She is stunning and an excellent Mum but her first litter last time after scan showed 9 pups produced 14  (one took 20 mins to get going but all survived and were big, strong and healthy). She returned to peak condition very easily and quickly and my vet was impressed. Well the scan this time has also shown 9 pups but she is already so much bigger that the same gestation last time!!!!!  I think we are in for another stupidly big litter!!! Not really a ranting/advice sort of post... just pondering to myself that such huge litters are not a good idea.

Must admit I don't think I could deal with breeding from breeds that generally have litters of 9 plus. 

Just about deal with my usual 4 - 7.  I think two litters when producing large litters like that is plenty, which is why number of litters really is breed and situation specific.

I think you're right - 2 big litters is enough for any bitch I would think. Well done for thinking of your girl!

My girl is due in 2 days time.  The last litter(her first) she had 5 lovely big healthy pups but this time, she is massive.  I am terrified.  I loved having a neat, small litter and I have no idea how I am going to cope with more than that but last night she was lying on the sofa on her back and it was like a scene out of Alien.  I felt at least four puppies all wriggling at different places.  Lovely but scary.  And my poor girl is so fed up now.  She can't eat much and can't get comfy and she tries to play in the snow but she is just so heavy and tired.  After this litter I am definately getting her spayed!!

If you get another 14 then a total of 28 pups is a phenomonal responsibilty to send out into the genepool and wider community.

It equates to one of my bitches having between 10 and 14 litters.
Even in my other breed,Boxers - I know that I could not have found good homes for 28 pups in two years....I class 'good' in the long term..ie not getting any back over their lifetime (say 14 years) - none getting into the hands of puppy farmers or BYB and not finding they have bred from them without health testing and behind my back (disregarding my endorsments).

Much has been said here and elsewhere about governments introducing breeding limits for bitches either by numbers of litters or numbers of pups. I know some folk were up in arms about a limit of 10 live pups produced in a lifetime, because they had big litters, but if viewed from the point of view of the impact it makes in the country ( in a vast range of ways) then is some merit as I see it.

Controversial for sure but something to ponder.

tooolz... That's exactly what I've been thinking. I haven't had to take any pups back from my previous litter, (but never say never), however I have already helped a pup from my boy by somebody else's bitch when the owners of the bitch said they couldn't help. I just think that so many pups out there in the world are a huge responsibilty and especially in this day and age (and economic climate) there is a chance I may end up with a house crammed to bursting with dogs. Obviously we all do the checks needed but not one of us is 100% sure that their pups owners circumstances will not change and we may end up with "that" phonecall.

I don't know how much it varies from breed to breed, but in my breed pups are just not selling at the moment. I've mentioned before I lost 11 of my waiting buyers. At the moment it looks like I will have to keep 4 pups, another breeder has 5 unsold, another 2 unsold, another 4 -all of theirs older than mine.  Some of the back yard breeders are virtually giving theirs away for nothing -I heard of some sold for £50 today. I am very, very unsure if I am ever going to dare breed a litter again unless it is of my toybreed which has small litters. Not looking forward to training and socialising four puppies.

Fingers crossed it won't be 14 pups -second pregnancies usually LOOKS bigger even when there are less pups.

> Obviously we all do the checks needed but not one of us is 100% sure that their pups owners circumstances will not change and we may end up with "that" phonecall.

And "that" phone call can come at any time thoughout the pups life.

Some years ago,I did a mating which produced 8 pups, 4 bitches and 4 dogs.

All went to people I knew well and lived happy healthy lives until within the space of 12 months 2 of the males at 5 years old started showing symptoms of a 'new' and hitherto relatively rare condition called Boxer Cardio Myopathy a late onset condition ( a fact not known at the time).

Unfortunately both sets of owners went through months of distress and loads of money to diagnose this problem and both had to be PTS. I went through this with both families every step of the way and was shattered by it. Knocked the stuffing out of me and the worry that the others would suffer too was crushing.... and this went on for years waiting and wondering. At the time their was no genetic marker so all I could do was wait and see.
Fortunately the others lived into old age but not before one of the bitches had been bred from ( at 3 years) long before the problems started.

The mother only had one litter but if she'd had 28 pups I would have been a basket case.