Hi Everyone,

This is something I've hit on in another post but feel it may warrant a separate topic. Nando (6 month old GSD) is absolutely awful at his re-call training. I'll detail his behaviour below in the hope that someone can help me!

Once a week he goes to a dog trainer with us who uses only positive reinforcement and I am really pleased with what he has taught me. However we haven't been for about four weeks now because of one thing or another. Nando's re-call was great until he got to a certain age (as to be expected really) and now it is to the point I dread letting him off! His other obedience is good, even outside and I can get him into a sit-stay or down-stay and walk a good few meters and he'll hold it, even with medium distractions!

The trainer gets him to recall by having him walk ahead of us on his lead, calling his name and walking backwards. "Nando! Come!" in an exciting voice and then when he finally comes 'sit!' and reward.

Of course he still has to have some off-lead exercise as he has a lot of energy and only so much of it can be burned off with mental exercise. At the minute I just let him off his lead to play with other dogs. If there is only one or two dogs, then I will call him once and if he doesn't come back I walk off and he will come running. When he starts running to me, I get low to the ground and give him his 'best' treats (cheese, hot dog etc) and play ball with him or with a tug-toy. The problem is that if he comes back of his own accord (which is unlikely, even when there are no dogs about) he will stay a distance from me.

My Mum doesn't have the same problem and when my Sister and my niece come with us on our walks, he will gladly come back to my sister (Even when playing with other dogs!!) but still completely ignores me.

I have never repeated myself over and over to get him to come back, and whenever I put him back on his lead, I always make sure I play a fun game with him or let him straight back off again. Occasionally I do have to grab his collar and walk away from other dogs, simply because he is not coming back and other people are trying to get on with their walks!

I think I've covered everything and I'd really like some advice, but if anyone needs any other information please let me know!

I will be back in his normal routine of weekly training next week and will get advice then, but wondered if anyone else had a dog like this that might be able to advise. The park I walk him in is fairly big and he can get a fair way away whilst still in view, there are always other (friendly) dogs there for him to play with. Thankfully the owners that go there, most of them know Nando & I so they don't mind when Nando won't come back, some of their dogs will even come to me to 'drop him off' and let me get him on his lead.

Should I use a long-line dragging behind him? I worry that another dog will get it's legs caught or similar.

Josh

Josh, have you tried calling Nando and, when you get his attention and/or he BEGINS to start your direction, running AWAY from him so that he has to chase YOU to catch up to you?  And then rewarding him for catching you? 

Sounds to me like you are expecting him to come all the way in to you while you stand there (or walk backwards) and wait for him.  Where's the fun in that for him?  Make it more interesting.  Keep him wondering what nutty fun thing you are up to now.

I wonder why your trainer asks Nando to Come and then waits to give the reward until Nando has performed the Sit?  That's TWO things you are asking Nando to do.  He's not getting rewarded for what you have asked him to do, asked him to do FIRST, and is most important to you that he DO.  Come sounds like it's more important to you than the Sit, is that right?  Then reward for the Come and don't also ask for the Sit at this point.

What do you suppose Nando would do if you got his attention (called to him) .... and then fell down and laid quietly until he came and sniffed at you to see if you had suddenly died?  And then grabbed him when he got close to you?  That is one of the few ways that I could get my Siberians to return to me when they were off running the fields and having a gay old time of it, not wanting to come and 'be caught' again.  They were too curious NOT to come close and sniff, and I could always grab and catch them again.

You say Nando ignores you but comes to your Mum, your sister, or your niece.  Why do you suppose that is?  Do they not catch him?  Or does he know that he will ALWAYS be caught if/when he comes to you?  How about calling him; rewarding him when he comes; and NOT putting him on the leash but rather just letting him go again?

If you are having a problem with one aspect of training, the standard advice is to back up to where you began having problems and "start over again" from that point.  I would say re-train the Recall having him on the long line ALL of the time until he is resigned that he is going to wear it and you are going to enforce the Recall EVERY time you give that command.  Even if you have to walk to the next county to catch up with him and enforce it.  If you don't enforce it every time, Nando will test you to see which times he can "win" and not come when he is called, and you will never have a reliable Recall with him.

The 'keeping his distance' thing is probably because hes been grabbed or caught and now hes wise to it.
When he comes back for his high value treats make sure he gets fondled and petted all around his head and neck area without ever holdng onto him.If he ducks back then give him a treat he has to lick from your fingers - withdraw treat until he will let you touch and treat together.
Progress to clipping his lead on to give nibbles of sausage from your fingers ( to distract) then stroking head and neck area whilst treating, then unclip and send him off.

