I have two male dogs that are close in age (21/2 and 3) that sometimes fight. They used to fight a lot but now can go weeks with no prob then will set to over sometimes very subtle signals that arent always picked up on so cant prevent the fight from happening. If there are two of us we usually grab a dog each and manage to separate them but one of them hangs on for dear life and it can be hard. I was on my own last night and they started, it took me at least 10 mins to separate them. I have tried throwing water on them which worked the first time but now just seems to make them worse.

I suppose it depends on the size of the dogs, with my small breed I grab them by the scruff and shake them till they each let go of the parts they are hanging on to, I did try just grabbing one dog by the scruff and lifting it out of harms way but the other one would jump up and grab a back leg or tail before I got my second hand under his bum, it has only happened twice where verbally I was unable to break them up, never knew the cause, no food, bitches in season etc to trigger them, I always presumed it was 7yr old Rhuari who started it but last week it was 3yr old Lincoln lying on top when the growling started but it all stopped when I gave them a shout. Each time I have been sure there was going to be blood drawn but thus far thankfully there hasn't. 

When separating bitches it is usually me who gets bitten and they come out of it a bit ruffled but again no blood except mine.

The dynamics here have changed since one of my bitches died suddenly and I rehomed the other 2, one came back after 4 days as she just wouldn't settle or eat, no one seems to have claimed the top spot and 2 months down the line the place in the bed where the girls slept has remained empty, the 3 remaining dachsies are lying in one half of the bed(under bed storage box base) in their usual order, I thought with time they would have spread out.

What breed are they as that does make a difference, some breeds (like most hounds) are very easily parted simply by shouting or as you say water. I'm guessing by your username that they are staffies? If so I would simply keep them completely separate so they never have an opportunity to fight because I would be very concerned about serious injury or death.

I doubt theres anything you can do to break apart 2 fully mature male SBTs if and when they want to fight.
Splitting them up to avoid the situation seems the only solution.

No not staffies lol although I do have a staff but she is no prob. The dogs in question are a shih tzu and a chinese crested hairless dog. The main prob is the crestie doesnt wear a collar indoors as they seem to make his neck sore so there is nothing to grab. Tried to get his scruff but the skin is too tight to get a grip. He hangs on for dear life usually to the shih tzus ear and we do have blood and puncture wounds but had to resort to lifting up crestie by the tail and shutting shih tzu in cage using the door as a lever to get him off.

Using a large towel or blanket thrown over them can work, i've had to do it with a coat before and it worked instantly, but as you found with the water, it may only work the once. My friends GSD bitch used to launch attacks on her two make Springers , before she started to manage the situation she used one of those Company of Animals pet correctors with good results.

before she started to manage the situation she used one of those Company of Animals pet correctors with good results.

I've tried that and it didn't work at all. One thing I think would be useful would be to have a pig board to get between them. I've in the past managed to split fighting dogs up by using a big (biggest giant size) plastic bed to get between them -which isn't very easy. Anyone know where I can find a pig board ??

The trouble with lifting one or both dogs either by legs or tail is that it can make injuries worse.

I've had to separate two major dog fights in my time.. (when I worked at a local shelter)
Two were bullbreed crosses of medium size, the third (slightly less serious fight) was a German Shepherd attacking a Kelpie cross that I had on lead.

BOTH times with the bull breed crosses, I was alone in their kennel/run with them and I only used my voice, steel toe caps (not to hurt the dogs in any way, but more to get between them more safely) and grabbing collars (carefully!).
It's actually quite hard to remember HOW I separated the fights, but whatever I did, worked.

The GSD attack was slightly different in that it was in an open space, and the woman who had him on a lead was our 'senior behaviourist'.  The collar she had him on was a very flimsy check chain which snapped when he pulled away from her to make for the other dog that I had on a lead.
The GSD went for the Kelpie's back.  The behaviourist attempted to lift the GSD's back legs.. it didn't work.. I can't quite remember what stopped the attack, but the back leg lifting didn't work.

Got the adrenalin going though, that's for sure, and all three fights were stopped pretty quickly without any of the dogs receiving any serious injury.

> No not staffies lol

Phew :-)

We used those felt lined cat collars on one of our hairless who was a bit of a houdini and needed a collar on all the time, not sure if they'd be strong enough to use to separate them though. I suppose a chopping board or similar might work as a pig board with little dogs?

I've tried that and it didn't work at all. One thing I think would be useful would be to have a pig board to get between them. I've in the past managed to split fighting dogs up by using a big (biggest giant size) plastic bed to get between them -which isn't very easy. Anyone know where I can find a pig board ??

Patricia McConnell uses pig boards on aggressive dogs, she calls them blocking boards, but it's the same thing

[url=] https://www.suppliesforsmallholders.co.uk/pig-boards-c-34_118.html[/url], having used a pig board for pigs, the large full size ones can be quite unwieldy, the show board might be a better choice.

