I have read all the posts warning of too much excercise but how do you stop them. My 16 week old pup loves to run and jump she will play in the field near the ponies for hours if you let her I did crate her to make her rest while we were fencing at the weekend but she was dodging about and running from one to the other all the time she was free. She loves her walks in the park next door running about for her stautory 15 mins a day but if you limit that she chases round and round the house leaping on and off the furniture and belting about for ages. So how do you curtial her energy She is never forced to walk or go out but does it all under her own steam. even if you stand still she races around everywhere

It's forced exercise on a lead that you restrict, not where there is free choice. Although obviously you don't walk for miles with pup off lead so it has to follow because it doesn't want to lose you.

We were in the field with the ponies for six hours surely that would have been too much. She doesnt stop for a second and is rarely on a lead we are very lucky in that. I did have her in the car for a while for a sleep but she didnt want to be there

> It's forced exercise on a lead that you restrict, not where there is free choice.

Is that right? Our pup was relentless would run around for hours if we had let him, he never tired or gave up. I used to restrict him in his cage otherwise he just didn't stop!

I do restrict being out and about for long periods of time.  On days when we are doing work outside I still give the puppy 'down time' in a crate, in the car, back inside, or just snoozing on my daughters lap wrapped in a blanket!  I know when he needs a kip and although he'd keep going til he dropped it isn't wise to let him - apart from anything else he gets clumsy when he's overtired and it's then that he might damage himself.

The pinging about indoors is normal and in my case happens just before he needs to sleep - it's the hoolies!  I gradually move him into ever decreasing spaces til he flings himself back in his crate to chew something.  Less than 5 minutes later he's giving it Zzzzzz's

A short training session before your pup gets overtired and silly will also help her to wind down.  Get her to do some thinking and she'll probably rest more easily. :)

I have read all the posts warning of too much excercise but how do you stop them. My 16 week old pup loves to run and jump she will play in the field near the ponies for hours if you let her I did crate her to make her rest while we were fencing at the weekend but she was dodging about and running from one to the other all the time she was free. She loves her walks in the park next door running about for her stautory 15 mins a day but if you limit that she chases round and round the house leaping on and off the furniture and belting about for ages. So how do you curtial her energy She is never forced to walk or go out but does it all under her own steam. even if you stand still she races around everywhere

You need to nip this in the bud as soon as possible. Six hours free running for a 16 week old Lab is not advisable at all.

You also need to make sure she is calm in the house and stop her jumping on and off the furniture as she is likley to injure herself and if you alow it now it will be harder when she is older to learn the manners of what is acceptable behaviour in the house.

I suggest you start to do more formal training with her to stimulate her mind as that will help tire her out rather than let her run so freely for such long lengths of time.

What are you feeding her as well as this may have a direct reason to her high energy levels. Is she from working lines as well just out of interest ?

I agree, puppies, like young children, must have activities restricted. If your dog has this much energy it would be much more beneficial to have her mind exercised rather than her body. A dog of this breed or similar at this age should NEVER be having this much exercise.

She has puppy food three times a day now 7am 2pm and 9pm she cant go longer than that without food she gets hungry. She would eat until she was sick so increasing the volume is not an option. She looks very well is not particularly fat and is a very happy pup in the main. She is from working stock and came from health tested stock. She is fully vaccinated microchipped and vet checked. She is a fairly fussy eater though and will only eat certain brands of puppy food the ones with the moist chunks in. She  has lots of rest but I dont particularly like crating her during the day. She is very well trained for her age she walks well on a lead is able to sit and down is happy to come and will retrieve but again only on limited ocasions as she would again run around for hours after her dummy. She is a bright and happy girl. so how do you stop the mad half hours of racing round and round the furniture gets in the way as the house is small hence leaping on and off. She is wonderful and has been housetrained since 9 weeks old. She cries to go out even when in the crate

I would firstly consider changing her from a varied type of diet as you have mentioned to one particular type and stick with it.I would also consider chaging her over to a junior food rather than feed her puppy food.I would also just add caution to thinking that a Lab is hungry as inheritantly Labs are in the main always showing signs of being hungry so try not to be lead by what they are outwardly showing ! How much are you feeding her per meal as well ?

As for 'zoomies' I would try and make sure she is stopped doing this in doors and leave the zoomies to outside only and then under supervision so she doesn't injure herself my jumping off things !

