I need help, whenever my puppy poops she discharges drops of light blood, this happened after I changed her food from wet food to dry food-I had to change as was not able to find the brand I was feeding her anymore-
I took her to vet he gave her pro-
Kolin+  but it hasn't stopped yet. Her stool is soft and watery with traces of blood in it.
She eats 4 times a day and sleeps a lot.
Anyone knows what's wrong with my puppy?

Is this a puppy you bred yourself and have the mother of, or bought from somebody else? The reason for asking is that for a toybreed like this, 7 weeks is far too young to be away from the mother yet. Did you change the food over gradually? If you switch from one brand to another you have to do it in stages, start by mixing some of the new food in with the old, then increasing the amounts of the new food over at least a week, otherwise you will get stomach upsets like this.

Your poor puppy is bound to have digestive upsets.  Didn't the breeder explain that you musn't mess about changing the food, and causing problems?  I have to admit that people have to agree to keep puppy on the same food for at least a month before I will even consider them for a pup.

Why have you got a toy breed this early?  Because a reputable breeder wouldn't be letting a toy go at this age.

Are you feeding proper puppy food?  As to sleeping a lot, she would normally be doing this with her siblings at such a young age.

What advice is her breeder givimg you?

Sorry I meant 9 weeks old. I got her from a breeder last week when she was only 8 weeks when I bought her, she was on butcher's choice puppy meal. I took her to vet for check up then she gave me science puppy food. I mixed the two and started feeding her. Unfortunately was not able to find butcher's choice puppy meal anymore. So just gave her the othr food that the problem started 3 days ago. Took her to vet he gave her this pro-kolin. But still she has blood in her stool. I am taking her to vet tomorrow for her second vaccine. I don't know whatelse to do:(

Where I live - small Welsh town, Butcher's choice puppy food is sold in Tesco, Morrisons, ADSA, Pets at HOME and the local pet shops

I use a little Bio Yoghurt (about a teaspoon) on a pup's meal if they are a bit loose.  My breed seem to love chewing/eating plants and shrubs which can cause them to be a little loose ;)

Really prefer to keep pups on the food they're used to until at least 12/16 weeks and send them off with a month's supply at 8 weeks to make sure owners get time to locate a supply ;)

I'd try to look for the food again -like Dill says it is common. Doesn't sound like the current food is suiting the pup at all.

Normally tiny breeds aren't sold until 12-14 weeks weeks of age, I certainly would not let mine go before 14 weeks.

Agree with the others that Butcher's choice puppy is readily available.  However, when I asked my dog sitter to get some, he said he couldn't get any! 

Do please ASK at whatever shop you use.  For sure, I can say that both Asda and Sainsburys have it in a different area to the adult dog food!  Oh, and PAH is loads dearer than any of the supermarkets!

Is that all the breeder was feeding her?  7 or 9 weeks is rather young for a toy breed to leave their breeders home.  As others have said this food is freely available where I live, not something I give my dogs though.

Shame on the vet for making the OP change the food of such a young puppy! :-( I agree to change back if you can.

>I'd try to look for the food again -like Dill says it is common. Doesn't sound like the current food is suiting the pup at all.

Thank you all for your advice, this morning after reading your suggestion to switch back to old food, early in the morning I went to Asda store rather far from where I live and found the food.
I was lucky to find the brand cause during the last three days I had checked 3 large sainsbury branches, 2 waitroses branches and a Tesco branch as well as three pershops around the area I live-Putney- and none of them had the puppy food I needed.
I was silly to listen to the vet who said it is ok to change her food now from now on I listen to you guys. Many many thanks:)
She'sback to her old food:) keep monitoring her for any change.
I am a desperate mummy she is my first puppy and I love her to death, once again thanks for your advice

You might also find it on the internet if the local stores don't have it - I get my James Wellbeloved online sometimes if I can't be bothered to trek into the big towns near us.

I think it is great for the breeder of a toy breed to have let a puppy go at 8 wks, well within the socialisation window.  Waiting till 12-14 wks would be outside the socialisation window - at least, it begins to close at 12 wks.  Perhaps an incredibly attentive breeder could adequately socialise the small litters which many toy breeds have, but it would be difficult.  They are small in size but they grow psychologically at the same rate and need the same socialisation stimuli as larger breeds. 

OP - Your vet probably won't give your pup the 2nd jab if she seems to be ill or possibly has a bacterial infection.  Instead he might give her some ABs.  It could be that you changed the food too rapidly, but it could also be a whole host of other things too, so don't just assume it is the food.

