Hi, I'm looking at getting a new puppy & I am going to look at a litter in a couple of weeks. I have been checking the health tests done on both sire & dam & just wanted clarification on a couple of points. I don't know much about hip scoring but the sire has a score of 3.3 which I believe is good but the bitch is untested. Is this something I should worry about? Also the bitch is a carrier of PRA cord 1 & again is this something to worry about? I'm not intending to show or breed.

If it is a recommended health test for the breed then I would look for another breeder :-)

Agree with the above - in our breed we recomend testing hips / heart & cystinuria.Most of us also test elbows though this is not recomended - therefore i would consider a breeder who did all tests but not elbows - but would not touch a breeder that did not do the 3 recomended

Think in this instance it would be helpful if you told us the breed.

Thanks for the replies. I'm looking for an English Springer Spaniel............

You should try to find a breeder who has both parents tested for the relevant tests for the breed.

If you look here:  http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/download/1100/abshealthreqs.pdf

You'll see that Springers should definitely have eyes tested and the recommendations are also 1) Hip scoring 2) DNA test - fuco 3) Eye testing - gonioscopy only

HTH

As there are no shortage of well bred English Springers I would want both parents to have had all recommended health tests with good results and to have good temperament - not too hyper unless you are going to work it and even then you want it to be sensible.

Okthen, if I decide that these pups aren't good enough, can anyone point me in the right direction to find a well bred pup? I currently have a working type but I am looking for a show type this time round.

I would start with the breed clubs and see if they have puppy lists - for eg:  http://www.englishspringer.org/puppy.php

Check out the litters advertised on Champdogs.

Look at the KC litters listed: http://www.the-kennel-club.org.uk/services/public/psar/

Go through all that lot, phone or email and ask and ask again!

I would not buy a puppy from a parent that was not hip-scored.  The inheritance of Hip dysplasia is not simple, so to have half the picture missing is not good at all.  All breeds can be Dysplastic so there is no excuse not to score.

The sires score is very good.

Being a Carrier for a recessive condition is not an issue as long as the other parent is clear.

Some of the offspring will be clear some carriers (statistically half of each), but this makes no difference in a dog destined to be a pet.

If the puppy was to be bred from it would need to be DNA tested (as well as Hip socred etc) to see whether it was carrier or clear and then an appropriate partner chosen.

> but I am looking for a show type this time round.

If you like the working type but would like a dog who looks more like the show type you can still find them I was talking to a vet at Crufts who was showing in the keepers classes at Crufts and her dog could definitely hold his own in the show ring.

i have ess and all mine are health tested clear  and would not breed my bitch to a dog who doesnt have his health tests passed clear  also my males are health tested clear
some breeders breed to an untested or a dog/bitch that has failed one of the tests we have in ess
you must do your homework before you buy we are desperately trying to water down these problems that we have  by testing our dogs

Recommended health tests are not what people might imagine them to be.

You will find professional breeders use them as a means to differentiate their product.

That is fine, but fostering the idea that a dog that doesn't have KC recommended health checks is guaranteed to be poor standard or the breeder is negligent, a puppy farmer etc is simply rubbish.

Research the data behind the recommended tests and educate yourself as to the issues behind them.  

All the above said, a responsible breeder should be aware of recommended tests and the issues to do with potential breed health conditions.  They dogs may not have had all the recommended checks but they should certainly be able to tell you why and discuss the issues with you knowledgeably.

I can't think of a very good reason why breeders don't give their breeding stock the recommended health tests.  I certainly don't think it is just a marketing ploy!  Certainly, it is no guarantee but it does help to lessen the odds of breeding puppies with issues. 

There can be no good reason not to use the health tests available to improve the odds of producing the healthiest puppies.

>fostering the idea that a dog that doesn't have KC recommended health checks is guaranteed to be poor standard or the breeder is negligent, a puppy farmer etc is simply rubbish.

That is exactly what it is a sign of, someoen who doesn't care enough and doesn't want the added expense of testing.