One of my previous puppies (Lucy bred by me from Phoebe RIP) has since gone on to have puppies (by it's new owner I should add - I stay in contact with most of my previous puppies new owners), it's her 2nd litter - 1st litter was fine one still born but all other pups (8) survived.  However this litter has been devastating to say the least!  One of puppies started screaming (sounded like a seagull to me when they called me to ask for advise) I advised the owner to take the pup straight to the vets.... They did and after giving the pup a re-hydrating injection and a thorough examination (including x-rays) the vet was unsure what was wrong.. since then they have lost 6 puppies, all symptoms starting with the seagull cry, then bloating stomach; except the last one that passed today, which never made any distress noises; over the weekend Lucy was constantly picking that pup up and removing it from the whelping box and laying with it away from the other pups where she was continually licking it and trying to stimulate it... Now that one has just passed away, she's taken the pup to the vets who is going to perform an autopsy.

Anyway the question is has any other breeder out there lost a litter to this extent?  The vet has ruled out Canine Herpes and said it would not be Fading Puppy Syndrome due to the vocal noises the pups were making.....

All relevant health tests were done prior to mating..

So any advise or experiences regarding this would be gratefully received - I will pass them all on to the owner - who to say the least is absolutely heartbroken

Thank you x

fading puppies often do make this noise i lost ten pups like this about 5yrs ago some times theydo sometimes not deverstating  my heart goes out yo you ihadp/m showed nothing i think they did about 5 pups so sad

Hi,

I used to have Boxers, and over a very long time span, l lost 2 complete litters this way, one of 9, and one of 11. Each time they wailed like seagulls...... l came to dread hearing this sound........ and each time, over an 11/12 day period, they all died. My vet always put it down to Fading Puppy Syndrome. I also had P.Ms done, but each time they come back inconclusive. I think that it truly is, one of the most distressing things to have to go through, for both bitch and owner. Unfortunately, l don't have any pearls of wisdom to offer, but somewhere on this site, there are successful stories of puupies who apparantly had, F.P.S..

Kind regards,

Josie

The vet has ruled out Canine Herpes and said it would not be Fading Puppy Syndrome due to the vocal noises the pups were making.....

FPS is not defined by any one thing it is just where pups fade and die, often without explanation and categorised under FPS. I'm so sorry for these terrible losses how awful for the breeder I would be inconsolably devastated. Pass my wishes onto her.........

Thank you - I feel so sorry for the owners; I've never known or experienced this before.  The worse for me was having a still born - which was a traumatic experience :( I can't imagine the agony losing nearly a whole litter could cause.  And although I only listened to the screams over the telephone it was heartbreaking

Thank you Carrington - I will pass this on to them x

I agree it does sound like fading puppy a litter my boy sired had similar symptoms , the owner phoned me and we did some research and came up with "plasma transfusion" an article on champ dogs ,the owner acted quickly had this done and 7 out of 9 survived and have becme big strapping pups now over 12 mths old , , best wishes to your puppy owner it must be awfull xx

Hi  NEWFIENOOK,

we did some research and came up with "plasma transfusion" an article on champ dogs ,the owner acted quickly had this done and 7 out of 9 survived

Yes that's one of the posts on here that l was thinking about, and the other one was about giving a little of the liquid which liver?, beef?, something similar to that, had been boiled in. I can't quite remember the details of the second one.

Kind regards,

Josie

<<The vet has ruled out Canine Herpes>>

How did he do this?

Having lost a litter of 10 to Canine Herpes I'd have to say very sadly that it sounds very much like our experience.

I know someone that I know of has mentioned goitre/hypothyroid problems which have been mistaken for FPS in some breeds.  Is hypothyroid a problem known in your breed?

how are they doing today

Sounds like canine herpes to me also, its so sad, my heart goes out to the owners :-(

so very sad! im so so sorry for the breeder :-(

can i plz ask!! some pups out a litter that have been born .but over half the litter have been lost to Canine Herpes, the serviving pups are touch and go to start with but then start to grow strong and are ok will they not ever carry Canine Herpes???.

Sounds like FPS to me if canine herpes has been ruled out. I can't imagine how they must be feeling, terribly sad. But they mustn't blame themselves, nature can have terribly cruel ways at times and it seems the bitch knew something wasn't quite right with the last pup, such a shame. They tried everything they could but sometimes there simply aren't answers.

We lost 7 out of a litter of 9 a few years ago, which was totally devastating, as like you, we'd done all the health checks prior to mating and the bitch had had the Canine Herpes Vaccine. We decided to have an autopsy done and the result even surprised the Vet, somehow the puppies had picked up a very virilant strain of ecoli that didn't respond to most types of antibiotics. It had probably been brought into the whelping room via the bitch when she'd been let out for a wee and she'd come into contact with Pigeon Poo!

Now everytime a nursing bitch goes out for a wee, she's washed down with anti bac solution before being allowed back in with the pups.

The autopsy has been done and nothing was found!  Some good news is that the 3 remaining puppies are still with her and she called today to say their eyes were opening :-)

She's not getting her hopes up though and said when she woke this morning and saw only 2 pups she thought she'd lost another one; but it was hiding under mums leg.

I think the vet is waiting on a couple more tests results to come back

Thank you for all your comments x

Hi Just a thought and I know its let input but has the vet checked for meningitus(however its spelt).  We had a pup who squealed like that and lost him within 24hrs. The vet couldn't find anything (inc no temp raise)and recommended an autopsy.  Thank god we did.  Apparently they dont test for everything on the autopsy neither, it was only as the vet requested this as he had seen it a few years before. 
Glad the other 3 are geting stronger fingers crossed,  it must be awful for the owner my heart goes out to her and her bitch x

Glad they're well,keeping fingers crossed.

Just had an update - 3 remaining puppies are still doing well :-D they are still waiting on further autopsy results