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Topic Dog Boards / General / To have or not to have my 2yr neutered?
- By Fazza [gb] Date 10.01.11 14:28 UTC
It has been a very long time since I have been on here so my story is, I am the proud owner of a 2yr FC who is traditional in the way his tail is always wagging, excitable and loves people and other dogs - probably too much! I have never had any issues with him what's so ever. I have avoided the neutering issue as I was told when we brought him that the breed was slow on maturity and that they did not mature until about 2 1/2 yrs old, we have no intentions of breeding him but I am constantly having to defend my decision on why he has not been 'done' or being 'done' in the very near future. I am due to visit the vet shortly and will recieve my lecture on medical grounds why he should be neutered and various dog friends say the same and they also say he will calm down. Do not get me wrong I am not totally against it but because he does not ' hump' we have never felt the need.  I would value some opinions from people that know what they are talking about :)
- By claire_41 [gb] Date 10.01.11 14:35 UTC
I have a 2yr old FCR bitch and yes they are incredible slow to mature but thats what i love about the breed, they are wonderful and she has very much tought me to live life to the full. They are not called peterpan dogs for no reason ;) 

i'd be interested to find out who you are having to defend yourself against for not having him "done" surely its your decision and your decision only (obvioulsy any medical issue would be different).

My good friend has a very forgiving rottie who normally has my FCR trotting beside her kissing her CONSTANTLY :)
- By Goldmali Date 10.01.11 14:55 UTC
Neutering won't calm a dog down, all it will do is stop it from fathering puppies. :) If you have no problems, there is no need whatsoever to go ahead. I'm sure for every argument a vet could come up with stating potential health problems when not neutering, you could very easily find potential problems WITH neutering. I have no problems with having it done on a fully mature dog but if it ain't broke, don't fix it! I have had both dogs that were neutered and that never were and it's been a case of what circumstances dictated, nothing else. Those that were kept entire for life did not get ill.
- By jacksgirl [gb] Date 10.01.11 14:59 UTC
I would be finding a new Vet who listened to his client and accepted their decisions.  I cannot see any reason why this dog needs to be neutered (other than to bolster the Vet's income :-))
- By LucyDogs [gb] Date 10.01.11 15:15 UTC
If he doesn't hump and has no behavioural issues, leave well alone. Even if he does, training is the route to go down before neutering. Those hormones do so much more than just marking / seasons. If the vet nags you every time you go, tell him you have no intention of neutering unless it becomes medically necessary, and that you would appreciate him making a note of this so as to stop asking you.
- By Mandy D [gb] Date 10.01.11 15:15 UTC
It is interesting the replies on a site that is mostly breeders rather than on a rescue site where nearly everyone would say neuter. There are health reasons for neutering dogs but maybe not quite as important as the health reasons for neutering bitches. I always have bitches rather than dogs but if I had a dog it would be neutered. There are probably a lot less in season bitches around then there used to be but if he does meet one he will want to do what comes naturally and be frustrated that he can't. My feeling is that if he is not going to be bred from what reason is there not to do it?
- By judgedredd [gb] Date 10.01.11 15:17 UTC
when we moved house and changed our vets and he saw all the dogs he asked me why only one male was not castrated and i explained that we showed him and needed his bits, he said ok and never asked me again if i wanted him to be done, but before the new vets our old vet went on and on about neutering my dogs and bitches etc got fed up with him going on abut it and told him so and told him it was my decision .

tomorrow though we are taking one of our dogs to the vets to be castrated, reason i do not show him any more, i do not want to breed from him.

and as far as i am concerned he will not be pinched as he will not be worth anything to anybody once the bits are gone but he will have a life with us until the end of his days
- By Goldmali Date 10.01.11 15:25 UTC Edited 10.01.11 15:29 UTC
There are probably a lot less in season bitches around then there used to be but if he does meet one he will want to do what comes naturally and be frustrated that he can't.

But that goes for neutered dogs as well! They still mate and tie. I've had numerous neutered dogs that do, of different breeds, neutered at different ages. In fact I've only ever had ONE that did not mate and tie after being neutered.
- By Goldmali Date 10.01.11 15:28 UTC
and as far as i am concerned he will not be pinched as he will not be worth anything to anybody

Sadly dog thieves no longer care about this. They'd steal a neutered 15 year old mongrel, because the way they make money is not by selling the dog on or breeding from it, it's by demanding a large sum of money from the owner to hand it back. So all that matters is the dog has an owner that wants it back.
- By mastifflover Date 10.01.11 17:15 UTC

> It is interesting the replies on a site that is mostly breeders rather than on a rescue site where nearly everyone would say neuter.