Try to time the final clip up of lead to when he least expects it and not upon recall if possible (perhaps when you approach him or if he passes by..).then treat by saying 'collar' then treat or tuggy play.

I have a youngster who drags a 10 foot thin line for safety but her recall is sound....most of the time :-)  just to be sure ;-)

Good advice from LunaGrace.  A few other things to think about

Improve your treats to something irresistible - experiment with all sorts to see what works so try cheese, liver, hot dog sausage, garlic sausage, ham, roast chicken etc

Go back to practising in the garden, use a line if necessary and be 100% consistent

Add a new word to your recall just as he is arriving at your feet - couple that word with the treat giving.  It can be useful in emergencies.  I use HERE and I can get a recall from my youngster in stalk mode now.  (Very handy yesterday as we were about to be stampeded by a herd of cows! :) )

Recall to the back door, and reward, after every garden outing.

Try a whistle.  I use one when recalling from distance as it's easier for them to hear than my voice.  It's also the same every time.  No matter how frustrated you may become the whistle never indicates that to your dog

Always catch then reward, not the other way around.  I grab a collar before feeding, and then 75% of the time I release them again.  Don't even touch your lead til you have your dog's collar - any dog shy of being caught, or unwilling to go home, will read every cue from a distance.   Keep your lead round your neck rather than in your hand and it's easy to clip on when you're ready.

Good luck.  Nando is at the classic 'Bog Off' age.  :)

Josh,

Yes long line. Make recall practice top of your list in the park. Try to think three moves ahead- if he's with a new bunch of dogs recall is going to be almost impossible, unless he is on a long line and you can get hold of one end and then call him- this way you ensure he complies. 

To echo Luna Muna- I would never make a dog sit on an outside, park recall. If he comes back he gets the reward once you've touched his collar.

He is becoming a teenager and you'll just have to keep up the training you are doing and be patient- it will come. Teenage dogs, like teenage humans are all over the place and although they appear to have learned things like recalls as pups, the information is not consolidated and can get lost under the various pressures of hormones, discovery of the environment etc.., as their horizons widen.

Just keep at it, be consistent and keep a mental image of the learning pathways in his brain slowly, slowly growing with each lesson. He's only got a little brain at the moment and there is all this new stuff he's trying to learn and understand too, like what other dogs are like, other humans- the big wide world outside your home. Each new bit of information has its own little pathway and each new pathway takes precedence over another, older pathway, and there is only so much room for each. However, every time a pathway is used it grows a bit more and stays longer in the memory. When you get frustrated just think that you are actively growing his brain and that is why he is all over the place and why these things take time.

I agree with what the others have said but would also add that if you call Nando knowing he wont come back then you're teaching him not to come back :-(  It's better to only recall him when you know he's going to obey.... which may be when he's a few feet away.  It's critical that when he does come back you give him a huge reward and let him go again... perhaps play with him... make yourself oh so attractive to him that he wants to come back to you, for treats, for games, for who knows what?  have a special toy which he's only allowed when he is with you, perhaps a game of tug, something he only gets when he does a recall... don't set him up to fail with lots of distractions, start in a confined area, with a line on and lots of games, treats etc  Don't let him guess if he's to go back on a lead, have a super treat, have a great game, be released again... then he'll improve.  A long line is great for training.

Please do NOT let him drag a loose line when he is playing loose with other dogs.  It's a recipe for injury to either dog.  On another forum I visit a dog had her leg broken in two places that way, from the owners other dog dragging a long line.

Thank you for all the advice, I knew you would all have a good idea.

I think the problem is due to a number of things that I didn't really foresee. Firstly, as you say, he has cottoned on to me grabbing his collar. I make a point of not doing it but there has been a handful of times when I have had no other choice- maybe a harness would have been better as he wouldn't have been so aware of what I was doing! The other problem is that the park I walk him in is quite a big, open space. Today I took him to some woodlands and his re-call was much better as he couldn't see us all the time. He still did the 'stay a few feet away from Josh' game, however even with really smelly treats he won't come to me, he won't even take the treats.

I do think lying on the floor would get his attention, IF he ever put his head up to even look at me! It is as if I don't exist.

Would it help if I began from the start with a different word? I am hesitant to use a whistle other than to get his attention because if I lose the whistle or forget it then I am back at square one with a dog that won't recall? Or is the aim of the whilstle to get his attention, and then give him the queue word.

