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Topic Dog Boards / Breeding / Bitch does not seem to have enough milk!!
- By jokelly [gb] Date 22.04.10 12:49 UTC Edited 22.04.10 17:33 UTC
My bitch had 10 pups nearly a week ago.  We have lost 3 so are down to 7.  They are not gaining weight and I have had to start round the clock feeding.  She just doesn't seem to have much milk.  Drinking lots and eating lots.  Does anyone have any suggestions please?
- By dogsdinner [gb] Date 22.04.10 13:04 UTC
Bottle feeding is the answer which seems what you are doing.   Bitch and pups need checking by the vet to rule out possible infection.
- By jokelly [gb] Date 22.04.10 13:11 UTC
Both have been checked by the vet.  My bitch was very distressed by a pup which was not right and that pup was put down yesterday.  Wondered if the stress could have affested her milk production.
- By SharonM Date 22.04.10 13:47 UTC Edited 22.04.10 17:33 UTC
My bitch had 8 pups, her milk never came in at all, sadly we lost 3 too, but I managed to hand rear the rest, with mum doing the cleaning and toileting, is mum still interested in them?  I still let the pups suckle from mum even though she didn't have a drop of milk and she was happy for them to do it too.
- By Brainless [gb] Date 22.04.10 13:48 UTC
Certainly a distressed bitch may not let milk down.

Have the pups basically been on the bitch nonstop,a s demand and supply is how the milk process works.

With a  large litter like that a slow gain or a standstill for the first day or two may be likely, but after the third day there should have been a steady gain with most of the puppies, assuming they were suckling enough and efficiently.

Was the bitch natural (anaesthetic can make pups too sleepy to feed well, so no milk)  were they hydrated.

What you don't want is for bottle feeding to stop the bitches milk supply from establishing/increasing, so a balance needs to be struck.

If all pups are strong and healthy then the bigger ones are better fed by bottle once they have got the milk flowing from Mum and put the smaller ones on Mum.  Once those have fed the bigger greedier ones can be put back on too, to get more milk coming in.

If any pups are too weak to feed from Mum properly the  they will need to be topped up, fed by artificial means, but the main idea is to get them back onto Mum..
- By Fate [gb] Date 22.04.10 13:52 UTC
Yes I think the stress could very well have affected her milk production.  Whilst bottle feeding may be neccessary to "top up" it would be better to try and encourage mums milk production, any feeding off mum at all would be advantageous over purely bottle feeding, to you, pups and mum. Try and keep her calm and settled, you could try actually latching the pups on, say every hour, even if they don't suck for long, some sucking may stimulate hormones to start to encourage milk let down.  Sometimes if a bitch is stressed, she doesn't let them feed properly and the pups don't gain weight.  Weighing regularly is essential so you know if they're going in the right direction, good luck, they are a worry.
- By jokelly [gb] Date 22.04.10 14:04 UTC
Thank-you all.  I feel we are going in the right direction.  I am putting the pups on to Mum as often as possible and they are certainly getting a little from her - just not enough.  I know she has a bit as I can squeeze a little out but I think it's using up a great deal of their energy reserves getting some out.
- By Brainless [gb] Date 22.04.10 14:08 UTC
Don't expect to see much milk, it is the pups weight gain that should tell you.

I have had bitches with big boobs whose pups made average or even slow gain, and ones that were almost flat underneath, never bagging up whose pups did really well, obviously getting loads.
- By dogsdinner [gb] Date 22.04.10 14:36 UTC
Had a litter of 6, mother did not produce any or very little milk from day 1.   We left pups with her and she cleaned and kept them warm, and kept her happy, but we still bottle fed all 6 every 2 hours for the first week to make sure that they were receiving enough, then every 3 hours using a proprietary milk powder formulated for puppies.  They all survived.   We could not get mum to produce any more milk, regardless that she ate and drank well.   It was very hard work, especially during the night, but well worthwhile.   We started weaning them as soon as their eyes opened at 14 days, but also carried on with the bottle feeding, at which stage they were taking well, and we were getting through vast amounts of milk powder.

Wish you luck.
- By jokelly [gb] Date 22.04.10 15:18 UTC
I am using a small syringe at the moment - do you think I would be better using a bottle?  The one I bought from the vet had too much flow and the one I already had was too hard for them to suck!
- By dogsdinner [gb] Date 22.04.10 15:57 UTC
Premature baby's bottle with appropriate teat - mine managed very well, no trouble at all.  You can purchase these from the baby dept. at most Superstores (open all night).   You have to be a little careful, but they soon get the hang of it. 
- By Dill [gb] Date 22.04.10 16:07 UTC
Are you soaking mum's food? (if dry kibble ;) )  it needs to be really well soaked and she could be given puppy milk or home-made chicken stock (no salt) as well, which will encourage her to drink more.

If she really has little or no milk, then try making some FENNEL SEED tea (teaspoon to a cup of boiling water, allow to steep for 5 mins) this can make a huge difference, I soaked my bitches kibble with it and she went on to make enough milk with no problem.  (also used it myself after a 28 week caesarian ;) )
- By jokelly [gb] Date 22.04.10 19:02 UTC
Thanks everyone.  I was feeling a bit despondant - my first litter and the bitch's.  Am going to take all your advice and keep positive!!!!
- By white lilly [gb] Date 22.04.10 22:17 UTC
good luck ,yes stay positive x
- By SharonM Date 23.04.10 07:25 UTC
The Royal Canin puppy milk you can buy from your vet comes with a bottle with 3 different sized teats, which I found really good.  Think it was around £10
- By jokelly [gb] Date 23.04.10 11:53 UTC
had to have another one put down this morning :(.  Heartbreaking but hopefully the last 6 will stand a good chance now.  2 are really putting on weight but the other 4 are staying constant.  Feeding the recommended amount.  Any ideas?  Please!
- By toffeecrisp [gb] Date 23.04.10 12:13 UTC
Im so sorry about your pups. Fingers crossed the others will do much better.
No advice really apart from keep trying, which I know you are.
We had to handfeed one of ours..shes doing really well now though and at 5 wks is the instigater of the battles!!
I got a lot of great advice from everyone here...hang in there your doing great.

Debs
- By dogsdinner [gb] Date 23.04.10 19:45 UTC
Sorry to hear that you have had lost another puppy.   Hope the other 6 thrive.   If you can get them to 2 weeks you will be over the worse.  Let us know how it goes.
- By white lilly [gb] Date 23.04.10 21:32 UTC
sorry to hear this :( . i do hope the 6 babys make it x
- By jokelly [gb] Date 26.04.10 13:50 UTC
Thank you all for your advice over the weekend.  I think my bitch may have started to produce some milk as the pups certainly have little round tums and don't really want what I am offering them.  Yippee!!
- By toffeecrisp [gb] Date 26.04.10 13:55 UTC
Thats fantastic news...well done you though for keeping these little ones going.
Good luck and I hope its a bit easier from now on:)
- By LucyDogs [gb] Date 26.04.10 14:28 UTC
Brilliant!
- By minnie mouses [gb] Date 26.04.10 14:33 UTC
Well done & good luck Jokelly
- By dogsdinner [gb] Date 26.04.10 15:27 UTC
Great news - hope it all goes well for you.
- By white lilly [gb] Date 26.04.10 17:20 UTC
thats wonderful news :) well done x
Topic Dog Boards / Breeding / Bitch does not seem to have enough milk!!

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