As a breeder of a toy breed I never let my pups go before 12 weeks.

In fact in the last litter I had, two left at 12 weeks and two stayed until 14weeks and from the reports from their new owners ( who all have had many pups over the years)...they have never has such well rounded and sociable little 'people'. But then those pups have parents with the ideal temperament (a more reliable indicator I feel).
In the litters reared by dedicated, experience breeders, keeping puppies until they feel the individuals are ready to leave, has IMO, the most successful outcome.

I'm sure it's true that dedicated and committed breeders with small litters, who have time to give to each individual puppy - who take each puppy out and about on daily socialisation trips from the age of 8 wks + (as in a new home) - end up with well-socialised puppies.  Unfortunately many breeders of toy breeds either believe they are providing adequate socialisation - when they're not - or just don't bother with it. 

Although it might work out for some committed breeders, the advice to routinely keep a puppy of any breed with a breeder until 12wks, goes against every piece of research into canine socialisation periods.  They may look physically less mature but they develop psychologically at same rate as any other breed and have the same socialisation period.  Which starts to _close_ at 12 wks.  I wouldn't prejudge the breeder of the OP's puppy as being irresponsible because they allowed the pup to go at such a young age - in fact, quite the opposite.  If a breeder is unable to provide such a diverse range of experiences for a pup, they are best allowing it to go to someone who can - the new owner.

Source:  I'm an APDT reg trainer, with a baby-puppy socialisation class - currently running with several toy breeds between the ages of 9-11 wks.  I have also witnessed the usual results of toy breeds not leaving a breeder until 12 wks of age:  Owners often then take a further 2 weeks for themselves and the pup to 'settle in' together, then they start to try to find a training/socialisation class - which takes a further 2 weeks or more - by the time these pups get to a class, they are most often around 15 wks old +.  They are then often scared of new experiences and often showing signs of fear aggression.  I do think toy breeds need careful treatment as they are so small, but careful treatment can be provided by new owners as well as breeders.

They may look physically less mature but they develop psychologically at same rate as any other breed and have the same socialisation period.  Which starts to _close_ at 12 wks.

That's true enough, but until you have REARED a litter of toy pups you will never realise just HOW different they are. They eat solids later, they explore later, they suckle their mum for longer, the bitch looks after them in a different way and for much longer, they do everything later than larger breeds. It's like having a different species. When I had my first toy litter after years of large breeds only I realised the toys are more comparable to cats as they truly are much slower to mature and need their mother for longer. There was no way on earth I could have let any go before 14 weeks.

I once bought a toy puppy aged 7 weeks, before I knew better. He's pretty well trained, got his Good Citizen Gold, but he is far LESS well adjusted a dog than those toys I've had at 14 weeks. The only dog I've had that gets spooked even easier, is one I got at 8 months. Far too late. The one I got at 6 months is fantastic because his breeder did socialise him.

In short -just because a breeder is lazy and does not take pups out to socialise before they are sold (which shouldn't be hard with a litter of 3 or 4 at most, of breeds easy to carry) does not excuse selling pups at 7 weeks. Far better then to find a breeder that DOES do all they should. My pups will have been out and about for walks, on leads, off lead, before going to their new homes. My large pups however leave at 7 ½ weeks and any later for THEM would not be such a good idea.

> Source I'm an APDT reg trainer, with a baby-puppy socialisation class - currently running with several toy breeds between the ages of 9-11 wks

As a fellow trainer for nearly 30 years I am strongly of the belief that the most fully expressed inherited trait is temperament.

Mariannes comments are so true and the very reason why this 'one size fits all' theory is seriously flawed.

In my experience of running puppy classes I found more of a pattern of where the pups came from - than what age they left home.

Having with friends imported a dog at 9 weeks, who came out of Quarantine at 9 months I have to agree.

Despite lack of socialisation outside what my visits and kennel staff provide he was emotionally and temperamentally able to cope with  busy show environment only 3 days later.

I have also sent two pups to Australia where they have to spend a Month in quarantine.

both have been super outgoing girls from the moment they left Quarantine, at 19 weeks or so.

I did of course socialise extensively before they left me at 14 1/2 and 13 weeks, in the same way any puppy I keep myself.

> I think it is great for the breeder of a toy breed to have let a puppy go at 8 wks,

I'm afraid that my breed club would be horrified!  They recommend 12 weeks.  And I have to agree with Marianne about the difference in toy mums.  My girls will often suckle on the day that pup leaves home.

