A bitch who has recently whelped a  litter of 10 pups by one of our boys has been told by their vet that she must go in for spaying tomorrow morning as her uterus is full of, presumably, afterbirths, which have not come away.   She is not running a temperature, is bright, the pups feeding well, but straining a bit every couple of hours.   She is still discharging.

The pups are only 5 days old.    I have never had this happen before, and am worrying silly about the whole thing - has anyone else had the problem - seems so dramatic.  The owner is a first time breeder, and has done everything right, and really doesn't deserve this!!

Jo

Has she had an Oxytocin injection?  Surely this would be the first thing to do to see if she can expel the afterbirths herself?  Spaying seems very drastic, I would try to avoid neutering an animal that has just given birth wherever possible.   My cat was neutered during a Caesarian in July and she's not been the same since.

Yes, they have given her oxytocin.    She must be open still to be  discharging.    She will have more than her hands full if the bitch loses her milk.  

Jo

I know that I'm going back over 15 years now, but when Purdey had her second litter, she birthed 12 pups, then two days later passed another two dead puppies - and her temperature was rising.  We called the vet out, who examined her and said that she had another pup still inside and needed emergency surgery.   He had to spay her, as there was infection present in the uterus and so we had one very knocked out mum plus 12 puppies.

We had the puppies in two cat boxes, beside her, and were feeding them every 2 hours.   As she came around from the anaesthetic, some of the pups were sqeaking as it was feed time - and Purdey was trying, very groggily, to get into the cat box to nurse them!   So we feed them and let her clean them.   She continued lactating and after a week we were able to allow all of the pups back on to mum - and she succeeded in feeding them until we reared them off her.

It was very worrying at the time - and pretty hectic as well - but we all lived to tell the tale.   Since then, I always scanned for pups - and insisted on vet checking mum over within 24 hours!

jo 1 of my friends had this problem about 8years ago i can remember it very well ,her girl had the same ,she had the oxytocin but that didnt help her girl was large breed and she had 12 pups aweek old ,she had to have em spay ,her bitch lost all her milk and my friend had to feed all the pups herself with help from me and afew other friends ,mum was poorly too for about 3weeks after my god she is going to have her hands full if her girl is anything like my friends :( hope all goes well tho xx

The two occasions mine have needed C sections they were spayed at the same time, no negative effects.

Obviously if they would prefer to preserve the bitches fertility then more oxytocin and antibiotics would seem to be the answer and perhaps scanning to make sure she has expelled it all. 

I would expect her to be open for some weeks as this is normal to have variable lengths of Lochia (blood loss).

Same as Barbara, I would most definitely expect a bitch to still be open at 5 days.  However, unlike Barbara, I don't have bitches spayed at the same time as a section.  I wait until pups are 12 weeks old.  Not saying either way is right or wrong, just saying what I prefer.

I would be expecting antibiotics and another oxytocin jab.  If she is still straining, surely another jab would help.  Is the vet 100% certain that all the afterbirths have not come away?  Was a scan done (which I would have insisted on, and would have stayed with the bitch to see for myself.)

> I don't have bitches spayed at the same time as a section.  I wait until pups are 12 weeks old.

I just prefer not to have to have a bitch opened up twice in such a short time, but on both occasions I stipulated the spay should be done if the Vet thought it safe to do so bearing in mind they were due to be spayed after that litter.

I also spay bitches that have had their last litter about 11 - 12 weeks after the pups are born.

Well, come the morning, and the poor bitch is in the vets.    All we can do is cross fingers.    Personally I recoil at the thought of spaying, as I regard it as a mutilation if it's not medically necessary - maybe that's why this upsets me.   Sorry - emotive word, but that's just how I see it.    I would have preferred the bitch to be given ABs a bit longer, but of course I'm not there myself, so you have to trust the vet.

Have had some emails both ways - luckily some have said that the milk supply in their case wasn't affected.    Will post back when we know.

Jo

I think the milk supply is likely to be affected by the stress and or infection rather than the act of spaying as I had not problems with milk supply in the two girls that were spayed during their C sections.

The womb and ovaries are not in charge of the milk production.  Prolactin is produced by the Pituitary http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prolactin

Same scenario happened 3 weeks ago to someone who had a bitch whelp pups to my boy. The Vet was having her in to be spayed on the Monday (5 days after pups were born) and the owners were not happy about this. Eventually a different Vet tried the Alizin injection. They said that you cannot use Oxytocin after a certain amount of days. She was also on antibiotics for a bladder infection. Everything was fine after that and no spaying involved.

Fingers crossed for the girl.  Hope its a good outcome.  Thinking healing thoughts and hugs for you.

Fingers crossed and keep us posted. So glad my girl didn't need a spay with her C section - I don't intend to breed from her again, but like the OP I don't like neutering unless for medical or behavioural reasons.

Probably to late to try now but Dorwest Herb Raspberry leaf tablets are good for helping to clear out the uterus after having pups. 

Right - here's an update - they did  spay Lilly - said there was a lot of green gunge in the uterus (which of course there would be).   So it's done.   The very good news is that she's gone straight back in with the babies, and is feeding them and cleaning the them up.   The little bitch is being a star nowithstanding!

Jo

jo thats great news , fingers crossed her milk stays in ,she sounds like a great mum bless her! x

Ditto, shame they speyed her but pleased it went well.  What a good girl she is.

So pleased that she is ok in herself.  I'm always amazed at how much a bitch will put her pups before herself.  Bless her.