Thats sounds like a good idea. I might try with a chopping board first, the plastic ones as may be cheaper than a pig board.

Cheers Celli. It's just something we have talked about for years would be handy to have at home and yes the main idea of course is to block without having to use your own body.

i always remember being at the farm and the jack russel went for one of the fluffy dogs not sure what it was and they could not seperate them the lady that owned the farm walked out and grabbed the jack russels testicals and squeezed very hard the dog yelped and turned around to get her and she belowed something unmentonable to him and the fight was over it amazed me how she never got bit, but like she said you must always do it to the one that has its mouth onthe other dog, never thought to ask her how she seperated bitches

I struggled with this of 2 large breed males.. I was told to keep buckets of water about in the garden and then keep a baking tray to hand, this helps to separate the dogs easier(All advised by a behaviourist) or in 1 instance I resorted to shoving a kitchen chair in the middle of them..

Are they causing injuries to each other at all?

I know it sounds cruel - but desperate measures were needed when 2 fully grown Boxers had hold of each others faces and to pull them apart would have resulted in awful injuries. I was by myself. I grabbed each collar and lifted both as high as I could ( front legs only off the ground ) I think the strength comes in moments like this. I held on like this until they were virtually strangled and this forced them to let go. I then, scolding as I went, dragged them by the collars into separate rooms to quieten down. I got my breath back and then popped into each room clutching the hibiscrub to check on the injuries and whether I needed the vet. Although I was covered in blood neither dog had really serious bites, just tooth entry holes which I kept clean and they healed without needing the vet.
I must admit I ached all over the next day and realised how lucky we were to have got off so lightly.

Last time I had to split my two boys up I blasted them in the face with a hosepipe that has one of those gun things on it to give extra water pressure,just as well they were outside at the time lol. Didn't work on the girls though,it took two of us to part them by grabbing them by the collars and thumping them!. Not something I want to do again and I am paranoid at checking doors and gates these days.

Yes they do both have injuries. Used to think it was the crestie that came off worse but his are easier to see. The thing with the shih tzu is that hes so hairy you cant see all the injuries and tend to come across them later when he is groomed. Sometimes just come across scabs in places you never realised he had been bitten. Couldnt grab the crestie by the testicles because he is castrated lol

Never had a problem with males they stop if I say enough and mean it but I think it depends on the breed now bitches that is a different story.

Can't help really has it been since the dog was castrated or are they just enemies?

I grabbed each collar and lifted both as high as I could ( front legs only off the ground ) I think the strength comes in moments like this.

I honestly wouldn't do this, because chances are you will get bitten yourself. Always stay away from the front of the fighting dogs as otherwise the risk is huge they bite you by accident. It happened to my husband several times before he finally listened to me and stopped trying to separate them by their front ends.

We've had a few bad fights over the years. On a couple of occasions bitches where there was no other option but to rehome one. Also various between male dogs. Thankfully (touchwood) at the moment we don't have any living together that we need to worry about. But the long and the short of it is, there is no foolproof way to separate fighting dogs. If they will stop by the means of water being thrown over them, a blanket, a dog alarm, anything similar -then the fight wasn't very serious to start with. When dogs fight seriously, absolutely nothing will stop them -except for the need to eventually stop for a quick break, and that's sometimes the only moment you can get to them. If you try to hit them, it could make the fight worse, because of the pain. (Just think how irrational we ourselves can get if we stab a toe on a table -we may end up hitting the table as we get so angry due to the pain.) If it is a very VERY serious fight, they will neither feel pain nor hear anything. Everything is blocked. And if it is a serious fight, where nothing will distract the dogs, then the only option is to make sure no fight can ever occur again -they have to be split up permanently. No second chances.

I think it depends on the breed

Funnily enough the worst fighters I've had have been Golden Retrievers!

what about a pressurised rape alarm that woman can carry in their handbags for protection, if you sounded that do you think that would shock them into stopping just enough for you to get them apart.

I honestly wouldn't do this, because chances are you will get bitten yourself.

Absolutely agree with you Goldmali, but at that moment in time common sense goes out the window. Yes on hindsight you can see all the danger that you put yourself into, however when you know that the fight will be a 'to the death' fight you often don't stop to think. I actually stood between the dogs ( they were joined at the face) from the back, so held collars from behind. I was lucky on this occasion ( there was actually a third female Boxer that had joined in but I pulled her off easily and put her in a different room, she was only egging the boys on ) I was on my own so knew that they couldn't be left to kill each other and just did what seemed the only option in that moment.
Definitely would not recommend this way to anyone if there are other options, or if there is someone near that you can call for assistance.