I'm not a breeder and I don't show my dog, he is just a pet - he is not neutered and he will not be. There is no medical advantage for him to be neutured (I will not put him through the risk of surgery with no benefit to him). He has met an in-season bitch & despite being excited by her, he had no issues or frustration from not being allowed to try to hump her.
I'm lucky in that our vets see no reason to have a male dog neutered 'routinely', providing the owner is responsible :)

> My feeling is that if he is not going to be bred from what reason is there not to do it?


"Clinically the arguments for neutering male dogs do not, in my opinion, stack up to much at all and
may it actually be a negative action when looking at their long term health
." By vet Mark Elliot, taken form here
- By Nova Date 10.01.11 17:25 UTC
It is your decision but if your are having no problems I can't imagine why you would neuter and lay your dog open to other problems associated with a neutered male. Would not listen to the vet it is nothing to do with them just learn to check the testis when you groom and all should be well.
- By Jocelyn [gb] Date 10.01.11 17:50 UTC
I agree if you have no problums leave him alone.
Even with problems it does'nt always work, and can make cases of fear aggresion much worse. 

Sometimes you have to neuter if there is a retained tesitical or both, or cancer. But then thats different.

He might 'calm down' but he might not. In any case he will calm anyway as he gets older (when he is about 12 joke)

I am not against it either, its the right thing for some dogs,  but dont see the need to do it if you are happy with how he is. He sounds lovely!
- By helensdogsz Date 10.01.11 17:53 UTC

> My feeling is that if he is not going to be bred from what reason is there not to do it?


I personally think it is actually bordering on abuse to subject a dog to surgery for no good reason. If the neutering does not carry health or behaviour benefits then why subject an animal to the stress of unneccessary surgery?
- By Brainless [gb] Date 10.01.11 17:57 UTC
I would print this http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/LongTermHealthEffectsOfSpayNeuterInDogs.pdf off for your vet, this shows there are more negatives than positives against neutering males on health front.

As your breed is more Cancer prone than some even more so.

If it ain't broke don't fix it.
- By Lacy Date 10.01.11 17:57 UTC Edited 10.01.11 18:05 UTC
I am not a breeder, have two male dogs that have both been neutered. The younger because he was crypto orchid and the elder for reasons that seem too trivial now & because we were constantly asked by the vet, I wish everyday we hadn't. The younger obviously had to be and because of his age at the time has always remained very much a puppy, the other dog was always insecure but held his own. Since neutering this has changed, he is charged and humped by the large percentage of dogs (male & female, & those he used to play with), for along time he put up with it but now hates dogs charging in and if they go any where near his rear end will swing round and snap and not all other dogs leave it at that. His coat has thinned dramatically and skin problems increased. I would not neuter a male dog again other than for medical reasons.
As another OP has said it will not necessarily calm a dog down, neutering seems to be pushed as an alternative to training.
- By JoFlatcoat (Moderator) [gb] Date 10.01.11 18:50 UTC
We  have FCR's - actually we have 9 - including 4 entire males and an entire cocker, who all live together.    They have found their own pack structure without any strife - all live perfectly peacefully together, and they are very very bouncy - even the 9 year old - and long may it last.    I feel that if , heaven forbid, we should have to neuter one for medical reasons, the others would no longer be able to 'read' him, and confusion would reign.

Luckily our vets have never once suggested the 'N' word - they know it's more than their jobs' worth!

I'm not a believerer in unnecessary surgery.    I regard it as a mutilation.    I'm a great believer in sensible positive training.

Jo
- By Celli [gb] Date 10.01.11 20:51 UTC
I had my SBT Spud neutered at 3 years and I wish to hell I hadn't,it took away a lot of his confidence and I feel caused his minor dog aggression issues.If you keep him entire though, it would be good practise to check his testes once a month for any lumps.
- By Lacy Date 10.01.11 23:13 UTC

> I wish to hell I hadn't,it took away a lot of his confidence


Going off topic a little. I wonder what % of neutered dogs have fear aggression issues compared to those that haven't. Perhaps not all neutered dogs smell as ours does, but there are very few that he can play with that will leave him alone (not humping him). It's been said before many times but the shout 'my dogs friendly', leaves me clenching fists in pockets!
- By JeanSW Date 10.01.11 23:29 UTC

> My feeling is that if he is not going to be bred from what reason is there not to do it?


