Have to say I agree with my breed 13 is the average lifespan, and I would not do anything invasive for a dog once they reached this age.

I agree Pedlee, will be keeping fingers and paws crossed you get a good result.

Oh pinkie I'm sat reading your posts in tears, my old goldie has been gone three years now but god I miss her, I rang the vets to talk about having her pts three months before I actually had the bottle to take her, she had a mass on her shoulder and I said the day she doesn't greet me with a wag and a smile will be the day I take her, on a gentler note when I did take her she never lifted her head from the vets table not even to ask why am I here mum, I knew then it was definately the right thing and it gave me a bit of comfort, as bad as it is for us our animals come first, lots of love to you all xxx

">the day she doesn't greet me with a wag and a smile will be the day I take her

That's sort of how we feel about our girl, she was up and waggy tailed this morning and ready for the walk, there is a difference now though when we load the troop of five into the back of the wagon, she doesn't bark whereas she always used to and it used to drive me nuts, now I wish she would.

She now hasn't been sick since the last vet visit (Wednesday) so the new vet has obviously found the right drugs for her.

We do have to work hard to get food into her, it's all hand feeding, sausage meat dry fried and warm, lambs liver barely fried, small pieces of cheese, she will lap at evaporated milk diluted with a touch of water and will take really strong cheddar pieces plus strawberry yogurt from tesco not asda!!

The vet said that the biopsy results may be back by Tuesday, he said that due to the position of the mass he could easily remove it but he also said that in his experience what he saw on the x-ray suggested an aggressive tumor, and that the deciding factor was whether it was a cell shedding tumor or not.

We have decided that if it is totally bad news we will ask the vet for guidance on how long before we should PTS as she does still have waggy tailed time but also a lot of sleep time, if it is not such bad news and the mass can be removed we will still take guidance from the vet but at the same time look and see how our girl is behaving.

It's so hard to decide on PTS when the silly madam still has the odd run up the garden or greets a strange dog with a waggy tail and sniff.

You are doing the right thing being guided by the vet and more importantly her.

I hope that she keeps enjoying life for as long as possible x

She appears to be eating the same as my girl did,cheese and strong flavours,you are doing your very best its such a worry,my heart goes out to you.
Sheila xx

It is always vey difficult to make these major decisions when age is a factor but several posters have said that they had surgery done on oldies and they lived a good while longer. I know it is different to a tumour case, but I took the decision to put my 14 year old Golden through surgery to repair a ruptured cruciate 6 months ago. I had tried the conservative management for 4 months but no improvement and she was in pain. I had her vital functions tested and all were very good. When the op was done I learned that the meniscus was shredded, hence the pain and no improvement after 4 months of rest. It was a major decision and I felt that I would be criticised from those who did not know Elkie and me but I am glad that I took the pain away for her and she now has 25 mins walk at her own pace every day and enjoys that. She has adjusted more than I have to her not going to the forest with the others but her breeder and I both know that it was a good decision to make for her. She is still a very happy and comfortable girl at 14.5 years. I wish you luck in making your decision but remember, it is only for you and the vet to decide what is for the best. Such a diffficult one.

>She is still a very happy and comfortable girl at 14.5 years.

Big smile here!  :-)   It's great when you know that you did the right thing. 

">but I took the decision to put my 14 year old Golden through surgery to repair a ruptured cruciate 6 months ago

Last October we put our 12yr BC through cruciate ligament surgury, because of her age we opted for extra capsular repair and not major reconstruction ie TPLO. Many on CD suggested that we should not put a dog of such age through surgery, but we did and with many months of hydro therapy she now thinks she is 6 yrs again, she cost us in excess of £2000, but it was worth it, she runs and is so enjoying herself, I just worry as I watch her incase the other leg should go, but she doesn't know that so bugger mother!!!

I feel that if I can't offer that to my lovely Golden girl then I'm not giving her a chance.

I will keep reviving this post as it helps me at the end of the day after my struggle with a poorly dog and I do believe that this is what CD is for, i.e. people who are in love with dogs.

Today we found a different walk with different sniffs, the silly cow with the tumor got so OTT excited she was back to her barking stupidness in the back of the wagon, we got her out of the wagon and she buggered off with some guy that had two big male Goldies, my farty barky little pastorals were following up the rear. We walked for around an hour.

When we got back home she had a drink of evap milk/water and then slept for a couple of hours, she's pottered about the garden a lot and eaten little.

We've done all the syringing of Antepsin twice a day and managed to get her Losec into her, she not had a good eating day today and has been sick once with about a teaspoon of bile, and after words between OH and me I told him to bugger off and leave it to me, he gets upset when she won't eat whereas I get firm.