My summer litter went away on holiday with me, were introduced to the world and his wife, and by the time they left home, were totally familiar with playing in the compost heap with my Collies.

I am proud that my vet is always telling people about how well socialised my pups are.

So the answer is, as always, to buy from a breeder who knows their breed and what they're doing?? :) :)

We're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.  The application forms for class request that owners write down either their breeder's name or affix (if they have one).  Many of these toy breeds I see are coming from 'reputable' breeders, not the back of a newspaper.  The single discriminating feature which determines their behaviour at class with other dogs is how old they are when they come to class and their previous life experiences (or lack of them) - not what breeder they have come from. 

Brainless, if you socialised extensively before your pups went into quarantine and they were 13-14 wks then - you would have done all the good work pretty much.  The window closes rapidly from 12 wks on.

Research shows that, unfortunately, temperament and coming from a 'good' breeder actually makes no difference if inadequate socialisation is provided:  This has been proven with different litters from repeat matings under research conditions, with pups exposed to either no socialisation - or adequately socialised.  The studies have been carried out with pups at various ages too, which is how we know at what age the window starts to close.  I will find the study...

I'm unsure of the reasoning behind breeders who keep back pups of toy breeds this late... What are they providing which they don't believe that a committed and vetted new owner can provide?  Anyway, we will just have to agree to disagree.

You forgot the 9 months old that spent 6 months in UK quarantine where he had been from 9 weeks of age. 

His breeder lived in the country so his socialisation at that point had only been in the litter.

> What are they providing which they don't believe that a committed and vetted new owner can provide? 

A lot more experience and knowledge of rearing puppies, so fewer mistakes are made, and of course they usually have more canine socialisation with the breeders other dogs.

A puppy or adult for that matter at any age from a breeder that does the right thing with them for their age will be well adjusted

Many of these toy breeds I see are coming from 'reputable' breeders, not the back of a newspaper.

And do you know HOW they treat their pups? Plenty of well known toy breeders -sadly- keep their dogs caged more or less 24/7 with no socialisation at all. They can do all the health tests, breed from all the best dogs, produce great looking healthy dogs, but if they cage them and do nothing with them, obviously the pups aren't going to be great. That has nothing to do with the age when sold -as we've all just explained.

> I'm unsure of the reasoning behind breeders who keep back pups of toy breeds this late...

OR you could perhaps see that those of us who have observed this for over 30 years, may have a more valid view point than the statistics
( taken from the whole gambit of dog breeds I believe) may suggest.

Where as I do accept that many breeds ( and I have bred other non-toys) need to get out into their new home at around 7-8 weeks, In my experience and that of many others, learned from generations of their dogs, I dissagree with this generalised study as a one size fits all theorem.

> What are they providing which they don't believe that a committed and vetted new owner can provide?

Experience, good judgement gained from owning generations of the pups family and understanding how they progressed ......and a fully vaccinated/microchipped independant little soul, who In my opinion is at its best stage to thrive...... and the new owners seem to agree.

I could give the average age at which my puppies best thrive independantly as around 8 weeks ...if taken as an average of all the boxer pups added to the Cavaliers....but it would not be an accurate reflection of the actual situation.
A generalised study can only say something is generally the norm....

I'm sure you are all very reputable and responsible breeders who do the best you can by your pups and who manage to produce healthy pups at the end of it.  I'm sure you can all quote me examples of dogs which have received inadequate socialisation, but gone on to be fine.  Or dogs you have bred which were subject to leaving at 12 wks and are fine.  It is easy for people to throw out examples like this - but research has proven (extensively) that socialisation periods in dogs remain the same, whatever the breed.  That just isn't up for debate - it's not about research generalising from all dog breeds - if toys had a radically different socialisation period to other dogs, we'd know about it because of the amount of research which has gone into socialisation periods. 

The argument about breed clubs supporting 12 wks isn't an indication of the way things should be, necessarily.  We can all recall many, many things which breed clubs have either allowed, encouraged or fostered which, today, are now considered outdated and have since been revised.  Docking, for example, was championed by many breed clubs - and now is considered cruel by many reputable breeders.  I don't doubt that at some point in the future 'no docking' will enter breed clubs' ethics.  Fashions change.  Time moves on.  Just because a breed club is saying it should be so, doesn't mean it is factually right.