The reason would be in the health benefits of leaving the dog entire.
- By DerbyMerc [gb] Date 11.01.11 09:43 UTC
Agree with all the above - there are health benefits both ways.  

Vets have a vested interest in neutering just as they do with yearly boosters - you can't rely on them for impartial advice.
- By Nova Date 11.01.11 09:59 UTC
TBH apart from the relief of stress from knowing there is a bitch next door I do not think there is much if anything of benefit to the dog from being neutered and if my experience is anything to go by plenty of problems.
- By Goldmali Date 11.01.11 10:40 UTC
(Just tucking post on end, not replying to anyone in particular.) I have just this minute dragged my Cavalier off my in season Papillon bitch -just managed to get him off her without tying. The Cavalier was neutered 5 months ago and had never mated before he was neutered. So once again I have a neutered dog who doesn't know he is and hasn't changed because of it.
- By Fazza [gb] Date 11.01.11 10:53 UTC
Oh Jocelyn he is adorable and we would not be without him.
A big thanks to everybody that has taken the time to comment, I knew this was the place to ask and get great advice - he is keeping " his bits" unless we have to get them removed.
- By Sawheaties [gb] Date 11.01.11 10:57 UTC
I excpect he will be relieved to have kept them :) I concur with the others, I had my lad done at 6 due to health issues, didn't change anything. Just check for extra lumps and leave well alone I say!
- By mastifflover Date 11.01.11 11:31 UTC

> I have just this minute dragged my Cavalier off my in season Papillon bitch


I've read somewhere (can't find the article) that male dogs brains are 'hard-wired' prior to birth to show 'male' behaviours, your randy Cavalier proves this :-D
- By Jetstone Jewel [ca] Date 11.01.11 15:00 UTC
It was on this forum that I first learned there were significant benefits to NOT neutering a male, from the article Brainless posted.  I feel the article is very fair and it does give the risks and the benefits both ways and does urge readers to make the decision that is best for them and their dog in their situation.  My boy, Lab, is three now, not neutered, has never humped anything other than his Poppa Bear, does not mark in the house and is an all round good boy, most of the time.  He does not look to scrap with other intact boys and will avoid if he can but he will not back down either, he's not a whimp.  He'll stand up for himself if pushed, which he has been and we have had a few skirmishes.  I am lucky to have a Vet who supports my decision but in North America this is not the norm.

I have garnered quite a list of reading material on the subject, covering health, which is solely what the article by Laura Sanborn deals with, but also with behavioural and societal concerns.  One poster wondered about the % of aggression problems in neutered as opposed to intact dogs.  There was a study, C-BARQ, that addressed behaviour such as this for purposes of bringing up the best service dogs.  As far as I have found so far it is the ONLY study of it's kind and the results are very, very surprising in some cases.  It's in the list below but I will point it out for you: 

http://www.acc-d.org/2006%20Symposium%20Docs/Session%20I.pdf
Non-reproductive Effects of Spaying and Neutering
Proceedings of the Third International Symposium on Non-Surgical
Contraceptive Methods for Pet Population Control * www.acc-d.org
SESSION OVERVIEW - Dr. John Verstegen

This really should be read through as the summary lumps together the main findings but in reading you will discover they did find some differences by breed and gender.

Neuter/Spay - Health, Behavioural, Societal and Other Pros and ConsThis is a reading list of articles and papers by Veterinarians, breed clubs, trainers and others on the pros and cons of neutering or spaying your dog that I have found helpful and very educational. Most are based on extensive Veterinary research and also provide references you can check further. If you are wrestling with the question of when or whether to neuter/spay these may help. They do not all agree and one is even a rebuttal of another. One is a link to a radio show interview. One is a link to a medical testosterone suppressant not yet available in N. America but is in the U.K. and Australia. Some are not easy reading.

