hi all,
i have stanley the newfie puppy.I have him well trained,he comes when called,hardly barks,is very gentle and loving.He is getting very strong when out for walkies.Normally he does not pull and if he does i use tone of voice to tell him no and he stops, he walks lovely to heel.Last night on our walkies,he pulled me over!no matter what i said he was gone,he jumped up soaking wet over a teenager. i apolagised to the lad,i told stan off(not shouting)he then did it again.Now i think i should get some kind of walking aid.I have tried a gentle leader but it would not stay on his face and if i did it up too tight he could not open his mouth to pant.I dont really want to use one,but i dont want this to happen again as it could have been alot worse ie in the road,
any advice would be great
jo

I don't like haltis or gentle leaders, head collar type things, but I do understand that sometimes, people need something to keep a large dog under their control.  I've looked back on anohter forum to remind myself of the two types which aren't 'muzzle clamping' in the way they are used.  The two recommended are Gencon and PAH own, which are, apparently, fixed action. 

I really like the canny collar

I too have a big bouncy dog and although he is fantastic on the lead and has an excellent recall he can, in certain situations, get really excited. He loves people and will still jump up if allowed to.

On a normal walk I use a half check but when we are going to areas of high excitement such as the shops or watching the boys play rugby I use his canny collar.

The lead attaches behind the head which I think is great. I don't really like head collars that do up under the muzzle and worry about neck injuries. It also seems more secure than many head collars; it buckles on like a flat collar and then has a piece which can be slipped over the nose, so can't easily be slid out of. It also doesn't tighten up so giving treats and panting is not a problem. 

thankyou for the advice,in an ideal world i would not use one but i am just worried about other people,cars and dogs,usually he is fine,but last night gave me a taster of his strength,i supose a harness would not work as ideally i dont want anything around his face bless him.Do dogs mind these collars,will he fuss a bit and then be ok and what is the best way to introduce it.
i dont want to get it wrong
cheers
jo

I didn't have any trouble introducing the Canny Collar.

First I had him wear it as an ordinary collar. Then with the lead attached I slipped it over his nose for a few seconds while giving him a treat, I did this several times a day before I tried him outside. Then while we were walking I would stop and slip it on for minutes, again while giving him a couple of treats and then finish the walk on just the collar. After about a week he was happy to wear it, although he still always looks for a treat when I get it out.

The canny collar is black and I doubt you'd even really notice it on Stanley. You certainly can't tell my boy is wearing his unless you really look for it.

Hi Jo, I have Leos and use Gencons, website below or you can also get them from ebay
http://www.gencon-allin1.co.uk/
You can get an extra soft one which won't mark his muzzle, they are easy to use, and don't rise up into their eyes. 
To start with it's a good idea to put it on whilst he's eating so he associates it with nice things, mine have all taken to them really quickly

I'm another one who votes for the Gencon. I've tried every headcollar and harness going and the Gencon is the one most tolerated by my lot.

I use a leather Dogmatic, it was actually given to me by a Newfy friend, doesn't ride up and very sturdy. Doesn't mark fur etc, I was given it as her Newf outgrew it.
Halti's are virtually useless on a large breed and tend to ride up into their eyes.
http://www.dogmatic.org.uk/
A few people in my breed also use them and i've also seen Setter people use them and put fleece around the muzzle area.

I'd recommend Gencons too... I have 3 labs, all of whom walk nicely on a normal lead when they're walked individually, but can be a bit OTT when walked together... and if we see a cat, well, it would be dangerous!  The Gencons work really well, I feel 100% in control when I have all 3 out together, and they come in nice colours so strangers don't assume they're a muzzle :-)  Mine don't mind them when walking, but as soon as the walk's over they start rubbing on me to try and get them off... they get a treat for putting their head through the 'loop' that goes round the back of their head, so they're more than happy to put them on.
Clare

My vote is also with the Dogmatic, it worked great on our Dobe boy and again, does not ride up into the eyes, gives plenty of room around the mouth and fits/looks like a  pony bridle. we loved it!

thanks for all your replys,will be taking stan to some pet shops to try a few on,what did catch my eye was the mikki walkies  harness,not sure how it would work with a newfie but if anyone has tried it please let me know

From my experience body harnesses only encourage pulling :(

Hi,

I use Gencon all-in-one as well. They now make them from a softer material which are easy on your hand and more comfortable for the dogs.

Ute

I agree Susieq, especially in a breed that will pull a cart. One of my puppy owners complained about him pulling on the lead. I gave them a head collar but "he didn't like it". Then I got a phone call to say he had pulled the lady (all 6' of her) into the road to get to another dog and she broke her hip. He was wearing a body harness.

