Hello.  I'm after some opinions please.

We recently lost our elderly labrador :( and we are left with our gorgeous 4 year old cocker spaniel who is clearly missing his playmate.  We have a cat who is good friends with the spaniel, but can't rough and tumble play, or tug a piece of rope with him.  We have 3 children aged 8, 14 and 17 all of whom very much want another dog, but the youngest child particularly wants a dog that he feels will be 'his' .. he wants to walk it, feed it, play with it and wants it to be 'his'.  The dogs we have had have always bonded most firmly with me.  The cocker spaniel sleeps in my room etc. and although he adores the children, it is me that he wants to be with the most.  I would like to have a pup that my son can have a chance of bonding firmly with in this way, so it needs to be a dog that he will be able to manage at puppy training classes, on the lead etc.

I am looking at breeds and at the moment am considering another cocker spaniel; a beagle; a small labradoodle; petit or grand basset vendeen.  I wonder if anyone has an opinion on which of these might be most likely to fit it to our family best, given what I have said above.  I'm also openminded to a rescue but I do want a puppy.  My cocker spaniel came from a breeder, but before him, over the years we have given homes to 3 other dogs all of whom were rescues (1 puppy and 2 as adult dogs).  Our garden is fenced in and we live near a park.  Exercise will usually involve off lead romps in the park or on a nearby beach.  Our house is noisy, busy and sociable.  Any ideas?  I'm obviously reading about different breeds, but it would be good to hear from people who perhaps have lived with these breeds. Thankyou.

At 8 years old I would have thought a Cavalier would be ideal.  Won't be as strong as the others on your list, and an ideal size for your son.

They normally get on well with other breeds, and they're lovely friendly dogs.

Thank you.  A friend of mine has cavaliers, and they are very sweet, but seem rather delicate.  I'm not sure they'd be robust enough for our lifestyle e.g. I can't see one tearing along the beach in the persuit of seagulls with our cocker spaniel, or rolling around in the sand with him. My 8yo is nearly 9 and is tall and strong for his age - he can manage our cocker spaniel on the lead easily enough.  Our walks do tend to involve quite a lot of water, mud, ball chasing etc.

How about a Welsh Springer, the ones I have known love children and a busy household, and adore water, mud and chasing seagulls on beaches. The size is about right for your son to handle.
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General Character And Temperament    Welshies have all the soft-eyed faithfulness of the other spaniels and are totally devoted to their families. They are high-spirited, good-natured companions. They are people-orientated dogs but can be a bit reserved with strangers. However, they will never show any aggression. They mix well with children and other household pets. They are family dogs and need company.

You have gundogs and hounds in your list.  It may be worth having a good read of general traits to establish which group you want to choose from.  A Labradoodle is a cross breed as I'm sure you know. 

If you are considering a cross breed it's well worth asking yourself whether you'd have a poodle and whether you'd have a labrador.  If the answer to either of those questions is yes, then it may be better to choose a purebred of either breed.  You can be more sure of what you are getting, and incidentally you won't be charged grossly inflated prices for the current fashionable cross.

Gundogs can make great family dogs and you have a very good range of type, coat and size in this group.

Hounds - I have a soft spot for a number of scent hounds in this group but wouldn't be willing to take the risk that I might lose one to an exciting smell!  Living where we do it could be in the next county before I've turned round :)

Something from the Terrier group could be an option.  We got a terrier cross when my son was a similar age to yours.  We have pictures of 'one boy and his dog go adventuring'.  My two went rock climbing, swimming, walking and sledging together - still do.  Mind you my terrrier cross has pretty good recall which is a bonus and not true of all of them!

Don't forget that, as you are the primary carer, any dog will be well cued in to you.  However, with the right sort of work it should respond to your son as well, particularly if he takes it to classes.  You can look at breeds at the KC site here.  Good luck

 

Thanks for your replies.
With regards the labradoodle question - yes I'd have a labrador (our 12 year old that died recently was a labrador that we had as a rescue aged 4), and no I probably wouldn't have a poodle.  What appeals with a mini labradoodle is the smaller size so that my son could handle it better on the lead, the coat that *may* shed less than my moulty old labrador did (couldn't shed more), and if I'm honest, the cute look.

With regards hounds, I've never owned one, but what I've read about beagles all sounds promising.  I guess I'm slightly nervous of having a hound for the reason you mention i.e. that the dog chases the scent and ignores me.  The park that we exercise our dogs in most of all, does have squirrels and no doubt other creatures in there.  I've never had a problem with recall and a dog before, and don't really believe I would, but as I say, I've never had a hound.  On paper, the beagle looks like a lovely companion dog for a child and for our cocker spaniel, but I don't know anyone who has got that mix and would be interested to know if anyone has, how they get on.