I think I personally found the first two in the list to be of most help and I appreciated the non-biased way the information was presented. The list is in no particular order, articles were simply added as I discovered them. If the links are not clickable I have tried to include the name of the paper and author in case you have to search for them. I hope this helps folks out and good luck with your decision. A tip, I went to my Vet to discuss the first two articles with her.

http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/LongTermHealthEffectsOfSpayNeuterInDogs.pdf
Long-Term Health Risks and Benefits Associated with Spay / Neuter in Dogs
Laura J. Sanborn, M.S.
May 14, 2007

http://avmajournals.avma.org/doi/pdf/10.2460/javma.231.11.1665
Determining the optimal age for gonadectomy of dogs and cats,
Margaret V. Root Kustritz, dvm, phd, dact

http://www.savethedals.org/earlyneuter.htm
Veterinary "Review" Article on Neutering, with Implications for Dalmatian Stone-Formers    Abstracted by Carroll H. Weiss
Study Group on Urinary Stones
Research Committee
Dalmatian Club of America

http://www.showdogsupersite.com/kenlclub/breedvet/neutr.html
NEUTERING MALE AND FEMALE DOGS
Mary C. Wakeman, D.V.M.
©2003 for BREEDERVET

http://www.littleriverlabs.com/neuter.htm
The Question Of Neutering and at what age
(Put together by Gregg Tonkin, Little River Labradors from postings by Pam Davol PHD and Chris Zink DVM, PhD, DACVP)

http://leerburg.com/pdf/neutering.pdf
Should You Neuter Your Dog?
Ed Frawley, Leerburg Kennels   * words are l e e r b u r g.com and L e e r b u r g Kennels

http://www.traciehotchner.com/dt/files/WillWeChangeOnEarlySpay-Neuter_Villalobos.pdf
The Bond and Beyond for VPN December 2008
by Alice Villalobos
Will We Change on Early Spay-Neuter?

http://www.showdogsupersite.com/kenlclub/breedvet/castrationindogs.html
ISSUES REGARDING CASTRATION IN DOGS
Mary C. Wakeman, D.V.M.
©2003 for BREEDERVET

http://www.petresource.com/Articles%20of%20Interest/new_views_on_neutering.htm
New Views On Neutering
By Ruth Marrion, DVM

http://www.acc-d.org/2006%20Symposium%20Docs/Session%20I.pdf
Non-reproductive Effects of Spaying and Neutering
Proceedings of the Third International Symposium on Non-Surgical
Contraceptive Methods for Pet Population Control * www.acc-d.org
SESSION OVERVIEW - Dr. John Verstegen

http://www.peptech.com/HTML/Animal_Health/Superlorin_general.html
A non-surgical method to suppress testosterone

http://prdupl02.ynet.co.il/ForumFiles_2/23999370.pdf
Pros and Cons of Neutering
E. Hardie
Department of Clinical Sciences, North Carolina State University, Raleigh, NC, USA.

http://www.doglistener.co.uk/neutering/rspca.shtml
RSPCA Admit to Spaying and Castrating Puppies AT SIX WEEKS OLD
Stan Rawlinson MTCBPT.MPAACT
Doglistener Behaviourist and Obedience Trainer

http://users.lavalink.com.au/theos/Spay-neuter.htm#vacc
Should I spay or should I no..?  -- pros and cons of Spay-neuter
Hungarian Vizsla Health Resource

http://www.doglistener.co.uk/neutering/spaying_neutering.shtml
Spaying and Castration (Neutering) Dogs and Cats A Stark Warning
Stan Rawlinson, a full time Dog Behaviourist and Obedience Trainer.

http://www.wholedognews.com/
Spay, Neuter, and Cancer: Revisiting and Old Trinity
Myrna Milani, BS, DVM

http://www.caninesports.com/SpayNeuter.html
Early Spay-Neuter Considerations for the Canine Athlete One Veterinarian's Opinion
© 2005 Chris Zink DVM, PhD, DACVP

http://www.columbusdogconnection.com/Documents/PedRebuttal%20.pdf
Rebuttal to "Early Spay-Neuter Considerations for the Canine Athlete"
Lisa M Howe, DVM, PhD, Dipl. ACVS Associate Professor, Small Animal Surgery Co-Chief
Surgical Sciences Sect Dept of Vet Small Animal Clinical Sci
College of Vet Med and Biom Sciences Texas A&M Univ College Station TX 77843

http://www.pluggd.tv/audio/channels/dog_talk_the_radio_show/episodes/4njnh
Dog Talk Show #96 Tracie Hotchner (10-18-2008)
Early spay/neuter may be harming our dogs! Hear Dr. Christine Zink, DVM, PhD, DAVCP on the physical benefits of delaying neutering and trainer Parvene Farhoody on how it can reduce aggression.

