As a committee member of our mother club I compile a list of newly hip/elbow scored dogs and give the parents and thier scores as well for the information of our members to help with the reserch of health status of dogs for breeding etc.. The scores are published in the BRS ever quarter and I have in the past used the Health test results finder to obtain the names and scores of the parents of said dogs. No more it would seem, the KC in thier dubious wisdom now use the "Mate select" as the default choice for looking up scores and this although comparing parents scores does not give names but only scores of parents. This then effectivly stops any more reserch into the background of a given dog as if you do not know the names of the parents you can go no further. Pretty clever no??
Does anyone know of a way of obtaining the names of a dogs parents from the KC website without having to ring or mail the KC with a list of all the names I need the info on?
I am sure I am not alone in wanting to look up the details of a dog with a view to using him as stud before I commit to asking his owners for all his details after all on occasion a dog I have liked the look of has failed miserably to come up to scratch on his ansestors health testing and I prefferr not to have to annoy owners by requesting details then having to explain why his health record or that of parents etc.. is not to my liking.
Seems to me that the mate select has falled flat on it's face at the first hurdle...
Aileen

This was pointed out as a weakness in this tool, and someone suggested it was so the KC did not loose revenue as the detialed info is available for those who want to pay for it (via BRS ir reporsts by breed that can be ordered).  The KC person admitted that this was the reason.

Always wondered why there were no names in the health test pedigree.

Why can't we have an open database like the Finnish Koiranet, which works in real time with dogs details appearing as things get updated, so you can find recent litters etc.  You can see a dogs main show/working wins, how many litters and to which bitches any heakth test results fior them and their progeny all on the one page.

What's the point of knowing a COI when you don't know what aqncestors are causing it?  Knowing which ancestors are linebred to is more important than just the COI.

Sounds about right Barbara...how can they market such a thing as helpfull when they take away the tools you actually need, after all what good are scores if you have no idea who the owners of them are. How can you compare what a given dog has been producing or what his siblings scored if you have no names...I despair of the KC at times. have asked for someone a little higher up the food chain than the dippy girl I spoke to this morning to ring and have also mailed them...lets see what the answer will be..
I await with great antisipation of how much they will walk round the question....they would make great politicians

That was always a great tool of the KC's in being able to see the parentage and their scores.
Have to say that it made brilliant reading for what you have compiled and the added extras which make for interesting questions.. ;-)

I'm not a breeder but used the health test finder all the time to research my own dogs and others I was interested in as far back as I could. It's very frustrating that the Mate Select tool has anonymised all this. For me it's not so much about accessing the information for free, since a modest subscription would presumably help to cover administrative costs--but I would much prefer not to have to hunt across several sources to tease out bits of data. As tight as it sounds, £21 for an annual subscription to the BRS is out of the question for me now...maybe next year things will be better.

You won't find names or parentage in the BRS except of pups born. If you are wishing to reserch further back on an adult dog via the health test results you can not do it any more....
Aileen

As there are already great open kennel club databases like then Finnish Koiranet, or the Norwegian dog web (for the latter you have to be a member) why is it so dificult for the kennel Club to follow suit?

Barbara, maybe we should begin a drive to get the KC to follow suit ? Not sure how we would go about it though. any ideas ?
Aileen

To be honest it's been obvious that they din't want to go this route, else the thign woudl ahve been up and running for ages, they wnated to devise a systemn where they could have their cake and eat it too.

What they ahve created is a breeding by numbers system, so they cna direct people to lower COI's because of the critics, and known issues with high inbreeding levels, but nothign to mensure that thre is enough info to help make quality/detailed decisons.

The most useful thing in the mate select health test checker for any dog or bitch that has health tested progeny is using the compare to progeny tool.  this tells you how many litters/pffspring have been registered.

This could help with the popular sire syndrome, but few people will realise it's there, and useless for breeds that don't health test under KC schemes.

Sadly Koiranets UK language version is inactive at present, but have a look at the details on a dog I used imported to Finland from Norway and how much data is there for just searching his name: http://jalostus.kennelliitto.fi/frmKoira.aspx?RekNo=FIN32947%2F02&R=242

Not that it means a word to me Barbara but I get your drift there is obviously loads of info there. We do have the Berner data base but it is not used by the UK very much :- http://www.bernergarde.org/dbaccess/BG_Main.html
I wish we had something like this in the UK.
I can see why people go to the continant to find dogs as the info is there and easy to access.
Aileen
Sorry, open it and enter "Vellbern" in the "dogs" section (IT's my affix and you will see how much info can be made availabe.

Breed databases are all well and good, but you want one easy to find central KC database.

I added 2 dogs to this and have regular contact with the people who update the Bernergarde, I think that more people in the UK should be using it, its something there for all to use and is a very useful tool if others would be more obliging with their dogs details..

via BRS ir reporsts by breed that can be ordered
Can you tell me a little more about this Barbara?

If you go into the part of the Knnel club site, publications I think you should find that you can by reports by breed.  Like alll Hip score results for the breed, and I ASSUME THE OTHER HEALTH SCHEMES TOO

I know they don't do all breeds but have you looked at www.worldpedigrees.com They also don't do the COI but you can get the parents names, and the pedigrees, for the breeds they do have. I have found that not all members of a litter are named but there is still information available that the KC don't give. It's somewhere to start, maybe.

There is www.pawvillage.com

It has pedigrees and info for all breeds but does depend on breeders/owners putting the info there. 

For dachsie specific pedigrees there is www.rabows.com

The info on there is checked by the owner before being put there.

> There is www.pawvillage.com
>
>

Another pedigree resource - brilliant!!
I can see this one being a useful addition to my list, thanks. :-)

Glad I could help.

A wonderful resource for whippets which also includes COI, ancestor loss and other interesting figures (the COI tool has just been added) is http://thewhippetarchives.net/

The COI tool shows just how faulty the KC model is as it's missing (the KC one I mean) so many dogs it can't give complete results.  A breeding with a European dog one line back means it's already incomplete before you even start whereas with the breed specific one you can get COI to ten generations with most dogs. And where it can't it will only give you the furthest complete generation. With the KC one it just really seems to guess.

It was a nice idea in theory but a really flawed execution in the end :(