My friend very recently had to have her DDB PTS due to massive liver faillier, that the pup had from birth (her DDB was 16 Months).  When she first bought the pup the breeder had told her that she had an umbilical hernia, she was not bought to breed but as a pet, but she has recelty been told by her vet that it was not an umbilical hernia but fluid collecting from her liver.  My friend had been taking the pup to vets cause she kept loosing weight and being sick after every meal.  The vets done various test which seem to go on for months, and finally told her last week it was liver failier,  she rang me in floods of tears and i advised that if she was slowly dieing then to do the right thing, which she has done.  She contacted the breeder as the vet had told her the the pups condition was herditary, when she told the breeder the breeder accused her of lying, the vets are doing her a report to send off to the kennel club, she doesnt want any money back from the breeder, or another dog from her, she has been told recently also that the mother of the pup has recently died of cancer!!  Has anyone got any ideas of what she can do??

Thanks

No one can second guess about a pups future health, cancer can run in families and liver problems be hereditary but unless the breeder knew that there was a problem in the breeding line there is not much your friend can do and the breeder may well be innocent of unethical breeding and the reaction was just one of shock.

Very sorry to hear about your friends loss but it may well be that no one is to blame, dogs like people can be struck down by unexpected health problems and it is unlikely that the cancer had anything to do with the liver failure. However if the breed is known to have problems with the liver perhaps both the breeder and the vet should have looked into the swelling on the pups abdomen sooner.

Id find out what lines the pup was and keep well clear of them in the future as its undoubtedly likely that others breeding also carry these lines, id inform the breed club as info like this is invaluable to a breed as a whole as some people don't like to admit or don't know that their dogs carry cancer, and it would give others within the breed an idea of what to look out for.

The only thing that the breeder could have done was stop breeding from the pups mother as they wouldn't want any future puppies to have any problems but as you have said the mother has died.

I wonder if there is a health test that can detect as there are quite a lot nowerdays, was the breeder in the ABS?

Hi,

It is reported that the breeder did know that there was cancer in her line, as the mother of the pups was diagnosed just before the litter was born, now the breeder is denying that the bitch she used is not the mother that had died of cancer and was another bitch, something just does not add up!!

She contacted the breeder as the vet had told her the the pups condition was herditary, when she told the breeder the breeder accused her of lying, the vets are doing her a report to send off to the kennel club,

I'd tread very carefully here. Vets very often do not know enough about breeding and genetics to be able to judge fairly, and even when they do, distraught owners often misunderstand. It can happen so easily. I've had that happen myself. For instance a vet can tell an owner a condition was congenital as it was there at birth and the owner then starts telling the breeder the vet says it's inherited. Nothing whatsoever to say a congenital condition is inherited. Far more information is needed. For instance what the actual condition is called, what type of liver failure?, and was there any way the breeder could have been able to tell it was not a hernia? The whole scenario sounds very strange to me. Also as far as cancer goes -yes cancer can have a genetic link but is can also have environmental links. Who's to say for certain what is what? It's so easy to blame the breeder when you're upset and a dog has died young, but in reality nothing is certain without ALL the facts.

There are no straightforward answers here.  The fact that the mother died of cancer doesn't mean very much, any animal can be struck down by various forms of cancer.  That is very different from there being "cancer in a line" which implies several generations of the same bloodline showing a propensity to developing cancer. 

The liver problem sounds like a separate problem, although the cause is not stated.  Did the vet know the cause? Possibly it could have been liver shunt, which is congenital (meaning it is present at birth) but doesn't show symptoms until months later.  There is thought to be a genetic link, as it does tend to affect certain breeds. There is a test that can be carried out on litters of pups to see if they suffer from liver shunt, and this has now been recommended in certain breeds. However, DDB is not one of them.

Regards the breeder, it is good that they have been informed of this occurrence, it would be more beneficial if the vet, instead of sending a report to the KC (not sure what this would achieve) could make the owner fully aware of all the details so that she could then give the breeder detailed information, for example if the vet really feels this was a hereditary defect and what backs this up.  If the breeder is responsible, she will look carefully at the future of that bloodline.

Very low sample size, but the average age of death for the DDB in the KC/BSAVA health survey was 3yrs 10 months. In a larger US survey it was five. Cancer (particularly lymphoma) and heart disease big killers, but many other conditions - including liver problems - are reported for this breed too. On top of that it's brachycephalic. Great characters with often terrific temperaments, but sadly this is not the breed to choose if you want a dog to grow old with.

The breed has suffered badly from the popularity prompted by being the Turner + Hooch dog. Prospective owners would do well to look carefully - horizontally as well as vertically - though pedigrees and to ask searching questions about the longevity of dogs featured in them.

Jemima

>The breed has suffered badly from the popularity prompted by being the Turner + Hooch dog.

I couldn't agree more. Every time a film is made featuring a particular breed, whether it's the 101 dalmatian films, or Turner & Hooch, or Snow Dogs, or Beethoven, the fallout for breed rescue 9 to 10 months later (when the 'cute' puppies have turned into horrible teenagers!) is dreadful. TV is no better than Hollywood in this respect, I'm afraid.

A friend recently had his young male pts because of kidney failure, was always something wrong with him many tests were done found out when it was too late. Thankfully my older two are already past the 3 yr 10 month, certain lines are known for longevity certain lines are known for the opposite. The heavier wrinklier being the later. I prefer the slower to mature dogs, fully grown at 14 months old causes many problems.

now the breeder is denying that the bitch she used is not the mother that had died of cancer and was another bitch, something just does not add up!!

Just sidelining here as this seems a strange one, surely the breeder knows which of her dogs has died? When you say it was reported that this pups mother died who reported it to you or your friend? Was it anyone reliable in contact with the actual breeder? Did the breeder firstly state the death on her website etc? You need to hear things from the horses mouth, people can say things to cause mischief sometimes or just get things completely wrong. But as already said cancer is not relevant to the problems of the pup.

It may well be that the breeder is unscrupulous and has not done the recommended health tests and is a BYB with no knowledge of their line, only your friend knows if she sourced her breeder properly and went to someone reputable.

I agree in making sure all facts are solid and not just acting on the emotions right now.

It is very, very, sad for your friend and even more so for the poor little pup. Your poor friend must be devastated.