Italian Spinone, frequently sculpting his thick rug into a blow-up bitch and having a good hump!! Is particularly bad at the mo as twice weekly walked with a 12 month old miniature breed bitch on heat that he simply can't get to as she's too tiny & low down!

I know the potential health advantages, but always regretted getting my old boy "done" as it made him forever afterwards a target for getting bullied & humped by un-neutered males, really don't want to put youngster thru a lifetime of the same.  He's currently a virgin btw, as hasn't made it in the show ring so not in demand as a stud dog (and haven't had him hip-tested etc, tho has a wonderful temperament so maybe some people would want him for that reason and his particularly gorgeous colour).

Are there any more pros or cons?  what do others think?

Well all mine castrated dogs still mate and tie, so it's never stopped the desire. If you want to check to see if it would make a difference in your dog, I'd go for the Suprelorin implant. If there is a positive change, you can then have him castrated.

> particularly bad at the mo as twice weekly walked with a 12 month old miniature breed bitch on heat

Why would you be so cruel as to walk him with an in season bitch, that is just so unfair to flaunt in front of him, no wonder he is upset.

Most entire males who are not put into entire bitches company live out their celibate lives quite happily never missing what they haven't had access to.

No alternative to that atm, my dogwalker just happens to have her on the same round.  (Walker is ex vetnurse btw, she didn't seem to think it was cruel - the alternative would simply be no walk at all 2 days a week)

Thanks Goldmali, will ask vet about that

> the alternative would simply be no walk at all 2 days a week)

That should really be the case for the bitch, not your dog, she should not be walked with entire dogs while in season.  She should either stay home or be walked where she will not meet other dogs.

well in any case Brainless, he'd obviously been frustrated for a long time before that, and when I take him out the other 5 days a week, there aren't any in-season bitches around, so the problem's there and I'm looking for the best option/s regardless of the temporary situation.

Castrating in not likely to make any difference and I am puzzled what benefits you think there may be. Your dog walker should not walk an in season bitch not even alone what bad practice.

Did you say, how old is he.

The dogwalker is definitely at fault, walking an in-season bitch with other dogs. Very bad practice, causing suffering (as you have found) to many dogs. The bitch should be left at home when she's in season.

>he'd obviously been frustrated for a long time before that

Why do you say that? How old is he? Humping is normal, particularly after the evening meal, for some reason, in both dogs and bitches, neutered or entire.

when I take him out the other 5 days a week, there aren't any in-season bitches around,

No but it's still in his head from when the ignorant dog walker is taking him with an in season bitch and tormenting your dog!  That really is completely unacceptable.
The bitch should either be walked at a different time or left home while she's in season.

>when I take him out the other 5 days a week, there aren't any in-season bitches around,

But the smell of her is still lingering, and he knows in his head that there's an in-season bitch around. Poor chap's being very restrained, considering the torment he's under.

I wouldn't advocate neutering in this instance, there are no health benefits in my view.  I wouldn't recommend he be considered as a stud either.  I have two entire boys, one aged nearly 5, one aged 18 months.  I've always adopted the policy of distraction and exercise (makes me sounds like a boys boarding school matron!!).  My youngest dog is very keen on his fleece and when he gets over excited or tired is likely to take to his bed with his furry friend.  I have never let him tow it about the house so a firm 'ah' from me and he reverses carefully to the sanctuary of his crate...

Humping is usually a product of over excitement or after dinner (oddly) and they can generally be encouraged to stop if I introduce a new activity.  The only other time it ramps up a bit is if we have bitches to visit and there again it's less about mating per se, but just general excitement, or frustration if I ask them to stop slamming each others heads to the floor.  My youngest dog and his sister play like sumo wrestlers every time she comes to visit!

I completely agree with the other posters who say your dog walker is at fault.  It's immensely frustrating for your boy, who sounds as if he being very careful and considerate, and pretty dangerous for the bitch.  If this is a service you are paying for then you are quite entitled to ask that your dogs is walked at a different time, and in a different place, to the bitch.  I'd also be having a quiet word with the walker to dissuade her from walking an in season bitch at all.  I know there will be many that might jump on this comment but a dog walker should be well aware of his/her responsibilities and know what to do to avoid the obvious dangers.

As already been said can't believe a dog walker taking out an in season bitch with another dog, she might consider she's in control but what happens when/if she attracts others. Have two castrated males and would never castrate again unless for a medical reason. The elder done with the encouragement & advice from his breeder, has been a disaster due to feminisation & the unwanted attraction from other dogs (bitches & males). The younger due to cryptorchidism, regularly/daily humps his older cousin, chasing him around (especially after their evening meal). Castration doesn't stop the urge just the ability to father.

oh right, well that's us told then, only the 2nd dog I've had (the other was neutered at 2 yrs on breeder advice).
Came on here for advice, precisely because I'm NOT expert/in the know about this matter - well, apart from Dogs a babe's  and Goldie's tactful help, made to feel stupid/cruel/like naughty 6 year old - great 'training' from you others thanks a bunch.

Will have a word with walker but as an ex vet nurse I relied on her experience.  Is the only walking service in this remote location, so it's her or no-one/no walkies.