Being from working stock you will find she will be much more highly driven and so it is key to channel that drive onto training sessions which will stimulate her mind and so channel some of the excess energy.

Have you thought about doing some more formal type of training with her ? If you need a good book to start you off then I can recommend 'A simple Approach to Gundog Training' by John Weller. It is a very good book for the novice trainer and give very clear and simple steps to start to help train your dog. It is not specifically aimed and just people who want to use their dogs for Gundogs but is also very useful for all dog owners as well. John is a very experienced man who is very well respected in this area.

She has the equivalent volume of a medium can of dried puppyfood three times a day. She has the odd can of sardines instead I would like to feed raw but it is not readily available and the house is tiny so no more freezer room. so a catfood tin size meal.She wont eat any old puppy food only the ones with moist bits in. She has been tried on RC, Burgess Premium, Eukanuba Hills and Iams but she will only readily eat the cheap supermarket dried puppyfood with moist chunks

> She cries to go out even when in the crate

Just because she cries doesnt mean you have to give in to her. My pup didnt like going in the crate to begin with, but he soon got used to it and i didnt give in or let him out becuase i knew i was doing the right thing by using the crate where he was perfectly safe and comfortable. He soon learnt when it was time to go and 'chill' in the crate for a bit and did so without a fuss.

> so how do you stop the mad half hours of racing round and round the furniture gets in the way as the house is small hence leaping on and off

When your pup starts doing this you need to nip it in the bud by firmly saying 'NO' and/or putting her in another room and has calmed down. She will soon learn. Its not good as a pup to behave like that and (depending on breed) even worse when they are an adult - can you imagine a large breed dog that thinks its ok to launch itself off furniture?? :-)
Dont feel bad for disciplining your pup.

As others have said, diet may also have something to do with energy levels so you may want to look into that.

>she will only readily eat the cheap supermarket dried puppyfood with moist chunks

I bet the pieces are coloured as well as coated in sugar syrup to make them moist, aren't they? Colours and sugar in the diet affect some dogs the way they do some children, making them hyperactive.

Gradually (take a couple of weeks doing it, by swapping a quarter of her current food for some of the new one for a few days, then make it half-and-half for a few more days, then three-quarters the new one and a quarter the old one, then drop the old one) changing her food over to a good-quality uncoloured brand, and you might well see an improvement.

At the same time she'll need to learn the settle on her own for short periods; not necessarily in her crate, because that should never be seen as a prison - a large pen or a safe utility room with a baby-gate at the door will do fine. A stuffed kong will help stop her getting bored.

Six hours of running around in a field while you are fencing for horses is not what exercise of a young pup is about.

Dogs and Pups are learning all the time.  Everything they are exposed to teaches them something.  So, you have to ask yourself in every situation, in every circumstance - 'what is my puppy/dog learning from this?' 

If your pup is running around senselessly for 6 hours it is probably learning how to be an excitable, hard to control adult dog whose breed specific and natural canine instincts become unmanagable and very little else.

Any exercise should be supervised by you.  Any exercise should be constructive.  No exercise should be excessive.  Lead walks should be limited to 5 minutes for every month of your pups age and this is expecially important for large breeds as their growth plates, joits and bones can be damaged by too much exercise too soon.

Yes, a pup will run around in the house and find 'toys' to play with not those we necessarily think are 'toys'.   Your pup needs structured mental and physical exercise.  Some basic training and even some cute trick training will soon tire out a young pup. 

Mine went to training sessions at 14 weeks and although the class was 1 hour they were group classes so individual time for each pup was a lot less.  Mine were shattered after some structured mental and physical work and slept for hours afterwards.

If a pup is to become a postive addition to a family it needs us to teach it how to behave.   If I were you I would curtail free 'exercise' and carefully monitor any exercise it does have so that your pup develops both physically and mentally into a well adjusted, positive addition to your family.

If your worried about over exercising her I would look at doing some games with her that involve her tracking food and searching it out, this will combine eating and exercising and should satisfy her very well.