When Betty used to have one of her frenzied attacks on Moose I would either shout very loudy and almost scream no Betty and it often stopped her in her tracks. If however she had engaged and was not conscious of anything around her I had to intervene and did this by approaching from behind her and grab her scruff with my legs wrapped round her body and normally that released her bite. I had only once had to prize her jaw open but it was something I didn't go into lightly knowing about the probability of being bitten which luckily I wasn't.

The one time when I had to seperate 2 fighting dogs (8+ dogs used to be in the run together and 6+ bitches in another run together) They were Irish Setters.
As the kennels and Runs were at the bottom of the garden a hose or anything else wasnt an option,
I grabbed the only thing to hand which was 2 metal dog bowls, A couple of knocks on their heads seperated them and calm resumed.
The times I have had to do it between Ebba and Beano I just pick Beano up and put him the other side of the room and calmness prevails!!!
Lea :) :) :)

Excellent post Goldmali.

Like sillysue though, I've got inbetween fighting SBT's to split them up, but would never recommend that to anyone, after the fights, I've stopped and thought " that was a bloody stupid thing to do " luckily I've never been bitten, in the heat of the moment it's difficult ( for me ) not to act.

Lea, your post made me smile, it reminded me of the one and only fight Spud and his brother Ted nearly had, friend and I were in the park, both with Chukit's, the boys started to eye ball each other and go up on their toes, we both bopped our respective dogs once on the top of the head with the Chukit which stopped their nonsense, the looks on their faces was hilarious .

> I honestly wouldn't do this, because chances are you will get bitten yourself.
>
>

Yep very probably

> but at that moment in time common sense goes out the window. Yes on hindsight you can see all the danger that you put yourself into, however when you know that the fight will be a 'to the death' fight you often don't stop to think

Yep very true. I knew my one male would not stop till his brother was dead so hand on heart I could not stand by and let that happen. Same with the girls,I knew neither would back off and there was no way I could let that happen. When my male bit me (in error) he spat me out instantly, same with the girls,they knew it was me in their mouth and spat me out lol. The bitches were the worst and I thank god that my son was home or I dread to think of the outcome.

what about a pressurised rape alarm that woman can carry in their handbags for protection, if you sounded that do you think that would shock them into stopping just enough for you to get them apart.

Same thing as the dog alarm -if the dogs are really in a bad fight, they will not pay any attention at all, I have tried it.

Absolutely agree with you Goldmali, but at that moment in time common sense goes out the window.

Oh I know! :) You put the dogs first and do what you think will work, it's instinct. I just wanted to generally warn that people CAN get bitten when trying to grab a collar, as it did happen to my husband more than once until it became engrained in him not to go for the front end. (We had a Golden bitch that was really bad for attacking my then only Malinois bitch, this was years ago now.)

Oh dear !! I am gratefull I have never come accross a dog fight before. Panic and dread come to mind. If I was you I would separate them, maybe not the best family picture u have in mind but alot better than fighting reacurring and injuries happening.
My mother in law has 3 shitzu's, male, female and male pup (now 14mnths old) and the pup really picks on the mother. No fight has ever broken out between them as the mother is very subdued and does not fight back. Every time I walk in the house I say Bella (the mother) is bleeding again (always from the top of the head). Nobody then does anything to clean it up or check it and oviously does not watch the dogs properly as no1 noes it has happened, and no measures as yet to prevent it happening. She has nowhere to go to get away from him :( I hate it, and hate noing that it is happning and allowed to happen. I wont take my dog there anymore because of him trying to start a fight, luckily he can not get near to my dog (as she is so fast) to do anything and my dog has never felt threatened by him to even bare her teeth back, but like I said I wont take her up anymore because of it, just incase something did happen and she gave him anything back and injuries was caused :(

Lea - I know this isn't a funny topic but it did make me chuckle reading a couple knocks on their heads with the metal bowls stopped them lol!  I think we use whatever we have to hand in situations like that.

I have found a pet corrector to be really useful and work very well, however as other people have stated it does depend on the dog and if they are having what I call a spat or trying to cause serious damage.  I also find using a very loud strong but calm voice gets any commands across alot better than screaming at the dogs to stop.

> at that moment in time common sense goes out the window. Yes on hindsight you can see all the danger that you put yourself into

I learnt that the hard way, 2 of mine were at it (Dog and Bitch) and I got bitten and required stitches. Not great when you live alone most of the time and had to drive myself to the hospital to get repaired! Thankfully once they realised i'd been bitten (from me screaming) they stopped fighting but would make me think again before grabbing them to seperate.

If I was you I would separate them, maybe not the best family picture u have in mind but alot better than fighting reacurring and injuries happening.
I really dont want to do this though Lurcher owner as I wouldnt know which one to let go and I would worry about where he was going and if he would be ok. Its a very hard thing to do and I love both dogs the same, they are my babies.

