wish you all the luck in world and fingers crossed you come back with some beautiful pups xx

Good Luck!!! Everything crossed.

Good luck then.i do hope all goes well for you and your bitch.im guessing she must be really uncomfortable and a bit fed up herself by now...

i hope when im finished my days work and i come back you have some good news for us and you can rest.x.x.

good luck from me to, fingers crossed we get some good news xxxxxx

Good luck from me too....fingers crossed all is well. Now I'm off back to continue the tanning lol Glorious day!!

I'm back alone. Both pups dead, one about four weeks, the other not long after. Maddie should be okay, still getting operated on. Wee soul, i suppose the only thing i, she won't know what she never had.

Sorry to hear about the pups but glad to that Maddie is going to be okay.

I'm so sorry to hear that :-(  it's not the right time now, but I think I would be having serious chats with your vet!

Give mum a gentle hug from me.

I am so, so sorry for you, and Maddie. Thank goodness the vet has got them out of her, and that you followed your gut instinct and took her  back. I must say tho', as it was only a couple of days ago that  the vet XRayed her, if the puppies had been dead for 4 weeks, i am surprised that the XRay did not show an abnormal growth. I know that this is going to sound very morbid, but, were you shown the puppies? I ask because, being naturally suspicious, l wonder if the vet is trying to cover her own back here, and the puppies, in fact, have only recently died. Give Maddie lots of cuddles from all of us. Once again, l am so very sorry.

No i didn't see anything, the skeletons i saw on xray looked fairly big, but only saw heads and spines? But the vet who xrayed did op? but also 2 days ago was apprehensive about op incase they weren't fully formed? Not making sense i know, but i knew my dates were right, they treat you as though you are stupid. Apparently she was full of poison too, so lots of ab's. Really gutted.

Sorry to hear about the puppies. Glad your girl is ok x

I'm so sorry, wish I had been wrong. Might be an idea to change vets. I have been through several vets recently until I found one I was happy with -my original one of many years died and it is actually much harder to find a vet that is good with breeders, than if you just have pets. Also if you have one with a scanner available at least you can check if there are heartbeats.

Terrano0, you are very lucky that you still have your girl. It could have been a whole lot worse. Maddie could have lost her life, as well as the puppies. You are absolutely right, some vets do treat you as idiots, although l was always extemely fortunate with my own vets, as they always listened to my input. As to the Xray, it doesn't surprise me that the vet who did it, also has done the operation. As you have not seen the pups, there is no way of knowing when they DID actually die. Maddie will need lots of TLC when she comes home. Love to you both. Josie

Im so sorry about whats happened terrano0
what a sad end to this post, as im sure everyone else will agree.
like jaycee said though it could of been a heck of a lot worse,but at least you've still got your girl
sending hugs your way take care xx kim

Oh dear Lord! I'm sooooo sorry :( As Myboo has already said, it's a very sad ending. My thoughts are with you & I wish your poor girly a speedy recovery. ((((( big hugs))))) xx LG

Thanks, i am lucky that Maddie is going to be okay, not got her back yet, my 14 yr old daughter was to keep a pup to start showing. I have the pleasure of telling her shortly. Def change vets! Will i mate her again??

If you mate her again, use the herpes vaccine and also antibiotics during the pregnancy. I did with my girl. Herpes jab twice, antibiotics 3 times, two scans and 2 palpatations by vet. It didn't have a perfect outcome, two of the pups died again but she did have a third live one. However as your girl had to have a c-section I'd think extra carefully. :(

im so so sorry to hear this but very glad your girl is ok xxx

What a shame Im glad I got dogs not bitches I was on the edge of my seat reading this one. I hope your bitch is fine and I'd change vets!

Oh I'm so sorry to hear that. :-( At least your girl is going to be ok.

This is very sad news, I'm too sorry for your loss. :(

I've never been in the position of having a litter after a c-section but I do know folk that have had sections and gone on to have normal litters afterwards, but I don't know if I would risk it if it were my own dog. I'd be worried about the same happening again.

I hope Maddie recovers quickly from her op.  xxx

If you mate her again, use the herpes vaccine. HERPES as in human herpes? is that a major cause in a fetus not reaching full term? i am wracking my brain as to why this has happened.

