Hi all

I would like to ask peoples advice on breeding from a giant breed, i know of someone who has bred their (v immature bitch IMO) at just less than 2 years old, then again to the exact year a 2nd litter, both litters very large.

I am pretty shocked, i've never bred a litter and may do so but not for a long while yet, I would assume (hope) that she had a season inbetween otherwise this would be a back to back mating!!!!

It's the bitch I feel sorry for, 2 litters from a 3 year old surely is not right :0(, and to boot neither have had any relevant health tests, when in this day and age, hip scoring surely is a must, especially for a 1st time breeder

What do people think about this?

Thank You

Hi montybaber...my thoughts only on this :)

doesnt matter if your a 1st time breeder or not ,if hip score should be done for this breed then any1 breeding from them are wrong!
you say the bitch is very imature? what makes you think this? i have had a girl i breed from at 2 and so silly and playfull but that was her :) and she was a fantactic mummy.
i dont breed from a bitch every other season but i dont see a problem with it alot do because they want to keep a pup.
if theres a year between each litter i dont class it back to back
i have large breed dogs and they have a season every 4months so thats 3 seasons ayear

she should health test her dogs!!! i find this very wrong ,is this girl a good mum?

xx

The age is just about OK, though why the hurry (unless using an older dog who may not be available or fertile much longer), but the lack of health testing is totally out of order.

Edited to add, if the bitch was less than two at first litter that is too young for anything but some of the small breeds (and only where they are not prone to late onset health issues).

I don't think it matters if a bitch is still a little immature in temperament but it is unforgivable to breed a bitch who is physically immature and only the smaller breeds are mature below the age of two but most of the giants are far from mature.

On the other hand if you leave it late for the first litter the bitches pelvis is not as flexible as it once was and that can make carrying and birth more difficult.

Thanks all for your responses, as she is a giant breed some bitches don't physically mature until at least 2.5yrs and this bitch is no exception, i do think that they do need to mature both physically and emotionally, a large litter must be quite a thing to cope with
There is not a problem with the age of the stud, both dogs have been used together twice, and the 2nd litter no pups were kept ie money making which just doesn't sit right with me, I have seen some of the pups from the first litter, I can't find one good thing about them, which makes me think why do it again, 2 wrongs don't make a right, and just because you can doesn't mean you should :0(.  One of them was told at a show by a judge that they thought they had hip dysplasia, why on earth both or even that one wasn't hipscored I don't know!!

I know on paper the ages probably do look ok, but it just makes me angry and a bit sad that people can get away with this

I could go on and on LOL

> at just less than 2 years old,

    Giant breed?

I thought it was only my very tiny breed that was mated that young!

Jean it is generally 2 years across the board, but personal discression as to when you think the bitch is mature enough, which in some cases is wrong as alot of large/Giant breeds just aren't ready then! My own large breed bitch didn't have her first litter till she was nearly 3 due to her still being immature but physically she would have been ready before that. She is now going on to have her second litter and is now 4 and half.

To be honest because of how seasons may fall most people who think of two as a MINIMUM age will not mate their bitch until later than that.

I have mated a bitch who whelped 5 days after her second birthday, left a season between and tried again for a litter 16 months later and she missed. Now waiting for her to come in season and if she takes the litter will be more than two years since the first.  this bitch has longer than a average inter season intervals , so in breeds where 8 - 12 months seasons are more the norm a breeder might choose to breed a bitch at just two rather than wait, for whatever reason, but generally there should be no great hurry, certainly not to have another litter quite so soon after a large litter.

The main issues with this set of breedings is the lack of health testing and repeating the mating, which is never a good idea as it adds nothing new to the gene pool.  A repeat mating could be justified if the first litter were small and the quality wasn't in the sex you hoped for, but one would think with a large litter before there would have been something suitable of the right sex to keep, if not then repeating the mating is pointless if quality wasn't there.