My best ever dog was a terrier cross.  He was a dog we had from a dogs home years ago - he'd been abandoned there twice because of dog aggression, but it was actually insecurity and trying to protect his owners.  Once he figured out that we'd protect him and that he didn't need to protect us, he was fabulous and we adored him.  If I could have another dog the same as him, I would do so in a heart beat, but I don't know what he was.  We were told that they thought he was an airdale cross and he may have been.  He had the colouring of a german shepherd and was the size of a small sturdy labrador, very strong and very loyal, with the most intelligent eyes and a very gentle nature.

As it stands now, I would consider a terrier of some sort but am not sure which sort, especially with our cat who is used to friendly dogs.  I wouldn't want a very small yappy type, it would have to be the more intelligent, gentle, loyal type - but which would that be? lol.  What you describe as your 'one boy and his dog go adventuring' is exactly what my son is hoping for.

I know a dog will be cued in to me, but I plan to help my son to be the pup's primary care giver whilst they establish their bond, though I know it won't be easy.

Welsh springer ... hmm... a possibility yes, but not sure.  I fostered one for a rescue once and it was very hyperactive, though hadn't had any training at all.  Lovely nature though yes.  I think if we were going to go for another spaniel though, we'd go for another cocker spaniel.

I wouldn't consider a beagle if you want a dog that you can let off the lead and will come back to you with reliability :)

Daisy

What about a border terrier?

>If I could have another dog the same as him, I would do so in a heart beat, but I don't know what he was.  We were told that they thought he was an airdale cross and he may have been.  He had the colouring of a german shepherd and was the size of a small sturdy labrador, very strong and very loyal, with the most intelligent eyes and a very gentle nature.

With the exception of the airedale bit - this sounds exactly like mine!!  Like you I would worry about getting another as good although, ironically, my boy is the image of one I had as a child.  I'd describe my mongrel as a Disney Rubbish Bin Dog - the sort of dog they'd cast as the local scruffian, with a heart of gold.  He and my son would go off clean, then emerge from a ditch looking like a bog monsters.  He's a gent actually!  However a few friends who hoped to get themselves a 'Finn' at their local rescue have been disappointed so it's obviously not that easy to find a good un.

Terrier rescue is an interesting site - they are very honest about the dogs in their care, and it makes a refreshing change.

My other dog is a Wirehaired Vizsla (I wanted to know exactly what I was getting this time).  On a walk he's mine, at home when watching TV he's snuggled up with my now 14 year old son.

> As it stands now, I would consider a terrier of some sort but am not sure which sort,

Welsh Terrier would be an excellent size for your son,a and I rather like the Irish terrier, but understand they can be quite fiery.

The Airedales I have met have been lovely dogs, but again a big dog, and I personally adore Border Terriers, from good breeding really nice family dog.

> As it stands now, I would consider a terrier of some sort but am not sure which sort, especially with our cat who is used to friendly dogs. I wouldn't want a very small yappy type, it would have to be the more intelligent, gentle, loyal type - but which would that be? lol.

Have you thought about a Soft Coated Wheaten Terrier? They don't moult, love children, are medium in size, can live with cats if bought up with them, good with other dogs and they are also calmer than most of the terriers. By reading what you're after in a dog, they could be an option for you :)

ETA: They do however need regular grooming, 10 minutes combing every couple of days is what I do with my Wheatens.

call me biased (I am very privileged to share my life with 3), but Roxylady is right, Welsh Springers are fabulous dogs with good brains, no jealousies, like company (especially other spaniels), have an excellent sense of humour and as much love as any human being can handle. They can take a good run out (we had three hours in the woods and swimming in the river today) and are happy to sleep it off as long as they can be near you.

Sarah beat me to it, I was also going to suggest Soft Coated Wheatens. They are not scrappy, are a bigger terrier and are always happy to join in with family fun; we have 4 and I wouldn't have any other breed!! There is someone in the breed that have Wheatens and spaniels.

Good Luck with your choice, research is vital and speaking to owners who will be honest about the good and the bad points.

Thank you :-)  I'm now off to read up about wheatens.  I totally agree about research being vital and am very grateful to you all for helping me in this aspect. x

I don't have one, but have to say that for me from the Terrier Group, it would have to be a Border. We have had loads come through our puppy classes and all have made great family companions. They have all been very trainable and are definitely robust enough to be a great pal for your son. Two years ago a friend asked a similar question and are now the proud owner of a Border. He goes mountain biking with the husband, is shown by the daughter and my friend is now having a go at agility. He fulfills all the families needs and is a great companion.

