I've got my eye on a nice looking litter, currently 5 weeks old. The breeders of course aren't at the stage of making decisions yet, they are happy for me to have one but they know I want a show potential one, of course I know they can't guarantee a winner etc but I have a pet quality puppy already at home, bless her, and I want the best possible chance of getting a good one this time. So if / when we get to the stage of actually visiting (they've been sending me some lovely pics!), I'm trying to decide (a) if I want to take one of my friends who shows or breeds, and (b) whether that is an acceptable thing to do, or if I should just trust the breeders to pick me out the best show potential puppy (after they and the bitch's breeder have taken their pick). I trust them not to sell me one if they don't think it will be any good, they'd be daft to as I'll trawl it round the show ring giving them a bad name until I realise it's not a show puppy! But do I want another opinion from one of my friends? I'm not entirely sure the friends that would be willing to go with me would be much better at picking than I would be, and I'm not sure that the friends I would trust to pick a good puppy would be bothered to trek over to view the litter with me. And I'm not sure whether it's polite to ask if I can bring a friend to begin with!

Only my personal thoughts but I would say to the breeder that you know they are the best people to advise you on the litter as they are assessing them on a daily basis and rather than you let your heart rule your head you would like to bring a friend who also has knowledge/experience, or just say that they would like to see pups ( who wouldn't)

If I were the breeder I would be happy for them to be seen/evaluated by many people. If I were the person asked to accompany someone I would be pleased that they were putting faith in me and it is also a learning experience for everyone.

Good Luck with your choice.

I certainly would want to take someone experienced in that breed though as taking someone whose experience is with a very different breed might just muddy the waters.

Of course there are those people who have an eye for a dog and for picking puppies especially.  The latter is really someone to have along.

When I had my first litter both the stud dog owner and my bitches breeder came to see them, but in fact neither were much help choosing the right puppy, and with experience and hindsight I would have kept a different one to the one I did.

A lot of breeders like to have 'puppy picking' parties and also have virtual photographic ones, to have a broad range of input and opinion, even though they know exactly what they will do themselves, it's no bad thing to see things from another perspective.

As a breeder I have no objections to people bringing friends that are impartial.

Thanks! I don't really trust my own opinion - I have been trying to pick from the pictures they've sent, and have asked various friends and acquaintances with various experience. But I find it hard to get over the 'aww cute puppies' syndrome and look at them properly! I'm not sure who to ask either - friend A who would probably be keen to come but has never bred, though she's owned my breed for years (never top quality ones), and fancies herself an expert because HER friend breeds a lot. Friend B who might be able to come and has bred at an average level. Friend C who is rather temperamental and might either say she doesn't like any of them just because she's in a mood, or quite likely refuse to leave her own dogs to come with me anyway, but has bred some lovely dogs and is probably the one I would trust for an opinion most if she would give a fair one and not let her state of health / bad mood colour her decision (she sounds awful when I describe her like that but she's lovely really, just unpredictable!). Or even friend D who might be willing to come and has bred but never really shown.

To be honest none of those seem to have the level of experience to really be much use.  Do you not know anyone who judges and breeds at top level?

No, that's what I thought too Brainless! I know a couple of people, but I'm not really an important enough person to have someone give up their time just to help me pick a puppy. And would the breeders not mind me bringing someone they know isn't a proper friend of mine to help me pick? It's a bit different from bringing a friend, it's more like bringing a top breeder because I don't trust them to help me pick themselves.

I've had people bring (ticket) judges with them to chose several times -and spend hours picking, and I didn't mind at all, it was just interesting as of course I ended up getting views of ALL the pups including my own choices. I've also had a judge come with me to pick from a litter. I can't see why anyone would mind.

One of the breeders does award tickets herself and they have made up at least 1 champion. I'm just unsure about approaching the people I only slightly know and asking them to trek over to these other people just to help me out. They might have a litter of their own and not want me to be buying and showing something nice! I don't know, perhaps I'll just trust the breeders to help me. :-)

Not meaning to cause offence, but none of those friends/acquaintances sound experienced enough to be helpful and could just muddy the waters and confuse you.  If the breeder is a champ show judge and has made up a champion, and knows you want to show this pup, I would rely on the breeder to help you choose.  After all, it's in their interest too, to see that you get a pup of show quality, as the pup's achievements in the ring will reflect well on them...