When he was out of the room I engaged my other 4 dogs and made it pack eating thing, I managed to get a strawberry yogurt plus at least 2oz of liver in to her, my god my other girls are going to get SO FAT with all of these extra treats.

I'm tired but I will keep trying to shove food into my girl.

We wait for the results from the vets and will be guided by him but if it'd bad how the 'f' do I PTS a dog that keeps wanting to trot round fields and sniff other dogs

> We wait for the results from the vets and will be guided by him but if it'd bad how the 'f' do I PTS a dog that keeps wanting to trot round fields and sniff other dogs

You dont!! Your vet may be an expert on clinical matters but he does not know your dog. You know her inside out,how she really is so you will know when its time. Just enjoy the time you have together.

My sister recently had to make the decision to have her old dog pts, she was so worried about making the right choice for her as she'd never had a dog pts before, I advised her that when the bad moments out weigh the good ones then it's time to set her free. It seems to me though, that at the moment your old girl still gets some joy out of her day, when that stops then you'll know it's time.
Thinking of you both x

I knew when it was Sadies time,she only got up once that day,I planted some daffodils knowing they will come up around her birthday in April next year,it was a lovely sunny day,my heart was broken and still is,but I knew I had done everthing I possibly could for her,and I know your doing the same,.She went to the bridge peacefully she had enough and her eyes told me.

{{{{HUGS}}}}}}

Sheila xx

We've heard back from the vets today, the results have come back as a 'non cell shedding mass' which is good news.

The vet had hoped on that basis to hit my girl with stronger levels of Losec and higher doses of Antepsin but as she is still very reluctant to eat and is mainly hand fed or syringe fed he feels that the mass needs further investigation.

She goes in on Wednesday for exploratory surgery and hopefully removal.

I have done a lot better with feeding last night and today, I think I've cracked it with jars of baby food mixed with mashed spud and tinned chicken soup all squished up and slightly warmed, I was going to syringe it into her but she ended up eating it off the spoon herself, she had nearly a coffee mug full at tea today, plus I've been syringing sloppy ready brek made up with Complan into her, it's really easy as she will let me put the syringe between her teeth and she just sucks it in as I squeeze the syringe.

She was still keen for her walk this morning with OH and the rest of the troop, all barky and bum waggling as usual.

Wish her luck for Wednesday.

Fingers and 16 paws crossed for a positive outcome for you both.

One tip that I learnt when my girl was very poorly and wouldn't eat is to boil the leaves of Romaine lettuce ( must be Romaine), let the juice cool and then syringe it into their mouths, for some reason it stimulates the appetite, however in our case I let her eat whatever took her fancy. Plain boiled white fish fillets ( Sainsburys basics) and crushed potatoes ( no butter or seasoning) also helped.

Good Luck :)

Fingers and paws crossed for you both

Will keep all fingers and paws crossed for Wednesday and hope it goes well x

">One tip that I learnt when my girl was very poorly and wouldn't eat is to boil the leaves of Romaine lettuce ( must be Romaine), let the juice cool and then syringe it into their mouths, for some reason it stimulates the appetite

I'll try that as anything is worth a try

Best of luck and hope everything goes well on Wednesday

Thank-you all, my girl has had a full tummied sleepy evening, she is about to be woken for the evening wee and will have another syringe full of ready brek/complan, she will have another walk tomorrow morning and many feedings throughout the day.

She's a game girl so I hope all will be good

You're doing really well with feeding, time and patience seems to be paying off.  I really hope they can remove the mass on Wednesday and she'll have room to eat more!

Anxious times ahead, but we're all thinking of her... and you of course - I didn't think she was ready to leave just yet.

>Wish her luck for Wednesday.

Everybody on CD will be thinking of her.   Huge Good Luck.  :-)

Best of luck,really good news about her eating,thinking of you.

Sheila xx

Fingers crossed and good luck.

Keeping everything crossed for you on Wednsday.  Well done on the feeding, sounds like she's letting know she not ready yet.  Hopefully the mass can sucessfully removed which might improve her appitite.  I suppose she already feels like she has a full tummy.

Will keep you both in my thoughts. xx   hugs, hugs and hugs

Thank-you all.

It's not been too bad a day today, she was sick last night but still wanted to walk this morning, I gave her the Antepsin before she went out and the ready brek/complan when she got back.

She then slept and had ready brek mix again at lunch by syringe, for tea it was more baby food mash and soup stuff and she will eat that off a spoon, later this eavening it was Farley's rusks made with complan, I squirted a bit in her mouth and then she just licked like mad at the syringe, I reckon baby food is a great emergency food for some poorly dogs.

This may sound gross but she actually had a proper poo today, she's hardly been at all in the last two weeks, maybe just a tiny soft bit now and then, but today it was at least formed even if not a lot for a girl of her size, so all of the baby slop she's having must be putting some sort of bulk into her.