He sometimes has a sensitive tummy so I am hesitant to try too many different types of treats but I think I will give some tuna a try tomorrow. The main thought I had with the long-line is that it may get tangled with other dogs. Should I put him in a harness to attach the long-line, or should I attach it to his collar? Is there a brand of long-line that is flat like a houseline so it is less likely to tangle?

Thanks for all the advice, once again.

At 6 months he doesn't needs loads of exercise.  I'd forget off lead work for a short time and concentrate on other things.  Off lead and recall in the garden : exploring and sniffing in the woods : nice road manners and good traffic sense in town.

He genuinely will not need too much walking exercise and it's his brains you want to stretch for a while.

Gradually re introduce off lead work in enclosed safe areas but in the meantime do not give him any chances to ignore you.  An extending lead is good for practising recall - less chance of getting tangled up.  I wouldn't use one for a dog that pulls but sometimes you want to let them have a poke about but keep them nearby.  I use one for my terrier type livestock chaser.  Safer for him, safer for me :)

I'd also suggest you get Nando back to training classes.  A good trainer can give you on the spot advice about your signals and your dog's signals.  Invaluable

hi, i have had the exact same problem as you, and although i cant give you  as good advice as others on here already have I can say it does improve. My pup at 6months was exactly the same as yours, she would not come back to me at all, and if she did come back for a 'play' with her fav toy she would not get close to me at all so i couldnt touch her and if i did reach out in any way (even if i was not reaching to her) then she would be off. And she also would not come to me for any type of food treat, no matter what i tried, she just would not want to come close enough to me, and even if i had her on lead and wanted to reward for another behavour i couldnt with a treat becasue she wouldnt eat it (even if its something she loves in house). I really did not no what to do and was dredding letting her off just as you say you are, but being a greyhound lurcher she needed to run, so i posted a few threads and got alot of advice, roughly same as given to you, and she is now nearly 8months old and i must say such a dramatic change in her. Not sure if that is down to training or down to growing up a little bit (may be a 6month old age thing) or both but just keep going as it will get easyer in time :) Good luck :)

He has learnt he can get away with it ....recall is  one of the first basic things to teach at training , better than a situation or scraping your dog off a main road.Your training class  (did you attend before 6mths  )  should advise you , not too much free play ,other than your garden , until that recall is  set in stone.Walking as an exercise is not needed at this age . Socialisation can be done at the end of the road for traffic etc .Play with your dog , teach it things in the garden. Call for supper by repeat banging  with a spoon on the dish (similar to repeat peep  on a whistle)then teach wait for supper , call in  from the garden , name of dog then what command you choose  (Come / Here  but in fast repetition like a whistle signal.''Nando'' ..COME < COME < COME -high pitched sweet tones.Sit and  Wait are essential as he will sit when he comes into you, even if  it is a foot away , then Wait , with a signal, then approach , under the dog  chest level , not over , nor grab.. All these Sits and Waits and the recall should have been taught at training in small  progressive steps, sit and wait and  side step , on a lead . Sit /Wait /walk round the dog , on a lead. Your training then should have progressed to a Novice class (recalls on the move ), then to advanced , where all dogs are off leads at times , and doing  Test A recall.

I do think lying on the floor would get his attention, IF he ever put his head up to even look at me! It is as if I don't exist.

:-D :-D There's no end to the things we can try--one of my dogs is a very keen hunter and has gotten into the bad habit of hunting for himself--his recall on the whistle is not bombproof if there's an interesting smell in the hedgerow. He is also a very keen digger :-) so my fail-safe with him is to scuff at a tuft of grass and ask "Is it a mouse?" He comes over to investigate every time, I let him have a dig, then clip him on and treat him for checking the non-existent mouse :-)

I would put some tasty dog treats in your pocket and make sure he knows they are there. I wouldn't take him off his lead on his walk for now but wait a while. Now and again during his walk i would call his name and when he looks at you i would give him one of the treats. Once he knows that you have treats i would put him on a long lead, and as before calling his name and when he looks at you show him the treat and ask him to come to you, when he comes to you give him a treat. I would carry on doing this until i felt happy in my own mind then i would let him off the lead, but still carrying on with the treats. At our dog training club our trainer got some samples from this company and  they are good. I hope this helps.

http://tastydogtreats.weebly.com

It sounds like you are using some good treats already, but think about when you feed him, is he at all hungry when you go for a walk or is it not that long since he ate? As others have said you do need to be careful when trailing a long line, I sometimes do it, but only on short grass when there are no other dogs around to get tangled up in, then you can put your foot on the long line and you won't need to try and grab for the collar, which is usually when they learn to come as close as your arms length plus one inch!

