I'm doing a bit of reach on behalf of my dad.he's due to retire in less than a year and would love another dog after my mum and dads bidder collie x lab was pts last year.my mum would love another collie but my dad is less keen as their dog had quite a long coat and he felt the grooming requirements were too he would definitely consider a rescue but is not ruling pout a puppy.his preference would be medium/large, relatively easy to train and requires a decent amount of exercise.my dad is fit for his age and will prob walk a mile or two daily plus short walks round the block.it seems that low continence in terms of grooming is a must and he won't wasn't a dog that needs clipping.any iras which beds he should start researching? Thanks

Greyhound, how about an x-racer

Haha just read that back! Im using the predictive text on my phone and have just seen all the spelling mistakes! Hes looking a medium/large fairly active and easily trainable LOW MAINTAINENCE dog not a low continence dog! ;-)

Sounds like a Labrador could fit the bill in every respect.

Hes mentioned labs and ive suggested golden retrievers although I dont know about their grooming requirements.
I hadnt thought of a greyhound brainless, I will suggest that to him

Any other breed suggestions welcome

Well Goldens need more grooming than my breed, and labradors shed as bad.

Labs would be my thought on this, but they do shed a lot..

What about a Pointer? Spinone?
I'd also look at Vizla's, but they maybe a little bit too much on the nuttiness side of things for your Dad?

What about a working springer?  Ours has very little coat and requires nothing more than a brush now and again.  Very biddable and easily trained.  Loves company and will take any size of walk you like.  If I don't have time for a long walk, a few rounds of fetch soon tire her out.  Totally the best dog I've ever owned.

Not a working Springer, most working bred Springers have exercise requirements far greater than what the average owner can give them.  Show bred ESS have a far more sensible temperament.

If you are going down the retriever route what about a Flatcoat instead of a Golden?   What about an older rescue GSP or a Bracco?

Yes, but the show ESS has a much thicker coat which requires a lot of grooming.  I think if you work a springers brain, you needn't exercise them any more than average.  They just don't want to be left home alone all day while the owner works full-time.  Company is all they need.

I know WSDs are technically the same breed as BCs (at least I think so) but many of them seem to have much shorter coats. Or how about a Smooth Collie?

Having owned 3 working ESS so far, currently 2. I disagree that working ESS need only as much physical exercise as "average" (suppose it depends what you think of as average). I can quite honestly say, mine would be up the walls, using my house like a race track, getting up to all sorts I don't want them to learn, let alone do, and gererally being pests if they weren't both mentally and physically exercised. At the moment I have one too young to do lots and one with and injury and life is less than peaceful at the moment. I can't wait til the pup is all grown up and my other one is all fixed again and we can get on with hiking, swimming, chasing balls and as much training as we can fit in at the same time (the best reward of all for mine when getting a mental task right is to be physically exercised and only when the 2 meet are they truely happy).

As for the grooming, that needs careful attention too if you don't clip off their lovely coat (which would be a terrible shame in my eyes). Their ears and feathers need a daily brush so not to get tangled. During the summer they need to be carefully checked over for grass seeds (and the rest of the time brambles etc) because the coat is excellent at holding them and their feet are best trimmed to reduce the chance of seeds getting stuck in the summer and mud etc the rest of the time. Their "bum curtains" sometimes need trimming to keep them clean, it's advisable to trim the hair away from the inside of the ear to allow air to circulate reducing the likelyhood of infections. While your springer might have an easily maintained coat, they are very variable because they are bred to work, not for looks so looks are a much lower priority than for a show breeder. All 3 of my springs have looks completely different in build, size and coat.

I think that working ESS are wonderful dogs and in the right homes with the right lifestyle are fab, but in the wrong homes, wrong lifestyles and with people who don't want a dog that is so clever it can out smart you and you have to go away and think up a never more cunning approach they can be a disaster. Far too many end up in rescue because of people thinking they look nice or are easy. They are far from it but if you have what it takes, they are well worth it I agree, my life would be empty without them.

I agree greyhounds sound like they could be ideal, as do labs, they might shed a lot but a good brush and you are away so still my idea of easy grooming.

If you mum wants another collie, has a smooth coated border collie been thought of as opposed to a rough coated? You definately see plenty of them needing homes in rescue too.

There's lots of collies about with short coats.

I think the best option would be to go to various rescue organisations, tell them what your parents are looking for, what the requirements are, what lifestyle they can offer - and then the rescue organisation can help finding the perfect dog that might be any of the mentioned breeds, a crossbreed, mut or something completely different you might not have thought of.

Vera

The Vizsla needs a lot of exercise - a couple of hours a day when fully grown and they definately benefit from days out working - shooting etc....

German Pinscher?  Pinschers are smart, somewhat easy to train, active but not over the top.  GPs are low maintenance when it comes to grooming.  They stand about 18 inches at the shoulder. 
Or what about a whippet?  Low grooming.  Active, but I have been told that they love to curl up at your feet as well.  Laid back in the house.  The only problem I have heard about whippets is the same as any other sight hound, that if they see something in the far distance they will want to chase after it.  So leash walking is a must, I have been told to never let a whippet off leash. 