She's got to be at vet's at 9.15am tomorrow so no walk in the morning I don't want her to be overly tired before a GA, we're quietly optimistic or at least trying to be.

Am so pleased to read this. Like many others here i have been following your thread with much interest and compassion for you both. Wishing you both lots of love & good wishes for tomorrow.

Will be thinking of you all today - I'm almost as anxious for news as you are,

Hope it goes well today x

Wishing you all the best, fingers and paws crossed here for a successful outcome x

All thoughts are with you both, keeping everything crossed and wishing for the best possible outcome and news. Have been where you are with my old goldie and know how you are feeling right now, seriously sick, but you have been wonderful with all you have done and couldnt have done more for her, its all down to the surgery and recovery now but everyone is thinking of you and sending all positive thoughts your way and anxiously awaiting news. Hugs.

>>I reckon baby food is a great emergency food for some poorly dogs.<br />

I think you're right.  i fed my old cat when she was poorly this when she couldn't eat dry food or her own.  it was a life saver to her last days.

For her poos to be coming, you must be getting a decent amount of food for her to digest plus the fibre from it. 

Any news yet ? I have been thinking about you all day hoping to hear some good news :-)

Me too, hoping it went well.

We didn't go through with it, we lost our nerve when the vet started talking about the surgery options. My mind is blown from what I've learnt today and now we're even more confused.

We were under the impression that the mass was in her stomach and it's not, it's around the tube coming from the stomach and leading to the intestine.

The surgery options were several and only two can I fully grasp and remember before horror took over :-

(a)  take away the bottom part of the stomach including the pyloric sphincter along with the mass and the top part intestine, then join the stomach directly to the intestine, without the pyloric sphincter stomach acids can go directly to the intestine which can cause ulcers although this can be managed with drugs and special diet

(b)  create a complete bypass of the mass and seal off the bottom part of the stomach and therefore render the sphincter useless and take the stomach straight to the intestine and again drugs and special diet would be needed to combat the acid.

Both of these options are only good if the mass is totally non cancerous, if cancerous then prognosis can be as little as two months,  apparently the piece that was biopsied is non-cancerous but other parts of it could be cancerous (so what was the point of the biopsy)

The only way for them to be totally sure that the mass is non-cancerous is for the vet to un-zip her (his words) and have a look, then if good he'll remove in whatever option looks best and if not then not bring round from GA.  That's what I thought was going to happen today based on the belief that the mass was IN her stomach.

Other options are to continue with the Losec for another 2 weeks to a month then x-ray again to assess size of mass then decide where to go from then.

I feel as though I'm am back where I was just over a week ago.

We have brought her home with a months worth of Losec but she is booked for another x-ray/ultra-sound in two weeks, I have fed her several times, she has walked and poo'd.

I don't know what else to say I'm shot away.

It is so hard to make such big decisions,but I think you have made the right choice.

{{{HUGS}}}

Sheila xx

You can only do what you think is right for your girlie and be guided by the vet, I know it is so hard for you.
This page must be the most visited today on Champ Dogs as everyone is rooting for you both.
Hugs.

I do feel totally shattered though, I started the day thinking THIS IS IT based on it being in her stomach,  I now feel that I have to go through all of the decision thing all over again, but thank-you for you thoughts,everybody on CD has been really good for me recently

In your position I would have done the same thing.  It's natural though, that you don't know if you're coming or going. 

I think that you have to see how she goes.  Sometimes they tell us what is needed.  Just love her for now. 

Sending some of my strength to help you cope.

Has the vet given you any ideas at how common a problem this is. Do other dogs who have had it done have relatively easy or complicated lifestyles? Has your vet asked you to make a decision within a time scale? 
Give yourselves some time to gather your thoughts. See how the next two weeks pan out and take it from there maybe.
I know it's not exactly the same situation but when my parents lurcher had a severe stroke we all feared the worst. She couldn't walk, feed her self or wander in to the garden but dad, being dad and with the advice of the vet suggested meds. She went on to live another two and a half years. She became a prolific thief, even worse than she was before. She often ransacked the kitchen & bin in search of food during the night. Oh the capers she got up to! :-)
   

Oh my goodness I am so sorry, what an absolute wrench for you, I am sure you are shot to pieces and no wonder. However, I hope I would have done the same and not just gone through with it because it was 'planned' as in fact what you had planned was under a different view from the true picture, so you were strong tompull back and take stock.
Inagree, see how she goes, its the best way for now, to a novice the options you have described all sound somewhat worrying, not the clearcut decision ofnthe surgery you had decided on before.
You have her home now in one piece, just love her and nurture her, read her signs which you have done so well and we will all continue to root for her and send you our love and best wishes x

Really sorry to hear your no further forward, what a roller coaster, like others I would have made the same decision as you have, the options given sound very complicated and and a bit.....uncertain.