You could also do some 'name recognition', by classically conditioning his name at home so that he starts to turn to you as soon as he hears his name - You can use his normal biscuit that you feed or treats, depends if he will 'work' for his normal dinner.

Say his name then give him a biscuit, repeat several times in short lessons. When you say his name don't wait for any reaction from him, no matter what he is doing, find his mouth and put the treat into it.

After a few sessions you will begin to see what is called a CER, conditioned emotional response. All this will be is that as soon as you say his name he will turn straight to you expecting his treat before you even have a chance to move! But as I previously said in the beginning don't wait for any response, just Nando - TREAT!

Hope this helps :)

Great advice so far, what JO Roxy Jaz has said is absolutely spot on and leads to a fantastic name response. Dog hears name and whips around instantly.

The other bit I picked out of your post is that you say you call him, ask for a sit then reward him. Seeing it from Nando's point of view he is getting no reward for returning, only for sitting as that was the last action he performed. I would reward immediately on his return and not bother about the sit, thus rewarding the return to handler. If he is at the stage where he is ducking away, when he returns sprinkle a number of treats on the floor for him to hoover up. That way you can quietly clip his lead back on. There is no harm in asking him to sit after he has finished hoovering up. Not sure if other people have mention it, but recall him often and reward then give him an "OK go play" command or whatever release command you are going to use. Don't always put him on the lead in the same place and at times, pop him back on the lead for a minute or so, reward him plenty for any eye contact or any behaviour you are pleased with, then release him to play again. Time on lead should also be fun and rewarding.

Just been thinking, building on the name response, a great game you could play with Nando is to start have a tub of tasty treats that Nando knows you have and wants.

Start off in the house, with no distractions whatsoever and roll a piece along the floor so he chases it, you should find that as soon as he has eaten the food he will turn back to you for another piece. As soon as he turns let him see you roll another piece in the opposite direction so he has to run past you to chase the bit of food. Again as he eats this one, he will turn back and again you roll the food in the opposite direction so he runs back past you after the food.

In effect this of an 8 metre straight line, you are in the middle and you roll the food 4 metres in front of you, then 4 metres behind you so each time Nando chases the rolling food, he is having to pass you.

Do this for maybe 6 - 8 times then on the last time as he turns back in anticipation of another piece being rolled, hold your hand down with a bit of food and reward him from your hand and put an end to the game. After a couple of goes you should find that he is literally turning on a sixpence as he grabs the bit of food ready to run back past you for another piece. At this stage watch for the slight turn and shout Nando in a happy voice then roll the food behind you as before. What this will do is further condition him to whip around at the sound of his name.

I always start this in the house, then garden, then outside, building up from no distractions to busy places. The dogs love the game and it really builds a positive association to them turning back to you as they hear their name. Obviously he is still a baby and you have to watch his exercise, but this is one way of letting him have a gallop in a constructive way. As he gets older you can drop the food for a much valued toy, and obviously throw it a greater distance.

Good luck and I hope he enjoys the game if you decide to give it a go.

I've had clients use the lie down on the floor trick....seems to work once and once only. Has me in hysterics though listening to the stories.

I understand positive reinforcement works well use with my clients but have you ever used consequences for making the wrong choices? Such as " You snooze,you lose!" You never ask him more than twice, he refuses to come back in you show him what he could have had!! It goes back in your pocket!! He lost it! And make sure it was his fave tit bit.

Start a recall program at home by using his food in lots of containers around the house, call him and reward him with HIS FOOD!!! Not anything extra, got to work for his food, working breed!! Do it at least 15 times a day and for the first5 days make sure he can't get it wrong, everytime he wins. That will make it easier to implement consequences as he will understand he has something to gain by coming in. For outside I wouldn't even try to call him back in for at least 7 days as you'll be teaching ignorance so try to avoid other distractions for a while. Not easy I know. Use the same rules as at home for 7 days again making sure he can't get it wrong then after that point you know he's makng a choice to ignore so consequences can happen. No workee, no foodee!!

It's about building a bond between you both that makes you the best thing since sliced bread. Play lots of games, be positive, practice all other commands that he knows, be entertaining!! Above all he's a breed that love their owners so exploit it, build your bond then give him the cold shoulder if he misbehaves. Positive training doesn't mean you're a push over, just you show the way and how to make the right choices but to make choices there must be consequences for the wrong ones, but only when you have spent time showing the right way to go. If you give him the cold shoulder and he doesn't follow you or seem bothered then the relationship needs work. Try looking at John Rogersons recall leaflet.