Adam

I am well aware that running around while we work is not suitable for a puppy she is probably the best and most obedient puppy on the planet. She has a few wibbles but I dont want an automaton she is walked on the lead and free for her five minutes per month of her age every day She then has so much energy at home she could either do with another walk or several more walks  in a day. She will be weaned onto junior uncoloured food. She just likes to run. She only cries in her crate if she needs to wee or poo will settle happily if we go out and at 16 weeks old I am sure there are a lot worse than her after all I was advised by a dog expert that she couldnt possibly be reliably house trained until 6 months of age which is evidently nonsense she has been since she was 9 weeks old earlier than that from her point of view we just missed the cue and she had a couple of accidents. I will restrain her from jumping about purely because I fear she will injure herself or indavertantly jump up at someone which she is not allowed to do. nor is she allowed to be bargy or to bark unneccesarily. She is a very good puppy but she is a puppy and her energy has to be diverted somewhere. I will sort her out some different food and see if I can get her to eat it but having had a food refusing  neurotic golden retriever  before her I would prefer her to be a little easier to deal with. The Goldie suffered very badly from hyperacuity which in the end cost her her life. This one is a bold energtic and happy easy to live with girl I hope this will continue to be the case for many years to come

As to what she learned while she was out with us in the field she learned not to run off, to come everytime she was called, to sit and stay when told, to stay close by so walk to heel off a lead and to stay happily at rest in the car while we worked She could not have been left at home for that length of time and the job had to be done so again it is perhaps a little unreasonable to imply she was overstimulated and coming to any harm I mostly wanted to know how to curtail the mad whizzing about but it seems crating her is the only option

She starts puppy training next week

> I mostly wanted to know how to curtail the mad whizzing about but it seems crating her is the only option

No - there are other choices, not least of which is to move her into ever decreasing spaces and safe areas.  However, the best thing you can do is not let it get to that stage.  The 'mad whizzing about' as you describe it is not caused by lack of exercise.  Indeed, it's often a sign of overtiredness and with most puppies happens at particular times of day.  The trick is to anticipate it and take steps to avoid it by doing some training with her beforehand to get her using her brain (thinking is really good to help them sleep) then directing any frenzied behaviour towards playtime shaped by you and with appropriate toys.

It's still difficult I know, as mine will take the most innocuous toys and do mad things with them - he has a small bucket he likes to wear - but it is possible to bring them under some semblance of control during the puppy madness.  Chewing often helps too, and is quite calming, so try a stuffed kong or a fish stick maybe. 

Thank you I do give her a stuffed bone stuffed with the chicken puppy stuff done by Kong we cant use kongs as we are a latex free household due to allergies people not dogs

I have read all the posts warning of too much excercise but how do you stop them. My 16 week old pup loves to run and jump she will play in the field near the ponies for hours if you let her I did crate her to make her rest while we were fencing at the weekend but she was dodging about and running from one to the other all the time she was free.

She loves her walks in the park next door running about for her stautory 15 mins a day but if you limit that she chases round and round the house leaping on and off the furniture and belting about for ages. So how do you curtial her energy She is never forced to walk or go out but does it all under her own steam. even if you stand still she races around everywhere

As to what she learned while she was out with us in the field she learned not to run off, to come everytime she was called, to sit and stay when told, to stay close by so walk to heel off a lead and to stay happily at rest in the car while we worked

That's not what you said in your OP as above.

She could not have been left at home for that length of time and the job had to be done so again it is perhaps a little unreasonable to imply she was overstimulated and coming to any harm I mostly wanted to know how to curtail the mad whizzing about but it seems crating her is the only option

Like I said, a puppy that runs around learns only to run around unless you supervise and put in structured learning of how to behave.  That does make for an automated dog - just a well behaved one.

She starts puppy training next week

I'm sure you'll find that helps a lot.

>Thank you I do give her a stuffed bone stuffed with the chicken puppy stuff done by Kong

A friend of mine recommends salmon mousse from fish4dogs for stuffing kongs/bones etc.  I've served it frozen today as it lasts longer.  It's good stuff and very natural so probably better than the Kong stuff.  It comes in a bag so chop the corner off and squirt it in.  My pup loves this mousse and the big dogs go all daft and squirmy for it.