> really dont want to do this though Lurcher owner as I wouldnt know which one to let go and I would worry about where he was going and if he would be ok. Its a very hard thing to do and I love both dogs the same, they are my babies.

I believe the poster meant for you to keep them separate within your house - although sometimes the only answer is to rehome one of the dogs. As much as you don't want to do that a serious fight could seriously maim or kill either or both dogs and endanger humans as well :-(

My Sisters Jack russels used to fight,she used to put the hoover on and that was the only thing that made them stop.

Sheila

> My Sisters Jack russels used to fight,she used to put the hoover on and that was the only thing that made them stop.
>
>

That made me smile as our terrier fights the hoover when it is switched on :-)

And there I thinking I shouldnt have put it!!! LOL
I must say they did both step back with a sort of 'what happened there' look to their face LOL
Lea :)

I know its of topic but my husband just read about Lea and the dog bowls he says it reminds him when he was five years old his baby sister was in the bath in front of the fire he accidentally tripped up fell in the bath tipped it up all over the carpet and his mother plonked him on the head with an empty dinner plate she was carrying at the time.
Cruel sixty years ago dont you think?

I am really shocked by all these accounts of fighting dogs within households!

dogs like people don't always get on, and if they do not at all times.  The severity of disagreements can be largely breed dependent, with some being generally far more sociable and others definitely not, especially with their own sex.  Then there are just individuals that can't get on.

In 20 years of multiple bitch ownership anything up to 6, I have never had anything beyond spats *swearing and posturing).  Generally dogs that fight and mean to cause injury to each other rather than just make a point need to be permanently parted, either within the home if achievable, or one re-homed.

There are factors/trigger points that will make fighting more likely, similar age and temperament, competition for bitches, other resources (food or owner most likely) reproduction or seasons in bitches.

>I am really shocked by all these accounts of fighting dogs within households!

Does every human in your family always agree on absolutely everything, or are there occasional disagreements?

I am really shocked by all these accounts of fighting dogs within households!

Re the 2 fighting Boxers I mentioned earlier. It was just like 2 grouchy kids, a bit of push and shove going through a doorway plus a bit of excitement ( getting ready for a walk ) It was really just a bit of a mix of excited energy in a bottleneck situation that set it off. Neither was rehomed and they have never done this again, in fact they were the best of friends 2 hours later when I allowed them to meet up in the kitchen.( they actually tried to lick each others wounds)  The only difference is that I am aware of what COULD happen, so never allow the same set of circumstances to build up again and at the first sign of over excitement I make sure I calm the situation down. Being aware can avoid many of the lead ups to a fight, although unfortunately not all, and sometimes a dog will need to be rehomed if fighting is a common occurrence.

Does every human in your family always agree on absolutely everything, or are there occasional disagreements?

I don't think its fair to draw a human comparison but even if you do there is a big difference between a disagreement and two people drawing blood or being forcibly parted! I'm just surprised as its not something I've experienced. I'm not having a dig at anyone! I don't think anyone needs to explain or justify their stories either, thats not what the thread was about so apologies for taking it a bit off topic...

A lot depends on what you term a fight. 

I would not call anything where blood was not drawn and there wasn't a serious intent to injure. 

Anything else would be a disagreement or spat, within normal range of social interactions.

>even if you do there is a big difference between a disagreement and two people drawing blood or being forcibly parted!

It's far from rare for human siblings to have quite physical fights, with bloody noses and black eyes!

Ha ha Love the fact you laughed at my post :) :)
And the bloody noses me and my brothers gave each other ;)
Oh and there is a difference, they dont fight to the death, they have a disagreement, fight and then are back to being friends!!!
Lea :)

It's far from rare for human siblings to have quite physical fights, with bloody noses and black eyes!

Oh my goodness the shock factor continues! lol

My brother and sister used to tear lumps out of each other lol .

Just remember we are talking animals here with animal instincts.
A human may throw a plate or two, slam a door and then keep a stoney silence. An animal reacts far more aggressively, and if in a real fight gets the 'red mist' and will not give in and would kill. This 'red mist' anger can occasionally be seen in humans and is a word used especially in violent murder cases, although hopefully family rows will just be spats and will not go as far as this.
But I believe this extreme animal anger is in all of us, as I know if anyone threatened my dogs or kids I could and would kill, I think occasionally our own animal instinct comes out, but bear in mind this feeling is nearer the surface in most of our dogs.

>It's far from rare for human siblings to have quite physical fights, with bloody noses and black eyes!

I bit my sister once, as a young child..... :-p

> but bear in mind this feeling is nearer the surface in most of our dogs.

and some breeds/types it is nearer the surface than others.  Some dogs are more reactive and less tolerant than others.  Some can almost never be pushed to the extent of 'loosing it', where others have a very 'short fuse', just like people.