Airedale terrier, American hairless terrier, Standard poodle, Boston terrier, bull terrier,spanish waterdog, dalmation.. just some idea's :-)

Don't go for a dalmatian if you don't want loads of hairs everywhere, despite daily brushing! Plus a dalmatian would need a lot more exercise than suggested in the first post - a mile or two would be just for starters.

I suscpect they could find a lab x collie with a short coat, or pure collie with a short coat.

Adam

Labs do shed a lot but if you can get hold of a Lab with a single coat rather than a double cost then they are a lot easier to maintain but alot whimpier when it comes too going into very cold water !

Even with Labs if you try and groom once a day you can manage a moult without too much problem. (says me who doesn't do it every day and suffers for it ! )

Think Dalmatian hair is worse than Elkhound, there may be more from an Elkie but Dallie hair seems to be the sort that manages to get it's self stuck everywhere including into your feet. And both need exercise best bet is a couch potato greyhound - can move if you insist and only has a sparse coat.

Just one thing to bear in mind if looking for Border Collies in a rescue organisation is that they really don't do well in rescue kennels and it drives a lot of them stir crazy. So the dog that is yapping at everyone and jumping up the walls and putting everyone off from going near him may actually be a great dog if he wasn't confined in such a way.

If your mum does talk your dad into rescuing a Border then probably better to go to one of the actual Border Collie Rescue centres who know and respect the breed and where they will have been assessed properly for rehoming.

Also I've heard it said that the lighter the eye and the smoother the coat the keener the working instinct....and prick eared collies can be really noise sensitive. So if that theory holds any merit then a prick eared, light eyed, smooth coated collie may well be easier to groom.... but may be more than your Dad could handle :) 

Spanish are a wonderful breed but new owners need to ensure that they are socialised with people from early on and also need their brains exercising more than their legs.

> including into your feet.

OMGosh isn't that painful!!  Whippet hair does the same depending on the type of coat.  I had the most painful splinter (I thought) in my foot and it took me ages to actually get it out, and when I did it was actually a dog hair that had embedded itself.

The number of people that don't believe me.  I'm glad someone else understands.

lol. I had a similar thing with Beagle hair. I thought I had a splinter too! Its amazing how much irritation that can cause!!!

Dalmatian hair does that too. Extremely painful to remove because of the way the cells of the hair itself lie - they're like tiny barbs, so the hair burrows into the skin smoothly but is anchored on the reverse journey. A bit like grass seeds, I suppose.

I find it with spaniel and Westie hair too when I'm grooming - once I have a cut edge, it embeds in my finger. I can barely see it, but I can feel it, and because it's hair clipped from going over and clipping again to get a smooth finish, it's only about a millimetre long. I'm trying to get one out right now, grrr!!

Good call on the Smooth Collie, Lucy - a vulnerable breed that need all the new enthusiasts they can get. I'm sure most breeders would be more than happy for prospective new owners to visit and see if it's the breed for them.

M.

>Good call on the Smooth Collie, Lucy - a vulnerable breed that need all the new enthusiasts they can get. I'm sure most breeders would be more than happy for prospective new owners to visit and see if it's the breed for them.

I see from their site that they run a Mentoring Scheme with senior breed members willing and able to give time for new owners, prospective owners and those just wanting to know more.  What a great idea!

Thanks Lily - I've always thought they are a handsome breed that don't get as much attention as the more glam Borders and Roughs. And if these people want a collie that doesn't need much grooming, they sound perfect - think they are slightly less exercise needy than a Border too? :-)

Less than a Border, more than a Rough as I understand it. Think they're quite easy to have around, by all accounts.

The website is really good, top marks to the club.

M.

ChristineW suggested a flatcoat or a golden, having lived with the former and looked after the latter, the first thing that I thought should be mentioned is that they do need grooming otherwise they can get knots of hair in their feathering and behind the ears where the hair is very soft. They also shed quite a bit. Flatcoats are always wanting to be doing things and are not as laid back about life as goldens can be and they do require a lot of mental stimulation as well as exercise.

Yes I did suggest those 2 breeds but I find the silky type dog hair is a lot easier to vacumn up than the short hairs which tend to act like darts into material. AND it was in part response to the Golden Retriever suggestion, not something I plucked out of the air!   Both breeds are a lot less demanding than a working bred ESS.

Chrstine I was not criticising you, but thought that as I have lived with both breeds, it should be mentioned that both will need regular grooming and the flatcoat is a high energy dog. I have also had springer and cockers here and all my dogs are working gundogs, and my experience is that of the four breeds the golden is the most laid back but it will need grooming to stop knots forming in the coat. Like you I definitely would not advise a working bred gundog, especially not a working springer or flatcoat.

what about a gsd? grooming is daily but doesnt take long! we have 5 lol