>show him what he could have had!! It goes back in your pocket!! He lost it! And make sure it was his fave tit bit.

The no reward marker is a good idea, but you need to be careful of how you use it in this situation and timing is important, if he comes close enough to notice the food he is probably almost back at his owner, taking the reward away then will not encourage him to take the last few steps to be next to the owner.

Also the usual food in containers and 'free feeding' as in no food given away in bowl until end of day when any normal food allowance can be given.

Why can't I get a reliable recall?

'Come' is no harder to train than any other behaviour but in real life it has a huge number of criteria that have to be raised one at a time in order to guarantee success.
Often when puppies are brought home to their new owners this is the first time they have ever been separated from their dam and siblings and so they naturally attach themselves to their new family by following them about everywhere.  Owners find this quite attractive and wrongly assume that this trait will continue into adolescence/adulthood, whatever the circumstances.  A dangerous trap to fall into...

At some point in time, usually from around 6 - 10 months, depending on the individual, "Velcro" dog will morph into "Bog off" dog (this is especially true of a breed that has been developed to exhibit a high degree of initiative).  This is the time when owners suddenly realize that their dog will not recall when it sees another dog/person etc.  Not only is this inconvenient but potentially dangerous as the dog could be at risk of injury from a car/train/another dog etc. 

How and when do I start with a puppy?

My advice is to prepare for this inevitability from the day you take your puppy home.  If you are lucky the breeder will have started this process whilst still in the nest by conditioning the puppies to a whistle blown immediately before putting the food bowl down during weaning. 
Dogs learn by cause and effect ie sound of whistle = food.  If you, the new owner, continue this from the moment your puppy arrives you will lay down strong foundations for the future. 

By using the whistle in association with meals/food you need to establish the following criteria:
*  Come from across the room.
*  Come from out of sight
*  Come no matter who calls
*  Come even if you are busy doing something else
*  Come even if you are asleep.
*  Come even if you are playing with something/someone else
*  Come even if you are eating

Once this goal has been realized in the house, drop all the criteria to zero and establish the same measures, one at a time, in the garden.

Once this goal has been realized in the garden, drop all the criteria to zero and establish the same measures, one at a time, in the park/field etc.

To train this, or any other behaviour:

1.  Make it easy for the dog to get it right
2.  Provide sufficient reward

Do not expect a dog to come away from distractions in the park until you have trained it to come to you in the park when no diversions are around.  Be realistic and manage your expectations; your sphere of influence/control over your dog may be only 20m to begin with, therefore do not hazard a guess that the dog, at this level of training, will successfully recall from 50m or more away. Distance, like every other criterion, must be built up over time.

Some simple rules to follow when training the recall:

*  Whistle/signal/call only once (why train the dog to deliberately ignore your first command?)
*  Do not reinforce slow responses for the dog coming eventually after it has cocked its leg, sniffed the tree etc (you get what you train!)
*  If you know that the dog will not come back to you in a certain situation, go and get him rather than risk teaching him that he can ignore you.  (If you have followed the programme correctly you will never put your dog in a position to fail).
*  Practise recalling the dog, putting him on the lead for a few seconds, reinforce with food/toy etc and immediately release the dog.  Do this several times during a walk etc so that the dog does not associate a recall with going on the lead and ending the walk or being put on the lead with the cessation of fun.
*  Eventually, when the behaviour is very strong, alternate rewards ie verbal praise, physical praise, food, toy and also vary the "value" of the rewards, sometimes a plain piece of biscuit, sometimes a piece of cooked liver etc so that you become a walking slot machine (and we all know how addictive gambling can be)!

In my experience recall training should be consistent and relentless for the first two years of a dog's life before it can be considered truly dependable.  You should look on it as a series of incremental steps, rather than a single simple behaviour, and something that will require lifelong maintenance.

What about an older or rescue dog?

Follow the same programme as outlined above however for recalcitrant dogs that have received little or no training, I would recommend dispensing with the food bowl and feeding a dog only during recalls to establish a strong behaviour quickly. 

Your training should be over several sessions a day, which means you can avoid the risk of bloat.  It is essential that the dog learns that there will be consequences for failure as well as success. 

Divide the day's food ration up into small bags (between10 - 30), if the dog recalls first time, it gets food, if it does not, you can make a big show of saying "too bad" and disposing of that portion of food (either throw it away or put aside for the next day).