Neither is the argument of "this is how it has been for X years" a good one, given other things in the world which have been a certain way for years.  How long did slavery exist in the US?  Just because something has been a certain way and there is a group of people in power who believe it should continue, again doesn't mean that it is right.

Lots else here is up for debate - like what a good breeder can provide by way of socialisation of a litter, whether that breeder has a range of other dogs available for socialisation (rather than just others of the same breed); dogs of different ages; dogs with squashed noses like boxers and bulldogs; large dogs; loose-skinned dogs like shar peis and so on and so forth.  Like I said above, I'm sure it is possible for a well-motivated breeder to adequately socialise a litter, especially as toys tend to have smaller litters and so it is easier to spend one-to-one time with each pup providing socialisation each day.  However, you'd have to be a good breeder to do this, and sadly, as Marianne says here, many breeders aren't.  To have a blanket "12 wks for all toys" rule is not giving those pups whose breeders do not adequately socialise much of a chance.  A pup taken from a poor situation at 8 wks is much more likely to recover and become the dog it could be, than a pup taken from that situation at 12 wks. 

I'm sure I won't convince anyone here of what I'm saying.  But perhaps someone else might come across this thread and it might give them some food for thought.

I did not mean to take this thread off on a tangent and hope that Lale's puppy is well soon and she gets some answers from her vet.

I have a toy breed that I would never let go before 10 weeks so much can happen to them even health wise, I would never take the risk,  My gundog  breed on the other hand the best time for them to go to their new homes is at 7 weeks.  I've had the toybreed all of my life nearly and the gundog breed for 18 years,

10 wks is a huge lot better than 12 wks.  In fact, if you also gave your toy breed 1st jab at 8 wks and 2nd at 10 wks, they could immediately be out everywhere and socialising when they went to their new homes.  Leaving at 12 wks, even with both jabs, they have lost those 2 weeks.  (If the breeder is a less ideal breeder than most people on here are.)

>if you also gave your toy breed 1st jab at 8 wks and 2nd at 10 wks, they could immediately be out everywhere and socialising when they went to their new homes.

They'd still have to wait till 12 weeks before they went out on the ground, of course.

I wdn't  vaccinate a toy breed at 8 weeks, lost to many after vaccinations (two of which died at the veterinary surgery), another reason why 10 weeks would be the earliest that they could go and then the new owner would be doing vaccines as I would never vaccinate a toy breed before then.  My gundog breed I do vaccinate at 8 weeks.

>They'd still have to wait till 12 weeks before they went out on the ground, of course.

Mine are out and about immediately 1 week following first jab, before 2nd jab has even happened.

I prioritise socialisation above all else.

We've recently treated (and lost 1) several poorly puppies whose owners did that. They can be excellently socialised without being put on the ground - especially toy breeds.

I don't let my large toy breed go until 10 weeks. They do go out and about a limited amount after the 1st jab at 8 weeks, but not anywhere where uninoculated dogs would go. One of my puppies went to America where he is constantly talked about as the most outgoing and friendly dog of his breed (which is known for being a friendly breed) anyone has ever met. The other one went to people in Sussex who didn't take him to much in the way of training, but he's still perfectly friendly and happy to meet people and dogs. I agree that having parents of good temperament is terribly important as well as socialising.

>I prioritise socialisation above all else.

I do too, and we get out and about quite quickly after the pup has come home.  We meet lots of people of all ages and get the pup used to the sights and sounds of the outside world BUT the pup does not go on the ground until after the required time has elapsed.  As he very quickly got too heavy to carry far, my latest pup had several trips being wheeled around our garden centre (and watching the traffic) in a bone shaker shopping trolley!  In fact when his adult teeth are due in I might take him back to shake the puppy ones out :)

Good socialisation is vital but I see no need to risk exposure to serious illness when much can be achieved in arms, from park benches, with known (and approved) vaccinated dogs, and on clean ground.  For anyone reading this thread do take the advice of your vet and your breeder and do not allow your dog on the ground in high dog traffic areas or public spaces where you cannot control contact.

Most good training classes will allow puppies after their first vaccination and as long as they are carried to and from the car park it's a great place for early, managed, dog socialisation. 

Sorry guys, I didn't make myself clear - when I said 'out and about', I didn't mean down on the ground everywhere. 

I meant carried when in places where other dogs might have toileted and only put down when in places where other dogs are highly unlikely to have been. 

They are out and about everywhere from 2nd jab onwards though - I don't wait a further 2 weeks.