I've just been reading up and looking at pictures and videos of the wheaten terriers - they look absolutely gorgeous, but I'm a bit concerned that the grooming requirement may be a bit high, though will look more tomorrow.  Will look at the border terriers now too, thanks.

>A friend of mine has cavaliers, and they are very sweet, but seem rather delicate.  I'm not sure they'd be robust enough for our lifestyle e.g. I can't see one tearing along the beach in the persuit of seagulls with our cocker spaniel, or rolling around in the sand with him.

Cavaliers were originally bred as working gundogs, so to think of one as delicate made me laugh :-p The one I used to live with worked along with our Enlish Springer. She used to be the one that would be in the bushes flushing the birds/rabbits for the Springer to try to catch. :-) (Or my OH to shoot) They are sturdy little dogs and can put up with an awful lot of rough and tumble. A great dog for a child.

I suppose we do form opinions based on the actual characters we have met don't we. 

'd go for Cavalier or Border Terrier, have known a few SCWT's with temperament problems later on in life.

Im going to be really biased here now and suggest a Parson Russell Terrier.  They are a great dog and as long as bought from a reputable breeder have a great temperament.  I always describe them as a big dog in a little body as they will take any amount of exercise you can give them and are a very loyal dog.

I don't want a Cavalier.  I know they are very sweet dogs and my friend adores hers, but they are not for us.  A border terrier might be a possibility though I think I am leaning towards either another cocker spaniel or a mini labradoodle.  Thanks.

> I've just been reading up and looking at pictures and videos of the wheaten terriers - they look absolutely gorgeous, but I'm a bit concerned that the grooming requirement may be a bit high,

Wheaten terriers do need tons of grooming-so do labradoodles-although a labradoodle might suit you as regards temperament providing it came from a decent breeder(and make sure all the health tests are done if you decide to get a labradoodle-lots of unscrupulous breeders out there).Border terriers are great little dogs.I agree a beagle might be a bit independent as might be the PBGV and GBGV.

A parson russell terrier : do you have one of those yourself?  Where we exercise dogs is a big park with trees, streams etc. (not a playpark).  There are lots of squirrels, ducks on the pond etc. and most of the dogs are let off lead.  Do you think a parson russell terrier would just vanish in this environment?  A few people have lost jack russells around here (even if temporarily) because they've chased after squirrels or rabbits.  I want whatever dog we have to be more interested in playing with a ball with my son, or running through the bushes, paddling in the stream etc. with him, than chasing after some other furry smell.  Also, as most of the dogs in the park or on the beach run around off lead, being sociable and enjoying that sort of play is important too.

Thank you :-)

The parson russell terriers I know do have recall issues.If you have plenty of time and want an active trainable dog that loves playing with a ball a working cocker might suit you.

Surprised to read this " have known a few SCWT's with temperament problems later on in life, " almost of unheard of in my experience (13 yrs in breed)

I would say that I feel more emphasis should be made of the grooming and maintenance of trimming, ear care etc etc.

Good Luck with whatever you choose.  

> a labradoodle might suit you as regards temperament providing it came from a decent breeder

bit of an oxymoron in my opinion.

As Poodles and Labradors have very different characters, bit hard to predict what you might end up with, ditto for physical attributes.

Be better to choose an adult crossbreed as you can see what you have got.

Yes I do have PRTs and have found them to be very good off lead, they are usually very toy and food orinated and therefore as long as I have a ball or food in my pocket they are not a problem.  I cant see them being any different in the environment you are talking about than any other breed of terrier.  They dont need a lot of grooming and are a really rough and tough little dog.

If you want to see my dogs pm me and I will send you a link to my website.

I've only see one Labradoodle that looked anything like how they are supposed to i.e. bit like a SWD LOL!  He was absolutely stunning, extremely friendly though maybe a bit full on.

I've sen all varients of this cross and they all have looked entirely different and many I wdn't have guessed their cross at all.

I've also seen many Labradoodles, not one is alike from another. Some are the 1st crossing and others are further on down the line, all with very very different characters and above all, they all shed!!! - Labrador type shedding!!!
I would say have a look at the Poodle's, read up about them and then decide if you'd like anything in their character as tbh this is what you may end up with!! If Poodle's don't appeal then i don't see how a cross of one would??

I've also not known any 'breeders' who health tests the parents of this cross..

