I have a four month old collie puppy.  From about 4 weeks it was clear there was a problem - infection and leaking of urine.  Thought to be that the bladder was in the wrong place (pelvic region) it's now been established this isn't the only problem..urine is going into all the wrong places.  An operation could resolve most of the issues, but probably leaving her still incontinent.  I haven't got a final costing...but spent £1k so far it's unlikely that I'm going to get change out of another £2-3k.  She's not insured (happened too early) but this isn't the main issue - it's whether the quality of life for an incontinent dog is good.  I am likely to have a problem in keeping nappy pants on because of the other dogs.  I don't want wee all over the house but I don't want to consign a dog to totally a kennel (haven't any anyway) life and a life of constantly trying to keep herself clean.  She's already fed up with her mother trying to clean her up.  Has anyone any experience of this?

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_ectopic_ureters.html  I have heard of bitches having peeing problems I also know that a bitch can sometimes correct bladder problems once they have thier first season if it is a problem with the euretha , due to release of certain hormones that can tighten it up.
It does sound like she has more problems than this if she has been checked over by a vet.

Cant really give any info re quality of life after surgery ..maybe a good idea to ask your local vet hospital for contact to people whos pets have had the surgery.

er yes, as explained earlier it's a lot more serious than that...but thanks for your comments, so far the advice is to have her pts :-( from someone who has been through it with a pup...

I really don't have any experience of this, but wanted to send some strength to you, to help you make such a very hard decision.

{{{{  HUGS  }}}}

I have a puppy with an intrapelvic bladder and although one of her ureters are in the right place the other one is still under discussion.  What has your vet tried already?  Has your pup been on Propalin? What effect did that have?  Has your pup had a direct urine sample taken from the bladder to check for infection and which type?  What has your vet said about the placement of the ureters as that can have a direct affect on how successful any operation would be.

The reason Im saying this is that it turned out that Maple had an almost constant urine infection (which obviously didnt help the situation and is VERY common in dogs with bladder issues).  It was only when it was cultured that it was discovered that the antibiotics werent totally killing the bug.  So she was put on a longer course and a different type of tablets.  That has helped a lot.

Maple doesnt drip hardly at all now and she is 6 months, she will leak sometimes when she sleeps but I can deal with that one.  I have been advised to keep her unspayed as long as possible as that will also help.  Since the correct antibiotics were found she is no longer licking herself all the time and although she didnt get sore, it must have been irritating.

Sadly the only pup I know that was constantly leaking and had no bladder control whatsoever despite treatment ended up with urine scalds all down her legs and had absolutely no quality of life as her skin became all infected, she was PTS :(.

Oh Penny - I don't have any experience of anything as serious as this. I cope with mild incontinence of an older dog but, clearly, your situation is completely different.

How likely is it that she will be left incontinent after surgery? I guess that would be my guide in a situation like this. Whilst I may opt for surgery on a 50/50 scenario, I may choose not to on a 80/20 basis.

I don't think it would be fair to the mite to continue a life where she was completely incontinent. As you say, the constant cleaning (no doubt leading to secondary skin infections and break down) would be horrific for her. I know how distressed my older dog becomes when she dribbles just a small amount.

I am sorry I can't offer advice about the problem your pup has Penny but I just wanted to post to say that I can't imagine how awful this decision must be for you.

xx

She's had a couple of dye tests (total so far in excess of £1k) and the latest has shown both ureters are going where they shouldn't - her bladder is in the wrong place and the prognosis is that she's likely to be incontinent even after major surgery.  She's had a constant infection and has had this tested a couple of times (when they did the dye test) (waiting outcome of the second) and been on anti-biotics since she was 6 weeks old (changed after the first testing) - it keeps it in check but doesn't resolve it.  Not sure what Propalin does, but she needs surgery rather than drugs as it's a physical thing with her ureters.  I've seen the xrays and it's not good.  Have to say that the advice so far is to have her pts...I haven't seen the specialist as yet, but it's unlikely that she can be totally fixed, sadly.

Just to let you know that today I've made the tough decision and had the pup pts, with the full agreement of the vet, there was little hope of a good outcome for her and I didn't want to put her through major surgery for her to live a miserable life, losing it to an infection due to build up of resistance or a breakdown of her cells by urine scalding. Poor little pup, loved as she was it was far too short a time.  This is the tough end of breeding the bit you find out the hard way. Thanks to everyone for their help and thoughts. 

So very sorry for your loss.  And, while it was not the same reason, I had to come to a decision 3 months ago.  I had to let a 10 week old pup go and give her rest.

I still cry now, I loved her so much.  I can only say Penny, that the pain is now yours, as you have taken the pain away for your girl.  You just have to love them enough.  xxx

So so sad for you.  A hard decision to make and not one you took lightly.  Sending huge hugs xx

It sounds like the right decision to me, and I know how hard it must have been. I'm so sorry.

Must have been completely heartbreaking, you would think they should be 'safe' by the time they get to that age. :-(

What a sad decision to have to make, but for what it's worth I think you made the right choice.

Thanks everyone, it was undoubtedly the best thing for the pup, but hard on me.  Thanks for your support.

I no its not the same but My Dozer was born with a rectal prolapse- we did a purse string on him which did help a bit. Kept him on fiber to help him go more easily- we were told he could live a short life or a long one can't be to sure. Asked about the whole surgery (think they attatch the rectom to the colon) and were told its a 50/50 chance it would work and lucky if they have control over their bowles not to mention being the pooper area can end up with lots of infection- not the cleanest area so to speak... By the time he was 7 1/2yrs old it did get alot worse- hurt to poo and it also was just sliding out so had alot of lil presents around the house and in his kennel- we tried Analsol never worked and some other things our vet suggested, but in the end we did PTS on advice from our vet. It was the hardest choice to make but didn't want to see him in anymore pain- he was very happy for the 71/2 yrs we had him- still miss the lil guy :-(

Sorry to hear about ur lil one (((hugs)))