Hugs for you both.

> I'm only posting because I'm crying and I want to talk about my old goldie, she's 13 in December and not feeling well.
>

Just checking back to see if theres any further news and you know..each time I see this line it still moves me to tears. It speaks volumes of the love you have for her and could have been me writing about my golden girl 2 and a half years ago.
Thinking of you both.

Hi Elly

Well yesterday and today have not been too bad, I've now got her eating from a spoon with the bowl just under it and I slowly guide the spoon down in to the food,  I've managed to get her to eat of her own choice some of the time although I still have to top her up with some syringe feeding at other times just to ensure enough is going in.

It's mainly jars of baby food but I figured if it's OK for a 10mth human baby then it will be OK for a poorly old pooch, I've been mashing bit's of Royal Canin Sensitive or Chappie in to it as well but the crafty moo knows when there's more dog than human food in the mix, she does have one new passion and that's Farley's rusks of all things.

The toilet end of things is now daily and firm although less volume if you get my drift, she does still vomit bile in the night and occasionally she will mid morning.

Getting the tablets in to her was difficult but we've found a pill popper syringe type thing that seems to be quite good.

She is still waggy tailed and keen for her walks so we're just going one day at a time now and hoping that the tablets will at least help the sickness and increase the appetite.

I've been checking in to see if there was any news.

I'm glad that she seems to have turned a corner, allbeit a little one.   :-)

Ahh thank you for the update, bless her, so glad shes managing to eat a bit and still having some waggy walks. Its all special time and loving time.
Dont we all just have today for certain really, tomorrow will  always take care of itself no matter how much we try to dictate to it, we dont know what it holds for any of us.
Thinking of you all X

She is still waggy tailed and keen for her walks so we're just going one day at a time now and hoping that the tablets will at least help the sickness and increase the appetite.

I think that's all you can do really, if she still seems happy, long may it continue...

We need help on the PTS decision.

Feeding is getting more difficult, it's all syringe now, the tablets are not stopping the vomiting although they could be making it less than if she were not having them.

We think that it is getting close to the time for us to decide.

We want the vet to come to our home and for our girl to go in familiar surroundings, our vet says that it cannot usually be done as an emergency and he may not  be able to come on the day that we call so we would almost have to book it in advance.

How do we handle the booking of a PTS and get through the possible couple of days leading up to it?

We are really struggling with what is best to do as I know that when we get up tomorrow she will be lively and keen to walk but thoughout the day I will not get much more than half a mug of sloppy food into her.

Why can't she die in her sleep tonight?
Because she has amazing heart lung kidney and liver function, she just bloody starving with a monster mass that eats all of her food and stops her wanting to eat.
I hate all of this.

>I hate all of this.

Because you love her.  I have tears in my eyes as I read your post.

Love her enough to let her go.

HUGS.

Pinky, I have not read all the rest of the post but.....
Is she having more good days then bad????
If no, then you know yourself.
I went to the vets on the monday night with my old girl, got given the facts and went away to think about it.
I made the decision on the monday night to book her to be PTS the next day.
I went into the surgery on the tuesday morning and asked for a vet to come out, they booked the vet for 4 hours later.
They booked a vet and it was one of my vets that came out, She herself had looked at what she had to do and cried as she knew it was a difficult decision for me.
I coped by staying with her, from when I decided to when Shannon came to the house. The vet(shannon) came to my home and put her to sleep with me with her (totally different to the last dog I had PTS at the vets)
{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
Ring them up and tell them you know the time is right and you will have to pay but hopefully they will come when needed xxxxxx
I know what you are going through, just stay strong  for her xxxxx collapse when you have done the kindest thing you can ever do for her xxxxxxx
Lea xxx

Oh flower, yes, quite simply because you do love her so very much but you know what...even more so because she loves you so much and trusts you right to the very end and NEEDS you to do this for her. She needs you and trusts you to do this for her before she gets so bad that shes in constant pain and distress.
Let her go waggy tailed and huggy. Let her go to sleep dreaming of that walk. I cant type for these eyes full of tears as I KNOW how you feel and how hard this is. I know the gut wrenching feeling of making the call. I purposefully booked a day and time for my vet to come here so it remained in our control and so we could do our goodbye time happily and peacefully, knowing that this was finally it and this was our final memory making. It was so hard yet very special.
I think you know this is the time. Shes telling you. Please make the call if so. Advance is so much better than any emergency. A proper goodbye and sending her off to sleep calmly surrounded with love after all your loving care is so right rather than a panicked emergency PTS in a sudden decline.
Thinking of you so so much and hurting for you.