http://www.antrozoologisenteret.no/artikler/art_breed.pdf
Effects of breed, sex, and neuter status on trainability in dogs
James A. Serpell* and Yuying Hsu+

http://users.skynet.be/fa242124/a-english/castration-dogs.html
Gonadectomy and behavior
Dr Joël Dehasse

http://homepage.psy.utexas.edu/homepage/faculty/Gosling/reprints/AABS05DogPersonalityReview.pdf
Temperament and personality in dogs (Canis familiaris): A review and evaluation of past research
Amanda C. Jones *, Samuel D. Gosling

http://www.skeptvet.com/index.php?p=1_23_Benefits-Risks-of-Neutering
Evaluating the Benefits and Risks of Neutering
The SkeptVet -  the owner of this blog is not identified but the articles referenced are searchable.

http://www.petfinder.com/for-shelters/pediatric-spay-neuter.html
Pediatric Spay/Neuter
Dr. Lila Miller, ASPCA

http://k9harmony.co.uk/spaying-and-castration/
Spaying and Castration - What Your Vet and the Rescue Centres May Not Tell You
Pauline Waller, member #178 Professional Association of Applied Canine Trainers, - articles referenced and searchable

http://www.champdogsforum.co.uk/cgi-bin/board/topic_show.pl?pid=1123732;hl=castrate#pid1123732
To Castrate or Not? - Interesting discussion regarding a young male targeted by an aggressive older male.

http://www.cdoca.org/downloads/files/Early%20SN%20and%20Behavior.pdf
Non-reproductive Effects of Spaying and Neutering on Behavior in Dogs
Deborah L. Duffy, Ph.D., and James A. Serpell, Ph.D., Center for the Interaction of
Animals and Society, School of Veterinary Medicine, University of Pennsylvania

http://www.2ndchance.info/spayneuter.htm
At What Age Should I Spay or Neuter My Dog or Cat?
What Are The Advantages And Disadvantages Of Neutering My Pet?
Revisiting The Idea Of Early-Age Neutering
Ron Hines DVM PhD  10/05/09

http://saveourdogs.net/category/health/
Articles and links to Veterinary organizations opposing mandatory spay/neuter

http://askdryin.com/blog/tag/dog-behavior-arousal-aggression-spay-neuter/
Can Spaying Make Dog Behaviour Worse?
Sophia Yin, DVM, MS        March 5, 2009

http://www.associationofanimalbehaviorprofessionals.com/effects_of_neutering.html
The Effects of Spaying and Neutering on Canine Behaviour
James O'Heare, Based on section from Aggressive Behavior in Dogs, 2006,

Not on links yet from here down

http://www.petfriendlyworld.com/chatforum/showthread.php?t=23096
The Behavioural Effects of Canine Castration
Hazel Palmer, 1993  See post #8 in the chat forum at Pet Friendly World.

http://www.cdoca.org/downloads/files/Early%20SN%20and%20Behavior.pdf
Does Spaying and Neutering Reduce Aggression?
Dr. Polley DVM, 2001   American Dog Breeders Association

http://www.gpmcf.org/respectovaries.html
A Healthier Respect for Ovaries (in dogs)
David J. Waters, DVM, PhD, Diplomate ACVS
Director, Center for Exceptional Longevity Studies
Gerald P. Murphy Cancer Foundation

http://news.uns.purdue.edu/x/2009b/091201OvarianResearch.html
Message for women and dogs: keeping ovaries is linked to longevity
To the Purdue Research Park, http://www.purdueresearchpark.com
- By Lacy Date 11.01.11 17:55 UTC
Jetstone Jewel. Many thanks for all your links and taking the time.
- By Brainless [gb] Date 11.01.11 18:07 UTC
Wow the question sure got you thinking.
- By JeanSW Date 11.01.11 22:43 UTC