Incidentally any of the fish skin treats are great and 100% natural.  My pup takes a while to chew their skinny strips.   If you keep an eye on the site they often have special offers like buy one get one free

now that is pedantic
only a fool would allow a puppy to run around unsupervised I never once said she was unsupervised I said she was allowed/made to rest in the car I also said she was with us when she was free.
Not sure what where you are coming from really I have been doing obediance with dogs for years it is only since I last had a puppy this low excercise to aid bone developement has come into fashion. We used to work our dogs with professional trainers for hours on end in groups of ten or more. We were encouraged to walk them and it was thought to actually be good for them in a similar way it is now scientifically proven that interval training young horses hardens their legs and tendons and improves their chances of staying sound to an old age.
While I appreciate new knowledge and changes in ideas are a good idea I have never yet had a dog suffer from skeletal problems in 50 years of dog ownership never bred a puppy that suffered from them either. I always limited the newfoundlands form climbing stairs etc and I am willing to listen to reason and sensible suggestion not bullying pedants.
I am prepared to listen and will follow the new methods for the benfit of my pup

Do you think the mad whizzing about could be as a result of feeding the cheaper supermarket food with moist bits in? I am suspecting they're coloured too? Could just be making a normal young pup completely hyper, bit like the sunshine yellow colourings do for kiddies. If she's constantly hungry that's probably down to the fact she's doing lots of whizzing around ... mad whizzing around certainly makes me eat :-(

Have you talked to her breeder about food? Surely you should still be feeding what the breeder recommended.

Anyway, just a thought and you might want to look again at what you're feeding.

It is possible that the food is contributing so I will try to get her to eat something else. I cant feed her the stuff the breeder used as she refuses to touch it and initially lost a fair bit of weight. She is now growing like a weed and although sturdy you can feel her ribs and prior to eating a meal see the outline of them. The vet is very happy with her weight and was with her diet but I do agree it could be better.
The breeder is happy with her too

I know with one of my collies, at 5 months I had to change her from the puppy food (Beta) to an adult food as she really was way over the top in behaviour and it did make a difference. It's worth a shot.

Just with the breeder food, are you sure it wasn't just a case of her going off food as a result of all the changes when she arrived in a new home? I know with my pups I was quite strong in my instructions to the owners that if pup went off food to please not change it as it would just be a result of changing circumstances. If you do change the food though, phase it in over a 7-10 period, don't just change it suddenly. Anyways, good luck and I'm sure you'll soon have the mad whizzing harnessed!! :-)

thank you for your help I will change her food over the next month and see how it goes. The breeder food is one not reccomended on here anyway so will find a non coloured one and see how that goes thanks again

Not pedantic, just that your OP did not make clear just what was going on.

I am trying to help inso much as give some advice.  All dogs are different and their handling/training needs to be tailored to suit each individual dog.  If one way is not working then you need to make changes.

I offered my suggestions as a qualified behaviourist/canine psychologist and trainer. 

thank you for you interest. what would your view be then on the age  a puppy can be reliably housetrained then as this was a qualified trained behaviourist that suggested or should I say dictated that 6 months was the earliest possible time. I am prepared to take your views on board and perhaps it was the type written word that made it appear pedantic. I apologise if that made me misunderstand your view

>would your view be then on the age  a puppy can be reliably housetrained then

In the past I've had a puppy reliably clean and dry day and night at 10 weeks (got her at 7½ weeks - she made 2 puddles between 8½ and 9½ weeks, entirely due to my own complacency), but that was because I could concentrate on her 100% of the time she was awake.

Other puppies have taken up to 4 months of age for me to be 100% confident; but then I don't leave them for long hours. If I had to be out of the house for more than 3 hours at a time it'd take some time longer.

>what would your view be then on the age  a puppy can be reliably housetrained then as this was a qualified trained behaviourist that suggested or should I say dictated that 6 months was the earliest possible time

I'm fairly sure 6 months is the standard quoted time in most puppy/dog training books.  I recall one said 'you should expect accidents up to 6 months' another said that 'until 6 months it is only the owners vigilance that prevents accidents, not the dog'. 

That said my latest puppy is generally better at hanging on than my last one.  He can shout me in the morning but hold it until I arrive downstairs, my other dog used to wake up and pee before I could get to him.  Mind you he also never read any of the books that said puppies don't pee in their beds and I think used to pee almost in his sleep!  My latest pup definitely has a bigger bladder capacity and a more efficient early warning system! :)  Some puppies appear to be easier to housetrain but their bowel and bladder control cannot be counted upon for some time

Good luck with the food. You can really get bogged down by foods, just look on the threads on this forum. Aim to go for a good quality, no artificial this and thats, and something that you can get hold of relatively easily, and if you know other lab owners just check out what they're feeding and what their dogs are doing well on. It doesn't have to cost an absolute fortune to get a decent food :-)

I sympathise because I have a three year old who never slept as a puppy and it was difficult dealing with that level of energy.  The pup I have at the moment is much easier and does sleep regularly and is fairly easily tired, although she is more restless on an evening. 