Yes, that's what I'm thinking. I haven't really got any good friends that are top breeders, just acquaintances that I would feel uncomfortable asking to give up their day to help me out. And like you say, these people know I am hoping to show and that they would be better not selling me anything than selling something they aren't as sure as it's possible to be sure that will develop into something good. In some ways the person I'd most like to take is a work colleague, he was mostly picking out the same ones I was when I made him look at the pics. I tested him with Henry's litter (my CC winning boy I lost at 8 years old last year) without telling him what I was doing and he immediately picked him out of the litter at 3 weeks old! I think I'll just trust the breeder though. :-)

when i brought my girl she was the last puppy available, very tiny compared to the rest of the litter and a bit scrawny if im honest but still, she was a lively thing and i brought her as a pet. her breeders have been going 30yrs and trusted them completely after having a bad experience with a sick pup in the past. to cut the story short i then decided to show and she turned into a swan the breeders were shocked they had missed her lol, she only got as far as a rcc and she wouldnt show after that so i went looking for another :)
Like yourself i was really worried this next pup wouldnt be show worthy, this breeder has even longer experience and bred 40 something champions and as the pup was only 4wks old i didnt believe she could tell at that age !! Hes now on two tickets :)
not any help but good luck!

At the last count Ive had about 8 'ticket givers' to see my current litter and few have agreed!!

Of those: 3 liked one male best, 3 liked the other male best and the rest one of the females....but all put them in a very different order of quality.

I, myself, had yet another order of preference :-)

There is often a standout puppy, and the breeder will surely keep that, so you will probably get to chose the best of the rest.....not easy where markings are concerned so you may get several opinions if you ask others.

The answer is to take someone who is great at picking puppies...a real skill and not everyone ( breeder or not) has it.

Just to wish you luck x

That's good really though, isn't it, if the litter is of even quality so people can't pick a stand out best? One of the other people I sent the pics of this litter to liked the same ones you picked by the way, and another one preferred a couple of the others. I'm probably 3rd in line for pick, markings are all pretty good and apart from one, no mismarks (lovely head on that one, typical!). Hopefully in the next couple of weeks they will get to the point where I can go and see them in the flesh, as they usually look very different from their photos. Henry was very photogenic but I've seen plenty of puppies and adults who look pretty ordinary in a photo and when you see them in reality it's quite a different story. :-)

> In some ways the person I'd most like to take is a work colleague, he was mostly picking out the same ones I was when I made him look at the pics

I think that some people "have an eye" for picking a pup.

Years ago, when I chose my first Bearded Collie, I was the first person to visit, and was given pick of litter.  I was drawn to one particular bitch, and left a deposit.  In all fairness, I did get the pup that I had left a deposit for, but the breeder phoned me up after she had the stud dog owner visit.  She chose the pick of litter - the bitch that I had left a deposit for.

Two years later, I went back - again, first person to view the bitches second litter.  Again, I picked the best pup.  However, she wouldn't accept a deposit, as she wanted to keep a pup herself, and wouldn't promise me this particular bitch pup.  She wanted a judge to see them first.  As you can guess, I had picked the best pup, and was offered the only other bitch in the litter.  It was some time later that the breeder's hubby asked me why I had picked the two particular pups - what exactly had made me choose them.  I could only say to him, that I thought they were the best pups.  I couldn't give him a reason.  I just told him that I knew.  Sometimes it's best to go with your gut feeling.

Do you want to come with me Jean?? :-D

> Do you want to come with me Jean?? :-D

:-)  :-)

Going into hospital tomorrow - would much rather kiss puppies and smell puppy breath.  :-)

Aw, sorry to hear that, hope you feel better soon. :-)

Hope everything goes well Jean..