Q in the title really. what I've been wondering is can a dog that is nervous aggressive with other dogs ever really be 'fixed' to the point where they can be trusted off lead around strange dogs, walked off lead in areas where dogs may be encountered unexpectedly?
All the training methods I've seen and heard seem to be more management to my mind. Getting a really good recall, getting the dog to focus on you with a watch me when others are near are all things that I know are great in creating a dog that will be fine in controlled situations but what I really would like to know is whether you can ever completely take away the fear and therefore the aggression. (or risk of it)?

any one ever done it?

Well I'm currently attending special training classes for dogs with problems. The majority are nervous aggressive with other dogs, mine and the odd other one is it with people but fine with dogs. It's clicker training and there are most definitely improvements being made with all of the dogs, but of course it's a slow process and mustn't be rushed. You can get to the level you describe but it will vary from dog to how how long it will take and how possible it is -and I dare say a lot will depend on breed.

Have look at Control Unleashed, by Leslie Mcdevitt. A lot of this book and its techniques are aimed at fear-aggressive/nervous dogs, and there are a lot of people (myself included) who have taken some of her approaches and used them with success.

Checked for this book on Amazon and it's currently unavailable - I wonder if it's still in print.  I love finding new dog behaviour books to read :-)

Try this link...
I typed name & title into google shopping and about 4 or 5 different websites have it for sale. This website was the cheapest....
http://www.positiveanimalsolutions.co.uk/cul.html
I have JRT from rescue with fear aggression and at the age of 3 years when i got her she had never been for a walk in her life! :-( She had lived in a back garden. She has improved so much but still has issues that could be tweaked! The reviews for it are good too.

Thank you, I've not come across that site before either - will enjoy a good browse :-)

thanks both for your input.

Feisty Fido is another good book

> He was brilliant at getting the dog to look at him and offering her a treat, but when she lunged or barked he shouted 'NO' at her.

I'm glad you and your girl have made great progress, but I would never, never recommend that anyone do this with a fearful dog.

For one thing, the dog is already in a heightened state of stress, and from that alone is more likely to react.  If you then add shouting (or any form of aversive/punishment, anything the dog does not like or gets upset by), you raise those stress levels even further and make a reaction even more likely than it already was.

For another, if the dog starts to learn that when it is in that particular situation, and/or when another dog (or whatever he/she is afraid of) is present, he/she will get told off, that raises the stress levels yet again making reactions even more likely.  Add to that that dogs learn primarily by association - see dog, get told off; so your dog learns that (at least to his/her mind) the presence of a dog is a predictor for being told off (or having an aversive applied if you do that, such as a leash correction or water spray, as examples).  This increases the problem because the dog then starts trying to stop the situation happening, in order to avoid being told off: bolting behaviour can begin or worse, your dog can start increasing his/her reactions in a serious bid to frighten the other dog off before he/she gets told off/punished.

And there's another risk.  The use of positive punishment (adding something the dog doesn't like: verbal correction, leash correction etc) can suppress the dog's reactions.  Sounds good?  It's not.  The dog learns that its reactions trigger a punishment so he/she learns not to show them at all until it is too late.

In other words, the dog does not let you, other people, other dogs etc know that he/she is very frightened and feeling threatened until the 'threat' is too close; your dog panics and lashes out.  Basically, you find yourself with a dog that attacks with no warnings whatsoever, because it's been punished into not showing those warnings.

In any case, the dog should not be put in a position where it feels threatened enough to react; any work should be done far enough away that the dog is relaxed enough for progress.  Putting the pressure on through proximity to the 'threat', and the resulting stress, will actually slow the process down - stressed dogs cannot learn properly.

Nikita. Great post. With a fearful dog I would not push them out of their comfort distance,  shouting or a loud reprimand is of no help, just masks the dogs feelings & makes them even more unpredictable. Classes help with confidence, so do doggy friends but I think that I shall always have to be on the lookout assessing situations and if he shows signs of unease get out of the way or take avoidance.