I recently came across an article in a magazine where John Innes (RCVS vet specialising in small animal orthopaedics) states I am not sure there is any scientific evidence that restricting exercise is necessary.  This led me to wonder where the 5 minute rule came from and what the evidence is for restricted exercise.  I seem to remember one of the raw feeding gurus saying exercise was bad but cannot remember what studies he did, if any.

The 5minute rule is probably down to common sense it doesn't make good to pavement pound a puppy due to the pressure on the joints. To alleiviate potential issues later on it would be wise to give restricted exercise and not let said puppy bound around unduly, OCD can be trauma based for instance and you'll only find out later on when floating mice are found on xrays. I have a 3yr old that was a potential show puppy who unfortunately dislocated his back leg which was operated on unsuccessfully and now he is riddled with arthritis which is such a shame at his age. My friend also had an excellent potential show pup who fell off the bed and needed several operations to pin the fractured leg back together, so sadly it can and does happen.
Professor John Innes treated one of my dogs and he is an excellent orthopaedic i'm suprised he said that or if it wasn't his view and he was just stating a random fact.

I don't think anyone was talking about pounding the pavements. 

To quote the article in full

John Innes advises that

Appropriate levels of exercise are important for development of the musculoskeletal system. 
Experiments in young dogs have shown that extreme exercise (for example 40km running each day for 15 weeks) can cause some mild degeneratie changes in joints but while excessive exercise could therefore be damaging in the long-term, if a dog is otherwise healthy, I am not sure that there is any scientific evidence that restricting exercise is necessary.
Of course, some dogs may have developmental orthopaedic disorders as they grow and it is possible that, given relatively more exercise, some of these disorders may be exacerbated.

His article sounds fair thanks for posting it :) although i wouldn't have thought you could generalise and would have to consider a fair few breeds to reach an opinion, err'ing on the side of caution certainly doesn't do much harm. I'm more shocked that they'd make a young dog run 25miles a day for 15weeks all in the name of an experiment!

As for pounding pavements its a figure of speech, road walking, restricted exercise whatever you like to call it.

I've been pondering on it and it doesn't make sense now, could i ask Tess in what context was his comment refering to ,was he asked about exercise in young puppies? as he refers to an experiment conducted on 'young dogs' which in reality could be anything upto 3yrs of age and not necessarily in the context we are commenting on in regards to a 15week old here. I'm summising a group of 8month old dogs weren't used for instance, I would also imagine a medium sized breed would fare better in the results than say a giant/large breed but again it does entirely depend on the age used and even at what physical fitness level the dogs were at the time. I think his comment is open to a vast amount of interpretation unless you have the specific experiment research at your disposal, if you have the link to the experiment conducted i'd be really grateful?

Suprisingly i located the experiment (i presume it was the same one)and it was conducted on 10 beagles from 15 weeks to 70weeks in age all where trained to reach 40km a day then the experiment began, it does bring up some interesting theories but again there is nothing to suggest you could compare this to say a large/giant breed as i would expect the results to be different as the growth time in a beagle v a giant breed is more wider/longer.
Interesting :)

It was in the problem pages of Your Dog magazine March 2008.  John Innes answered a query from a reader who was about to get a puppy and who was questioning the accepted wisdom about not over-exercising.  She said that because puppies had so much energy it would be good to give them lots of exercise 'to keep them out of mischief'. 

So the query was about exercising a very young puppy as the questioner had not yet taken her puppy home.

I also thought that it was hard on the puppies in the experiment to be exercised to such a degree. 

I think the op was talking about running round a field.  I don't think that is forced exercise like lead walking and it sounds as if the pup was able to stop at any time.

Hi Tess when i commented i wasn't passing any comment on the OP i was merely refering/replying to the 5min rule comment you made.
With owning giant breeds his comment did give me food for thought so i emailed him and got an immediate and  very interesting reply back which i will quote part of it below (the rest of the email is of no consequence to this thread so is omitted) but i can pm in its entirety to anyone interested.

I think the issue is that large/giant breeds are more prone to developmental orthopaedic conditions such as OCD, hip dysplasia and elbow dysplasia. We don't know the exact effect of exercise on these conditions, nor the type of exercise, but it is likely that if one of these conditions were developing, excessive exercise would not help matters.