Have to agree with the others who say your dog walker should know better, particularly if she's a vet nurse! That little bitch is at risk from a really determined offlead dog who could mate her before the dogwalker could pull him off, and of course she's at risk of infection by walking in public places while she is in season. Try not to take offence, we are more miffed at the dogwalker than you. :-)

>Came on here for advice, precisely because I'm NOT expert/in the know about this matter - well, apart from Dogs a babe's  and Goldie's tactful help, made to feel stupid/cruel/like naughty 6 year old

I can't honestly see why the replies would make you feel like that - nobody's criticised you, just the dog-walker who's taking a great risk with someone else's bitch and making your poor dog miserable.

I meant to add - if the rug is the only object of his affections (like my boy has his fleece) then remove it when you want him to stop, or put it (like we do) in a place where you don't mind or have to watch

The behaviour will calm down when he isn't seeing the bitch but it's also an age issue - they do seem to grow out of it, a bit.  Keep an eye on when it happens and take steps to manage it (and his rug) with a distraction.  A filled Kong isn't bad either as it's a behaviour that often needs some intense activity to replace it - frenzied chewing or a run around the block will do :)

Thanks Dogs a babe, that is all a help.
He also tends to scent mark when out - weeing on someone's jacket slung over a chair at last year's Leeds show when I was turned around chatting to someone was a particular low!  But as said, I'm so reluctant to get him 'done' because of all the potential bullying by entires - plus it just seems cruel, & wrong to mess with nature despite the potential reduction in some health risks

Just to answer that specific point re control from Lacy - there are 2 people (her and her helper) walking no more than 3 dogs, the 3rd one being a somewhat elderly spaniel who sticks to their sides.

> but what happens when/if she attracts others.

That would be a huge concern for me.  He might be being brilliantly restrained at the moment - and he is - but given how far away dogs can smell a bitch on heat, it's not at all inconceivable that another male might come to investigate, and your boy could well then decide he needs to defend 'his' bitch.

Re. neutering - I've not had any problems from neutering Remy, he doesn't let other dogs hump him, he doesn't get bullied or any of the other unpleasantries I hear people talk about and he never has.  He's been neutered 8 years now.  Likewise Linc gets no unwarranted male attention at all, and he was neutered November/December ish last year.

I also know many neutered males from meeting them on walks and have never seen it happen from other boys - in fact the only hump I've seen in years was this morning, from a bitch and she was just overexcited as a group of a few suddenly went to over a dozen, as my 4 met the group and then 4 labs joined in too!

Will have a word with walker but as an ex vet nurse I relied on her experience.
As an ex-veterinary nurse myself, I find that unless they have had experience outside their work, their knowledge is limited to clinical matters and little to do with pedigree breeds, breeding, dog management or behaviour. :(

> Try not to take offence, we are more miffed at the dogwalker than you. :-)

Ditto, really was gob-smacked at the dog walker, not trying to give you a hard time.

I am a bitch only owner and would never dream of walking my in season girls with male dogs or where there may be loose male dogs.

I am fortunate that with a dog warden service that fines owners to get their dogs back we don't have latchkey dogs around and I can lead walk on the roads, but even then I do this late evenings when I am unlikely to encounter anyone dog walking, and on the off chance we do then I cross over the road or take a side street as soon as I see anyone walking a dog.

wrong to mess with nature despite the potential reduction in some health risks

It can certainly cause many unwanted side effects but I am wondering what health risks you think it will reduce.

As far as the replies are concerned it was not you but the dog walker who is at fault, apart from upsetting the rest of their charges the bitch is at risk being walked in this manner.

Nova, was told it reduces cancer risks (well elimination of testicular cancer would be the obvious one, not sure about anything else)

Nikita
Likewise Linc gets no unwarranted male attention at all,

My old boy got lots tho, the absolute worst experience being when he was 12, arthritic and recovering from anal gland tumours - but still loved his walks.  In some woods, a huge overweight chocolate lab (entire), must have weighed nearly 40Kg, charged up to Wills, humped him, knocked him flat - I yelled at the owner to call the lab off/come and grab him - eventually did so (took a couple of mins) and took him away but didn't put him on lead and 3 mins later the bloody lab came charging back to do same thing all over again!

Meanwhile, the pup - who was 9 months old at the time, 2.5 y. old dog in question now - stood watching and absorbing it all.  We were on our way to ringcraft class, and when we arrived (late) into the ring, the first thing he did was growl aggressively at a large black lab! tho he'd never before in his life expressed any aggression to any creature.  Getting his retaliation in first no doubt.  Just shows how easily they pick stuff up, took a few sessions to school him out of it again.

  Nova, was told it reduces cancer risks (well elimination of testicular cancer would be the obvious one, not sure about anything else)

Well, of course, you can't get cancer or any other problem with an organ you do not have for example remove a leg and you will not get problem with the knee joint.

Tumour in the testis is not often malignant or at least not the spreading kind and it is very easy to check for lumps on the other hand prostate cancer is more likely in the castrated male and they really can be a nasty problem. Set against that the fact that enlarged prostate is more common in the elderly intact male but is easy to cure by castration, mine field, but they really are best left the way they are born unless there is a medical reason to castrate and that is usually late in life when it does the least damage, young dogs need their hormones.