I don't know whether this is the right place to post this topic. Anyway, I wanted to find out what people thought of the following.
Our breed club has a database of pedigrees going back at least  10 generations as well as health tests. However we are not allowed to access it as apparently the club has signed an agreement with the KC not to disclose the information, even to members. Although as a member I can request information on my own dog eg extended pedigree as long as I agree to the same non disclosure as the club.

Personally I feel that this is a very closed shop reaction and would like information, particularly pedigrees open to all members.
Can you tell me whether your breed clubs abide by these rules.?. Seems a bit pointless to me if this information is just kept in a database which is closed.!

Years ago, back in the dark ages, our breed club kept health tests results confidential but it was realised pretty soon that was totally pointless and members had to agree to their results (good and bad) being made public. There were problems with those people who had had their dogs tested before this became compulsory (always the ones who had bad results - funny that, wonder why?) who insisted that the confidentiality on those tests be kept.
It's pointless refusing access to pedigrees since they are all in the public domain (having being published in the BRS). Anyone could take the time and redo this database - just seems totally stupid to have to reinvent the wheel.
I would suspect the access problem goes back to someone with poor results buried in there!
I would be very interested to see this "agreement" with the KC and would expect it only to apply to health results.

Again - if these results have appeared in print, there is no confidentiality issue.

Keeping facts like this hidden is definitely not in the interests of the good of any breed.

Yes I so agree with you. I cannot believe that information regarding pedigrees is "protected" by some KC agreement.
I suppose health tests are protected. However I requested an 8 generation pedigree of MY dog which was sent via email to me with the strict understanding that it would NOT be published on the net.!

I shall be asking what is to prevent me researching my dogs pedigree that far back and putting it on the net if I wanted to.?
I also would like to see this agreement on privacy with the KC.

Thank you for replying.

Can not imagine why a club would collect and collate all this useful information and then not use it for the benefit of the breed and it's members. There can't be a reason why this is withheld from the members if it only contains the pedigrees and health test results as that information is already in the public domain, all the club has done is to collect it into a usable database and it should be available to all and IMO the membership have a right to the information anyway.

Agree all you have to do now is go on the KC website to find the health tests of any dogs you know the name or kc reg number of.  The BRS publishes the results of all Health Tests therefore it is difficult to understand why anyone let alone a breed club would deny access to information that is already in the public domain unless of course they are holding OTHER than evidence based information! ;)

I am rather annoyed as on Face Book I said that my dogs CO1 according to the Mate Select tool was very low as she is by an import.
The "Holder" of the Clubs database then responded by saying that according to a 10 generation pedigree that she has my dogs COI was much higher.! Seems there is 1 rule for members and 1 for those in power.........

Well print it off for your next AGM, along with the printed statement re agreement with KC and light blue touch paper and stand back.;)

Have now received a copy of an agreement between the KC and the breed club, which categorically states that info re health tests, pedigrees cannot be printed/published on the web.!!
So this means for example I could not put up an extended pedigree of MY dogs on a website.
On the other hand there is the facility to access health tests on the KC site, so what is going on...?

But it could be made available to the membership in printed form or are the KC claiming copyright?

I really don't get it why your breed club and KC have this kind of agreement?
What century is it from :)?

My breed has a UK database where pedigrees and health test results are all online...
You can search by affix, stud or brood bitch and get all healthresults/pedigrees to come up.
http://www.leonbergerstudbook.org.uk/new_page_6.htm

We also have few international databases where pedigrees/test results can be found for dogs from different countries, including UK dogs and pedigrees going back 10+ generations...

I really don't think there is anything stopping you to publish your dogs pedigree online if you wish to do so.

Also, the mate select is not very clear on how many generations it goes back when calculating COIs.
My girls all come as 0% in the mate select so it must take the COI from last 5 generations or something as other databases do give them little bit larger COIs when more generations are taken in account...

Surely your dogs pedigree is yours so you can post it if you want.  As you can get the BRS from the KC for years I don't understand why they would put in this ruling?  All seems very, very weird!

Thanks for your replies, so interesting to see how other breed clubs operate.. To Noora , I am very impressed with the Leonbergers pedigree and health checks. It seems they were well aware of Inbreeding Co-efficients long before the KC got in on the act.

This was my point about pedigrees, surely they are mine or rather the dogs...!!!

> As you can get the BRS from the KC for years I don't understand why they would put in this ruling? 

maybe as it would mean they wouldn't sell so many of the eh BRS.

Note the Mate-select doesn't show you a pedigree (which would show you which animals were inbred on) as the Finnish Koiranet does.

>> As you can get the BRS from the KC for years I don't understand why they would put in this ruling? 
> maybe as it would mean they wouldn't sell so many of the eh BRS.

My knowledge of the Data Protection Act is a little sketchy but I believe you are only allowed to store and use data in a way that was understood when it was collected ie people knew at the time that they registered their litters that it would appear in the BRS but that is all.

I thought the data protection was to protect the data collected about people - that does not apply to dogs surely, if you leave the owners name and details out of it then you should be able to publish if you wish anything but copyright material - are the KC claiming that pedigrees and health test information are their copyright?

> I thought the data protection was to protect the data collected about people

You could be right :)  As I said, I am a bit sketching. 

I dont understand about Data Protection, but when we submitted recent eye tests to our club, we were told that they would be put on the clubs database, fair enough, but we are not "allowed" access to them........
It begs the question as to whose benefit any of this is, certainly not the paid up members.

Just a quick update, our breed club webmaster has written to both the KC and the Leonberger Club asking how they go about putting pedigrees and health tests online and freely available. So watch this space.....

Thank you all so much for the ideas and support, particuarly Noora who gave me the Leonberger link. It looks as though we might be getting somewhere but I wouldnt have been able to press ahead without the extra information from CDers...!!

I'm glad I could help.
Hopefully they will get open database going as it can be very useful tool for responsible breeders :) and also for puppy buyers to see what has been bred by certain people, amount of litters etc.

I'm sure many other breeds have similar databases too, I only know of my own breeds :)
Leonberger club also has an open health registry for dogs with other possibly inherited illnesses(such a PN, Heart issues, AF, Addisons)  where owners can get them published in for everybody to see(vets proof required), again useful tool and could in time point out lines where some issues might be in...
Unfortunately very few dogs details are there so far.

all our breed clubs have a health test data base, The newfoundland club, northernnewfoundland club and the southern newfoundland club , they are all maintained by the same person , if you need any help you could contact him via the websites

Thank you