and paws all crossed here,I can't imagine what you're going through and hope you can save the remaining pups.I'm hoping that no news is good news ? x x x x x x x x x

Hi Guys,
all the other pups are doing well, eyes have opened and they are starting to get on their feet. We are still awaiting the results of the post-mortem on the pup that died last thurs but our vet thinks it was possibly a bacterial infection strep. The other pups have had a course of Synulox as a precaution and so far so good. We also had a kind blood serum donation from a lovely lady as well and so far soo good. x

Glad to hear your puppies are doing well, fingers crossed youve turned the corner and it will all be plain sailing from here. x