Further to the post about bloat and its prevention etc I have just watched the trailhounds on Countryfile. They ran about 10 miles in roughly 40 minutes and as soon as the crossed the finish line they were all fed and watered (albeit tea!) so I can only assume there are no problems with bloat there?

Do hounds have a bloat issue in general? just wondering, as of course if they caught anything on a hunt it would get eaten - maybe just a few mouthfuls per dog though, if lucky.

> Do hounds have a bloat issue in general?

Realise our two couldn't get round the course in quite that time - let alone over the walls! But in ans to your question, yes some do, Bassets are particularly prone.

> They ran about 10 miles in roughly 40 minutes and as soon as the crossed the finish line they were all fed and watered (albeit tea!) so I can only assume there are no problems with bloat there?

I wonder if fitness plays a part in staving off bloat in such dogs?
Accordning to lots on info on bloat, stress can also be factor. The effects of stress & heavy excersize must be pretty similar to the body. I would imagine an unfit dog that has just been excercised will require much longer to re-coup into a rested state than a very fit dog would.

> But in ans to your question, yes some do, Bassets are particularly prone.

Sorry if this sounds a bit controversial and no offence intended, but.... Working bassets or the show type? I'm sure I'm not alone in wondering if the further dogs get away from their original purpose the more things like bloat may arise... Or is that too simplistic?

> Working bassets or the show type?

Ms Temeraire, no offence taken!  Show type, the older didn't get his owner back to Crufts so sold on, having said that neither of them is heavily coated and both kept on the lean side. English bassets have longer legs, but it is hard to believe that many of those which to me struggle to get round the show ring, were once bred to be out in the field for five/six hours. I don't have the knowledge to suport what you have to say regarding - the further dogs get away from their original purpose, the more things like bloat may arise - but it does strike me that there is more than an element of truth in it. Sad but not unusual for people to stop us and ask 'Can it run'!

My (thankfuly limited) experience of bloat suggest's its alot to do with the build, deep chested dogs seem more prone than light narrow chested dogs, The trail hounds I've seen have been fairly lightly built.

Adam

> deep chested dogs seem more prone than light narrow chested dogs

So I understand, but it doesn't explain why a BH that was originally bred to give chase for many hours should now be so prone. But then I imagine as they were used as an aid to those hunting and following on foot they would not have been allowed to eat what they eventually caught.

>My (thankfuly limited) experience of bloat suggest's its alot to do with the build, deep chested dogs seem more prone than light narrow chested dogs,

Bloat is something to be aware of in dalmatians, which are very much middle-of-the-road structurally, so foxhounds, trailhounds etc would theoretically be equally at risk.

Bloodhounds are also very prone to bloat, bassets are too but if you want to raise the point about bassets changing so much over the years and becoming heavier as being the cause I dont agree. Bloodhounds have not changed in hundreds of years and they suffer from bloat. This condition only seems to have become common in deep chested breeds since we have had complete food. I had a chat once with a lady who used to be a BH breeder many, many years  ago in the 40's & 50's  she told me that this condition was unheard of and then as dogs werent fed complete  food as it didnt exist..they were fed mixer biscuit which  was just plain with none of the additives we see today and table scraps, her hounds were healthy and well never had a single case of bloat or any skin problems.

Also watched Countryfile and it left me wondering.

They were not rested before being fed and watered.  The handlers/owners used buckets of food containing meat, pasta, etc, and tea, each owner/trainer had their own favourite concoction, and as soon as the hound put its head over the finish line they were immediately fed and given tea to drink, they did not have time to even get their breath back!!

I also wondered, as when we have exercised our dogs, they are not fed or watered for at least an hour.   I would consider that mine are fit, and are very active (Flatcoats).

I would also say that they would have to be stressed, as they were pretty hyper just before setting off.   I would also consider them to be large dogs, well boned, not heavy, but muscular.

An opportunity maybe for someone to do some research.

I have often wondered about bloat, let's face it wolves run for miles and miles in pursuit of prey then devour vast quantities. Do they get bloat? I don't know the answer but would be interested to know.

Have had Flatcoats for approx 33 years and it was not until recently that I have had a case of bloat in my dogs. 

Although I consider mine fit, they would not be expected to cover 10 miles in 30-40 minutes.   Wonder if it is the muscle mass that stops these hounds from developing bloat.   Possibly the muscle holds all the internal organs tight, and stops them from moving around.  That is considered to be one of the reasons why deep chested dogs develop bloat, the  organs have too much room to move around in.The other is genetics, possibly there is an inherited factor involved, I understand that research has just begun on this.

Taking the genetic factor further, if these hounds developed bloat they would not be fit to do the job and therefore possibly would not be in a breeding programme.

All food for thought.

> I have often wondered about bloat, let's face it wolves run for miles and miles in pursuit of prey then devour vast quantities. Do they get bloat? I don't know the answer but would be interested to know.

Me too, but do you think that perhaps it is due to the fact that they don't eat every day and when they do catch their prey as you say can devour a vast amout. So perhaps they then don't move very far whille they digest it?

I think there might be something in the muscle therory. The hounds and wolves are very fit so this may explain it. I also noticed the difference in food fed to the dogs.

Adam

> I think there might be something in the muscle therory.

Was having a google on bloat earlier and came accross a paper on the subject that sugested muscle tome may be why some dogs do not suffer from bloat- but I forgot to save it I'll have another look because it does back up that thoery.

That may be why older dogs/and those with underlying other health conditions are more prone to bloat because they are not so fit and the muscles would not be so toned.

I lost my super fit weimeraner(6yrs old) last year to what the vets said was one of the worst cases they had seen. He ran a minumum of 6 miles per day, was never fed within 2hours of exercise and was a very light eater who grazed his food so never had a 'full' stomach.
Hi torsion took 2 full days to show itself(showing VERY few symptoms)- by which time his stomach had twisted 360 degrees. His heart couldnt take it and he was pts after having 2 major heart attacks the day after surgery.

My point is that i strongly believe that bloat or torsion has a much 'deeper' cause than just the feeding/watering after/before exercise. It needs more research as to causes. Im not saying that feeding and watering with exercise is not a contributing factor in some dogs, but as my dogs death proves it can be caused by other things- things that arent yet fully understood. More needs to be done to stop thses horrendous deaths that take so many, so young.

woah, sorry. Rant over!

Interesting point about the muscle tone..but I agree with Qwerty why on earth isnt more research being done on this awful condition..it seems that vets/scientists dont seem to be doing enough to find out exactly what causes it?? Considering how common it is now in a lot of breeds and having lost a dog to it myself last year I cannot for the life of me understand why this condition isnt being investigated in more detail.  

Further to the programme being shown and off-topic re bloat: I just read on another forum that Trailhound rescue have been inundated with enquiries following the show. They are such a little known breed, that the rescue has been floundering for homes til now - so great stuff! Lets hope they can find some suitable homes for them.

Off topic as well but I have ALWAYS wanted a Foxhound....one day.

me too!
I love looking at the dazzleby girls and wishing!!...one day!

I was always taught bloat is more common when fed/watered first then walked (like humans getting a stitch). We have always walked then fed/watered straight away (smaller quantities) and had no problem with deep chested HPR breeds and sled dogs.

Our only bloat issue came with drinking sea water.

as a hound owner and someone whose show hounds are also working hounds., and also as someone that works with pack hounds, I can assure you that bloat does occur in working packs all the time. I dont watch CF as its so much cr*p and so much townie based hype that I cant bear to watch it and all its inaccuracies, but if they were feeding after such excercise, then more fool them:(  Any breed can bloat, and ive known it in small terriers upwards.