> has never humped anything other than his Poppa Bear


Awwwww!   Bless.   :-)
- By helenmd [gb] Date 12.01.11 20:05 UTC
What a great lot of links,Jetstone Jewel!
A very interesting discussion.
My assistant at work has a sprocker who's a year old now and every time she pops to the vet for flea treatment,wormers or whatever the vet/vet nurse/receptionist always tries to persuade her to have him castrated,the "high risk" of testicular cancer is given as a reason.
Her reasons for not having him done are that he is great as he is,he has no behaviour problems,he doesn't hump and is very well behaved off the lead,as someone else said,if it aint broke don't fix it.
He has a nice silky easy to care for coat at the moment and she's worried this would change with castration,she doesn't want to have to clip him(she's a groomer so understands about this).
He's also a rather greedy dog and she's worried if he's castrated he will end up in a state of permanent hunger which is not fair on him.
Entire dogs also look very different to castrated ones,don't they-virtually all the ones I know are slim and muscular whereas nearly all the neutered ones(that I know) are soft and flabby.
- By jacksgirl [gb] Date 12.01.11 20:57 UTC
If the risk of testicular cancer is a reason for having males castrated, I have a list as long as your arm of blokes that I would book in for it doing right now!  What a load of twaddle.  If they are monorchids/chryptorchids, they 'may' get cancer and now, if they have all their wedding vegetables, they may also get cancer.  Might as well have 'em all PTS at birth if you follow this thinking.
- By bestdogs Date 12.01.11 21:59 UTC
I wonder how many of these 'mad keen to neuter' vets would like to be 'done' to 'prevent' future health problems!!!  :)

Best wishes
- By lincolnimp [gb] Date 13.01.11 11:10 UTC

> "Clinically the arguments for neutering male dogs do not, in my opinion, stack up to much at all and
> may it actually be a negative action when looking at their long term health
." By vet Mark Elliot, taken form [url=http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:aHuYXd_BfRoJ:www.homeopathicvet.co.uk/pdf%2520files/Dog%2520neutering%2520with%2520links.pdf+neutering+cons&hl=en&gl=uk&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESi1tcLZNBEVEA8zAiFdp3pRLVr-jAVRb5-aEPYo0LnZnoeqFIb6N3-sEDBVrWPKaxoHK38kQGxkZ9_ictx4MhvKZ0gHhDG0RntaRf6KtKsEu21WXAU4_AP82dQma82U3sgBpymW&sig=AHIEtbQP60vgjjWBn_rGGOzjVzWkc9DaRg" rel=nofollow]here[/url]


What a sensible article :)
- By qwerty Date 13.01.11 12:29 UTC
My thoughts are that is it aint broke, dont fix it!

My lad is just 9 months old, the amount of people at my training club who stick their nose in is unbelievable, i usually get asked if he has been neutered and when i say no they look surprised and ask why..my response is that he is very much still a baby mentally and physically and that if anything he is a bit of a wimp and neutering would not help his confidence. Then i get the "it will stop him becoming dog aggressive" comments which wind me up no end. Then usually followed by the "but your bitch is entire" ...yes she is but i am perfectly capable of keeping them apart!

I think vets have alot to answer for on this subject...someone i know at training (same person i had above conversation with) got her dog neutered at just under 10 months(same breed as mine) he was already displaying slightly nervous aggression before being neutered and now- a good few months on, is getting worse.

She also made the comment "oh he's very small isnt he" about my dog...errr no, he is growing just nicely, unlike your dog who has shot up in height because you got him neutered before his growth plates had closed!

anyway- rant over! lol!
- By Crichton [ie] Date 13.01.11 12:50 UTC
I have 2 male flatcoats, 1 neutered and 1 entire.  The older one is neutered partly because he kept running off after bitches but mostly because he had prostate problems.  The poor boy is now overweight and no amount of 'dieting' will take it off and he gets humped by every other male around.

I would tell your vet that if they don't stop pressuring you, you will take your business elsewhere.
- By Nova Date 13.01.11 13:28 UTC
Unfortunately it is not always possible to control the weight by diet, the whole body shape changes (as it does in women) also common is feminisation although fortunately prostate cancer is uncommon although more likely in the neutered than the intact. 
- By qwerty Date 13.01.11 13:48 UTC
I think somebody else said somewhere that neutered males tend to be more flabby- even if they arent overweight, than entire males who tend to be more toned and muscular.