He did also state you could not compare the findings logically to larger dogs than those used in the experiment (beagles) so basically if you've bought a puppy from health tested dogs (ie hip and elbow) then you're probably onto a good start if you haven't then well thats common sense really and i go back to my original comment err'ing on the side of caution isn't going to do much harm is it :) because to put it blunt even the professionals don't know!!

Whether or not one believes in the 5 minute rule it would be madness IMHO to just go out and walk/run one's puppy for any great length of time. Athletes build up their training bit by bit and a slow gentle start to any sustained exercise is a must.

I have a rescue GR from unknown parentage and hip dysplasia is one of the health problems that can be found in his breed. We got him at 9 weeks old and followed the 5 minute rule. He is now 5 years old and very fit and active - I train agility with him 2-3 nights a week and he competes most weekends. He has great muscle tone but this was built up slowly and carefully; he can be out all day running off lead, and often is, and I am convinced he is able to do this  due to a slow, gradual build up of his fitness.

I don't think anyone is disputing the 5 minute rule Harley of course the reasons you quoted are common sense in the way i wouldn't go to the gym once a week for a 3hr workout without suffering some consequences the day after unless i had specifically built up prior.
I think the 5min rule is a typically safe and practical way to raise a pup and as you have shown Harley and you have reaped the benefits of that regime to put it simply if there is no muscle (which there isn't much in pups) there is nothing to act as a sort of shock absorber so this will transfer to the next thing ie bone (summising that the pup hasn't had the ability to build up any sort of muscle tone). As there has been no research done into this theory one can only summarise but it would make sense and i do wonder about OCD in those instances in larger breeds.

I don't think anyone is disputing the 5 minute rule Harley

I think I may have misunderstood the experiment then? It's not hard to confuse me these days :-) - says the person who had started to walk to work this morning and then had to return home again when she realised she was still wearing her slippers!! .

lol we've gone to the dogs literally!!
I think you could probably discount the study as it couldn't be compared to the average pet puppy as the study was done in a controlled enviroment ie treadmills its very much open to interpretation upon the reader and it would pay to have an open mind when reading it and come to your own opinion. And mine personally hasn't changed from the 5min rule after reading it as theres no scientific research to tell me otherwise.
The study was actually the effects of long distance running on hormones (as bitches were used) blood and bone no ill effects such as ocd, hip or elbow dysplasia were reported because quite simply they weren't looking for that in the experiment that wasn't what it was about.
I hope that explains it better :)

Also Beagles are small dogs that would reach adult skeletal size fairly quickly, so less time to go wrong in development

I would definitely err on the side of caution when it comes to exercising a puppy.  But having had an exceptionally energetic puppy three years ago I wonder if there is something to be said for fulfilling the dog's psychological needs without going OTT (running 25 miles a day!)  No forced walking but it might mean more free running than another pup would get.  It's a bit like the vaccination question i.e. do you keep them isolated until they are protected or do you socialise in the safest places you can find and potentially risk the illnesses.  Some pups are too heavy to carry far.

Hi Mistral

Not sure if your comment was addressed to me but I have been off line for a few days so missed your enquiry.

In all honesty, I do not believe there is any hard and fast rule.  Each dog differs in its abilty to learn just as people do. 

There are so many factors that play a part that it would be impossible for anyone to give a set answer.

factors which contribute are:

how much time an owner can give in the initial early stages of training and how they handle the whole issue of training/accidents

What kind of regular feeding/exercise/sleeping routine is established

Physical development and breed of the pup and even gender can play a part.

What house-training actually means can vary from one person to another.

I got my last pup at 12 weeks.  He has only ever had 2 accidents in the house in the entire time we've had him.  He is now 17 months.  Both occasions were my fault. 

I took him out on the hour every hour when he was awake from day one and put in extra times eg when he woke or had been playing.

He never went out to toilet after 10.30pm or before 6am and never fouled his crate.

Some would therefore say he was 'house trained' very early.

However, I would not have classed him as 'house trained' until he started to 'ask' to go out and he was probably 6 - 7 months of age when he did that.

Thank you for your reply I would agree that all are different without a doubt and I am happy to say that our puppy has been asking to go out since she was 9 weeks old. However it could be that she has trained us rather than the other way round as she seems quite a smart cookie.