Really sorry to hear that sad news, have been following the thread, what a sad outcome.  But glad that Maddie is going to be okay - thinking of you.

Terrano0, when you mated her the 1st time, did she go over then, on time, or early? Josie

First mating she was a day over for the first mating.

Got my wee soul home, she looks so small. Gave her hugs from everyone. Thankyou all. No doubt i'll pop in from time to time.

HERPES as in human herpes? is that a major cause in a fetus not reaching full term?

No Canine herpes virus, and yes. Pups can either die before birth or soon after from it. There is no harm in using the vaccine even if the bitch isn't infected (which you won't know for sure). One injection is given around the time of mating, the other at around 7 weeks of pregnancy.

Oh i see! Coincidentally my daughter had her first cold sore 10 days after Maddie was mated, i take notes on most things. She is now plagued with them on her face. Def no link?? Okay, just googled it.

Im so sorry to read this about the pups......I was so excited for you:(

Glad Maddie is ok and thats the main thing.

((Hugs)) to all of you

What a sad and expensive time for you I am so sorry, glad they have saved your bitch and I hope her recovery is quick and complete

It's just as well we don't do these things for money, but for the love. She is feeling better, looking brighter now anyway. Well pampered.

oh so sorry i didnt realise i hadnt looked on page 3  you must be devastated but thank god your bitch is ok

Im so sorry to hear this after all this time we've all been following your thread.im glad to hear your girl is ok and like others have said it could have been so much worse and lose your bitch too...

my thoughts are with you.x.x.x

Had been away for a few day and looked in anticipation for a 'we have pups'.  so saddened not to see this.

Sorry for you and maddie but glad she survived.  My friend mated her bitch after a c-section, the vet reccommended she wait two years.  Recently had a very healthy litter of five with a trouble free bith, hope that offers some ressurance if you decide to try again.  She was also an excellent mum.

i would change vets.  Find it strange you didn't see them, like some else said could be covering their back and interviened earlier.

Big big hugs for you both and wish her a speedy recovery.

Yes Sunshine i know. I find it hard to believe they would do that, but then what's to stop them? I've got a check up today and i'll be asking questions now that i'm not so raw. Why no stethoscope?, why didn't she say xray showed 4 wk old fetus's?, and if pups died 5 weeks ago why did she still have milk, which i thought started to dry up on day of xray? Def change vets at next wormer dose. Just nedd to look about and ask them a few questions too.

What I don't understand (and certainly wouldn't be happy about) pups x-rays at day 66 would show full skeleton/skulls/limbs....whereas a pup that died at 4 weeks wouldnt' really show much at all, how can a vet miss the fact that these two little babies were no where near day 66 in x-ray and still let her continue waiting for her to whelp naturally?

the vet might not be very good when it comes to pregnent bitches and their whelps with the sound of things! glad you are changeing your vets.

I would be seriously worried if this was my girl.  If she has inertia it is an awful long time to leave her.  Having a breed prone to it, I'm afraid that I am used to telling the vet that I recognise it, and I want intervention.  I feel that my experience of breeding is probably better than theirs.  No offence to any vet here.

If a pup has died, then decompostion is fast, and I would be very worried about toxins.  But then, I would never leave a bitch this far over, and wouldn't even stop for a scan.  Just a quick x-ray and off to the operating room.

Don't like to worry people unduly, but I warned a newbie breeder last year about all the signs that should give an alert.  It was ages after that I found out her bitch didn't have enough hormones going to start contractions.  She let her go a whole week over (I was appalled), and she had a decomposing body in the birth canal.  I don't honestly know how the bitch survived it to be honest.

I wish you every luck, and hope you get this resolved and fast! 

So very, very sorry.  I posted without realising that there was a 3rd page.  You must be gutted.  I do hope that your girl is ok and recovers well.

Really sorry to hear this news. One of my girls had a c section and all 3 pups died.  I thought long and hard about breeding from her again and spoke to many breeders as well as vets and decided to try again. I was advised to mate her on her next season rather than wait to avoid scar tissue buildup. She went onto have 9 very healthy, robust puppies, natural birth with no intervention at all. Hope this helps.

If the pups died at 4 wks..wouldnt they have been absorbed again by the bitch or would she show signs of illness due to then decomposing....
I wouldnt be happy at seeing this vet again if it was my bitch.