My GSD bitch was spayed as she suffered through each season and since she was done her coat is not the same and she doesnt look as 'fit' as she used to- even though she has the same exercise.
- By Tarn [gb] Date 13.01.11 18:57 UTC
I have 2 male FCR's, one who is nearly 3 and is neutered, the entire one is 2 next month. The older one was, in hindsight, neutered too early, he is genetically loopy anyway (we know 2 of his brothers and they're all mad!) but is very insecure, excitable and quite nervy, and I do regret having him done, would love to see how he would have turned out with all his male hormones intact.

The younger one has always been very calm and laid back, he shows no interest in bitches (or dogs - the neutered one is always humping the entire one!) and I have no intention of having him done unless it becomes necessary for medical reasons.

So if it's a calming measure, I would definitely say no - my entire one has been calm from day one, the neutered one is barmy!
- By Harley Date 13.01.11 21:04 UTC

> I think somebody else said somewhere that neutered males tend to be more flabby- even if they arent overweight, than entire males who tend to be more toned and muscular


I think it depends on the individual dog somewhat. Our GR was neutered at the very early age of 6 months - no choice in that decision as he was a rescue and we had no option other than to comply with their rules. He is very toned and muscular and competes in agility. I know three other GRs who also compete and all of them are lean and muscular so would assume that lifestyle also plays a big part in their overall condition.
- By Heidi2006 Date 13.01.11 23:24 UTC
Harley
I would absolutely agree with you in that lifestyle dictates weight and muscular tone.  However,  for male and female of any species, it is more difficult to maintain optimum weight when neutered.  Therefore lifestyle must adapt to the change in hormone levels.

OP  Do read thoroughly the great links given above re pros and cons of neutering.
Over 40 years I have had males and females whoa are/have been neutered at different ages/stages.  My personal opinion, regardless of gender, is that they need to mature according to breed/type beforehand.  I would advise that you investigate this further [as above].
- By tadog [gb] Date 14.01.11 10:41 UTC
to neuter or not to neuter the BIG question.

I always say it depends on why you want to neuter. in your case unless I have read you wrong it is to calm him down. You have a F/C, presumibly you got him becuase you love the breed? what your dog has is personality.  I have had F/C since 1981, only bitches at moment but prior to this it was always males. Perhaps it is the management of your dog that needs to change, taking him to good training classes may help you. but I think there isnt anything wrong with a dog having personality so long as he is trained, ie. manner not to jump at people, to behave well when around people dogs and kids. this is taught, it isnt something that comes unless you get lucky. I always remember me apologising to a gent when my 'personality plus' male ran up to say hello to him. the gent said 'if one were to have a fault what a wonderful fault to have. being happy is beatiful!'
If you do decide to get him neutered, the weight 'thing' shouldnt be a problem if you adjust his feed, give proper excersise, and if you think he is getting overweight then adjust his food. no dog needs to be overweight just because he is neutered. again its a managment thing, we offer the food its eaten, our fault if they get overweight.
- By Nikita [ir] Date 15.01.11 16:03 UTC

> My lad is just 9 months old, the amount of people at my training club who stick their nose in is unbelievable, i usually get asked if he has been neutered and when i say no they look surprised and ask why..my response is that he is very much still a baby mentally and physically and that if anything he is a bit of a wimp and neutering would not help his confidence. Then i get the "it will stop him becoming dog aggressive" comments which wind me up no end. Then usually followed by the "but your bitch is entire" ...yes she is but i am perfectly capable of keeping them apart!


If it helps any, tell them that a behaviourist has told you that they have seen many cases where neutering has either made an existing aggression issue worse, or has created one, because the testosterone was giving the dog confidence (or at the very least, helping him cope). 

The behaviourist is me, and I have seen this happen - I work almost exclusively with aggressive dogs (mainly to other dogs but to people as well).
- By tadog [gb] Date 15.01.11 16:56 UTC
Its a pity some of the 'leading' breeders of the uk dont set an example, by that I mean assistance dogs (some off) one that I was conected with had the 'bits off as soon as they could. the other I am pleased to say didnt. leave to each of you to work out the leading breeder bit.
Topic Dog Boards / General / To have or not to have my 2yr neutered?

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