OH came in really upset yesterday Whistler (Show Cocker) caught his first rabbit and OH had to finish it off.
What surprises me apart from Whis running down a rabbit is how much "instinct" is still there despite him being breed to be a show dog? I suppose I should not be surprised but our (Jake) BC didnt really join in he was bemused (OH Said) but my boy was in the range and kept knocking it down and biting it.

I guess its gene's but he has got really quick nowadays.

The instinct is there regardless, it's just the dogs that are bred with work as the priority selection for working abilities will at the top of the list, where in show liens this may not be a priority, and may or may not be there in a strong way.

i have a crestie that was a fantastic ratter in her younger days this really shocked the rest of the family when she did it on a walk was away in the woods and then appeared further up the path with the rat in her mouth and family having a fit of put it down leave it drop it, i just said leave she dropped it and i kicked it into the under growth she is 12 now and if she thinks she can get a rat on a walk she will try.

Sorry for the rabbit but clever boy Whistler! My girl's older son apparently caught, killed and ate a rabbit in America before his owners could stop him - and he's a Cavalier!

Agree with you all regarding the instinct. We had a peke who would always chase and kill mice much to the cats annoyance.!

I know how you feel Viv - when Meg did it - and ate it in front of me - I felt sick and was so glad there were no children around to see it.  However it is only nature after all.  I don't keep cats now because I can't stand them catching birds and small animals. 

i was upset when my standard schnauzer killed a squirell in the park, we always thought she was so sweet but as i have said before on here, she is a wolf in dogs clothing

My GR catches and kills squirrels and have to agree that the first time it happened I was really surprised that he had managed to outrun it let alone catch and dispatch it. He has a wonderful temperament and it really brought home to me how the veneer of domestication can be so quickly stripped away by natural instinct.

but a cocker spaniel should not have an instinct to kill a rabbit in its genes!!! Only a terrier should have this instinct. Gundogs should retrieve LIVE game to hand without a mark onit, not KILL it!

Would instinct not take over though Sam if the gundog is not trained as a gundog? I have no idea :-) My GR has a wonderfully soft mouth and can carry eggs without breaking them but squirrels seem fair game to him and he does catch and kill them. My terrier would also if he got there before the GR - the terrier has taken birds out of the air on occasions whereas my GR doesn't bother about  birds at all.

Surely all dogs way back in time would have needed to catch and kill prey in order to survive and it is this instinct that has been acted upon by the dogs mentioned?

Well I would say that all dogs have the instinct to hunt and kill, but selective breeding and then reinforcement through training, has altered the drives into, herding, retrieving and tracking without going in for the kill.

This doesn't mean if those desired traits are not selected for that some will not revert to basic canine instinct.

Even when selection for the desired altered behaviour is selected for you still get some hard mouthed gundogs, sheep dogs that worry stock etc.

>i have a crestie that was a fantastic ratter in her younger days

My last Toy Poodle was a rat catcher!   The terriers used to stand and watch her!  I hated the way they squealed when being killed.

>My GR has a wonderfully soft mouth

I had a terrier cross that would come through to the living room, and gently place her pals on the floor.  She used to carry baby frogs in!  They were always unmarked and unharmed.

Yet she would kill mice and eat them in the blink of an eye.