I use the gentle leader for a short nose large breed and I have a friend with a 2 newfies and she said she uses the gentle leader. There is a knack to using it and I think it says in the leaflet to not pull against it but to lift your hand up. Not exactly sure how it read because Ive been using mine 3 years. When I went on holiday I had to show the dog sitter how to fit and use it cos she kept doing it wrong and making it uncomfortable for my dog. Even the vets never know how to put it back on when Ive been to pick up my dog. My dog walks brilliantly in it and is very relaxed with it on. I found the halti of which I used on a previous dog was not suitable because it did keep rubbing her eyes. I suppose its what ever your dog is most comfortable with.

i did think that being a newfie dog, the reason i thought harness well this harness was that it was meant to put pressure on the points of the chest which is to stop them pulling,never mind, i will go for one of the others listed above which suits him best,got a few to pick from and i really appreciate the help and advice

>Then I got a phone call to say he had pulled the lady (all 6' of her) into the road to get to another dog and she broke her hip. He was wearing a body harness.

Oh my goodness... well a harness encourages some dogs to pull even more and they've got all their body strength to pull with. I was recommended not to use harnesses on dogs that pull already and wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

I don't think a body harness encourages pulling, but it is very hard to hold a strong dog on a body harness IF they pull as they can really put a lot of power into the pull. My dog has learnt the same lead-manners for his chest harness the same as his collar, but when in an excitable situation (when they tend to forget you're on the other end of the lead ) the harness will allow him to pull me without me having much hope of stopping him!

I have an English Mastiff, 99.9% he is a pleasure to walk on a lead, however, on the odd occasion he can get excited when meeting a dog so I find a Halti works wonders for me to keep controll of him. I have the halti on a lightweight, small lead and only use it when meeting dogs/new people (when not using it the lead is tucked into is harness, just above his shoulder.). For the rest of the time, he is walked on pavements with a collar & lead, or when in open spaces a long-line on a body/chest harness.

My favourite and best value head collars are made here: http://www.dajan.co.uk/Halters.html

Brainless

They look really good and at that price defiantly worth trying.

>what did catch my eye was the mikki walkies  harness

I used the Mikki Walkrite for my mongrel - he came to us at 10 months so we'd missed the puppy stages of lead walking.  Worked like a dream for 'town' walking when pigeons were a problem!  He just didn't pull, lean or lunge whilst wearing this so it gave me a chance to reward heel walking with lots of positive reinforcements.  They call it a training aid and it certainly worked for us - I didn't need to use it for long.  Mine soon walked perfectly on a normal collar

You might want to see whether a pet shop would let you try one on to see if it suits Stan and his coat. 

The walkrite kind can put a dogs front out and spoil the movement for the ring.

just out of interest,how would it do that,if he was not pulling and the straps were slack it would be like wearing a collar,anyway i am still deciding on what to do,gosh its hard with all the choice out there
jo

At that price I was happy to buy four and it is like power steering taking the five of them out.  The best thing is there are no clasps, you simply pop over muzzle and head and adjust the neck strap, and all the fixings are metal.

I can let them have the full length of their leads and let them walk in front and get them back by me when I need with no effort.  Previously I kept them very short at my side.

> just out of interest,how would it do that,if he was not pulling and the straps were slack it would be like wearing a collar,>

Well if it is used for a dog that pulls to stop pulling it will put pressure under the armpits, and could affect the front.

If the dog doesn't pull then a collar will do the job.

My friend used it to stop her bitch pulling, and it made her previously well moving front go awful but after she stopped using it (went to a head collar) for a few months and the dog had the correct exercise she improved again.

ah i see, i often did wonder as i have heard people say this before,i just thought that if the dog was only pulling once in a blue moon it would not affect the front end,if the dog was pulling all the time then obviously it would.i just want something for safety sake,stan is a very obediant little man,but as i said,his strength is amazing,i dont want to let him down and by having some kind of walking aid,albeit a halti,gencon etc,its peace of mind that if he does all of a sudden out the blue pull,it will help me a little to stop that,as well as continuing to keep up with the training.he is very good,i just want to do my best for him,its all new to me being a newfie owner,and i love it,i have great respect for my stanley,every day he amazes me,he is a cracker
jo

The walkrite kind can put a dogs front out and spoil the movement for the ring.

If you undo the clips at the front and do them up left to right clip and right to left clip then the straps don't fit tight under the armpits. I use them when needed by my dogs if they are pulling too much and it hasn't affected their front movement. Showed my 7 year old at Crufts this year and he was place 3rd in his class. Mine is a breed that needs to move well.