Again, raise the criteria slowly as outlined in puppy training.

Hunger is very motivating! 

For those of you who believe it unfair/unhealthy to deprive a dog of its full daily ration, not having a reliable recall is potentially life threatening for the dog ...............

How do I stop my dog chasing joggers/cyclists/skateboarders/rabbits/deer?

Chasing something that is moving is a management issue.  Do not put your dog in a position where it can make a mistake. Again you need to start training from a pup but if you have already allowed your dog to learn and practise this behaviour you may need to rely on a trailing line until your dog is desensitised to these distractions and knows that listening to you results in a great reinforcement.  Chasing is a behaviour much better never learned as it is naturally reinforcing to the dog, which makes it hard for you to offer a better reinforcement.  If you want to have a bombproof recall while your dog is running away from you then use the following approach:

Your goal is to train so that your dog is totally used to running away from you at top speed, and then turning on a sixpence to run toward you when you give the recall cue.

You need to set up the training situation so that you have total control over the triggers.  For this you will need to gain the co-operation of a helper. If you have a toy crazy dog you can practice this exercise by throwing a toy away from the dog towards someone standing 30 or 40 feet away. At the instant the toy is thrown, recall your dog! If the dog turns toward you, back up several steps quickly, creating even more distance between the you and the toy and then throw another toy in the opposite direction (same value as one thrown)..

If the dog ignores you and continues toward the thrown object, your "helper" simply picks the ball up and ignores dog. When dog eventually returns (which it will because it's getting no reinforcement from anyone or anything), praise only. Pretty soon the dog will start to respond to a recall off a thrown toy.  You will need to mix in occasions the toy is thrown and the dog is allowed to get it ie you do NOT recall if you want to make sure it does not lose enthusiasm for retrieving.

For the food obsessed dog, you can get your helper to wave a food bowl with something the dog loves in it and then recall the dog as soon as you let it go to run towards the food; again if the dog ignores you and continues to the food, your helper simply ensures the dog cannot access the food and start again.  (It is extremely important that the helper does not use your dog's name to call it for obvious reasons).

Gradually increase the difficulty of the recall by letting the dog get closer and closer to the toy/food. Praise the moment the dog turns away from the toy/food in the
early stages of training. Don't wait until the dog returns to you; the dog must have instant feedback.

Once the dog is fluent at switching directions in the middle of a chase, try setting up the situation so that it is more like real life. Have someone ride a bike/run/skate past. (It is unrealistic to factor in deer/rabbits however if your training is thorough the dog will eventually be conditioned to return to you whatever the temptation in most contexts).

Until your training gets to this level, don't let the dog off-lead in a situation in which you don't have control over the chase triggers. Don't set the dog up to fail, and don't allow it to rehearse the problem behaviour. Remember, every time a dog is able to practise an undesirable behaviour it will get better at it!

Most people do not play with toys correctly and therefore the dog is not interested in them or, if it gets them, fails to bring it back to the owner.

Play the two ball game, once you have a dog ball crazy.  Have two balls the same, throw one to the left, when the dog gets it, call him like crazy waving the next ball; as he comes back throw the other ball to the right and keep going left right so that YOU are the centre of the game and the dog gets conditioned to return to you for the toy. Once this behaviour is established you can then introduce the cues for out and then make control part of the game ie the game is contingent on the dog sitting and then progress to a sequence of behaviours.

HTH

Tasty dog treats website i mentioned are offering free samples, so why not get some for your dog and try them out, im going to.

Hi guys,

Thanks for all your help and new ideas. I have been trying a combination of lots of different things and all together his recall is improving. It isn't 100% yet however I do like to let him exercise off the lead so I know my progress is going to be slowed somewhat. If I know I'm not going to get him back I simply approach him, treat and put his lead on before playing a game of tug with him or giving him his ball etc.

I have tried to order some free samples from the Tasty Dog Treats site but I can't find their email address!

I've had him out at Royden Park today and he absolutely loved it. He discovered that he likes water by playing in a puddle (Read: Miniture lake) with a Collie who kept herding him back in. The whole house smells like wet dog now but he is absolutely shattered and is sleeping it off.

Josh

This is the tasty dog treats email, tastydogtreats@yahoo.co.uk 

I took it from their leaflet which was given out to us at our dog training class. When you contact them maybe you should point this out that there is no email adddress on their site. lol

Just checking... is it against the rules to post pictures on the forum? I took some lovely ones of him today at Royden park and wanted to share them with you all.