First off I'd say that you can't force a bonding between a dog and a particular member of the family. They make their own choices... Your other dogs have undoubtedly bond best with you because you are 'the one', and your 8-yr-old might not be - however much he wants the dog to be his.

If you go for a rescue, I'd really advise against a pup - unless you have a full history on the parents (which is not usual). It might be worth considering a slightly older rescue dog, though. A good rescue/experienced dog person will have a good idea of what a young dog will make by the age of 6-9 months - an age at which basic temperament is evident and yet still young enough to be puppyish, trainable re the cat, fun to take to classes and perhaps a better age to introduce to a 4-yr-old cocker (am presuming he's pretty lively).

I would not recommend a beagle - likely to be too independent. On balance, I think I'd recommend a small lab or - if a rescue - perhaps a lab/spaniel or small collie x (again only through an experienced rescue).

Jemima

I do know what you mean about the unpredictability of what I'd get with a labradoodle, and that of course concerns me.  I've been reading all day, and can see that the whole labradoodle area is a minefield full of unscrupulous people trying to make money, but I think there are probably people who are breeding them conscientiously and carefully too ... I just need to find them.  I'm a bit appalled at the cost too ... I don't mind paying someone a reasonable amount of money for breeding carefully, doing health checks etc. but not a ridiculous amount of money.  I can see why some are opposed to the idea of labradoodles.

I don't think they do all shed though - from what I've read today, some will shed a lot, as you say, just like a labrador, and others will shed a little whilst others will not shed at all. There seem to be plenty of the large ones around, including in rescue :( but I'd be looking for a small one where it's a labrador mother and a small poodle father (not a standard poodle).  I'm going to keep on looking at different breeds.  Thanks. :)

> cocker spaniel; a beagle; a small labradoodle; petit or grand basset vendeen. <

I think I would go with a cocker spaniel or a Cavalier King Charles, and both these breeds are quick to learn and do not grow too big. As another poster said hounds can be unreliable on recall if something else gets their attention. A labrador x poodle commonly referred to as a labradoodle is a cross bred dog and as such you simply cannot tell what size you are going to get, whether they will favour the poodle half of the parentage or the labrador half, so you would have the same problems as choosing a crossbred puppy from a rescue, so if I was going to have a cross bred dog then I would go to a rescue, as you can get a slightly older dog or puppy and get a true idea of the size it will grow into. The other advantage of taking on a rescue is it will give another homeless dog a lovely forever home.

Hi Jemima
Sorry, I don't know how to quote things in messages.  I know I can't force a bonding between a dog and my 8year old, but I can encourage it, which is my intention. :)  That's partly why I am looking carefully at breeds, in case there is a breed that might be more likely to choose him to be 'the one'. 

If it was just me I was getting another dog for, I'd go to a local rescue and choose an adult dog with the eyes that spoke to me, and it would almost certainly be some kind of heinz57 mongrel, but of course, it's not just me.

My cocker spaniel is quite lively yes, but not hyperactive e.g. we can take him for a nice long walk/run and then when he comes home, he'll flake out on the sofa/lap/bed for a while.  As I'm typing this, my kids are watching a movie on TV and the cocker spaniel is fast asleep on the floor next to my eldest.   I believe the cocker spaniel will accept any dog/puppy because he's so sociable himself when we are out and about but isn't a pest to other dogs, plus he's been used to living with another dog all his life, and she was the boss.

I know what you mean about not getting a pup from a rescue and why, which is also why I'm on here asking about different breeds :) because on this occasion, it will be a puppy that we get.  I'm not in a mad rush though, we'll take the time to make sure we get it right.

Hi Polly

I don't want a cavalier king charles, but am considering another cocker spaniel, definitely.  If we did get a labradoodle we'd get one of the smaller ones which they call mini labradoodles, where the mother is a labrador and the father is a small poodle (not a standard poodle), which means the size would be between poodle and labrador, so unlikely to be too big, though admittedly could be as big as a labrador. I am hearing what people are saying about labradoodles and am reading about them too. 

I know what you're saying about rescues, and have done that in the past, but don't really want a slightly older dog or older puppy, we do want a young puppy.  Raising a puppy is a very special experience as anyone who has ever done it knows, and all being well, it's unlikely that we'll have another dog join our family whilst my son is still a child/young.  I think he is the perfect age for the magical experience of raising and bonding with a puppy.  He's serious about looking after it, and is 'practising' by doing those things for our spaniel now :)

Personally, i would go for a female show type cocker spaniel.  Please bear in mind though, there are never any guarantees that your 4 yr old cocker will immediately accept/bond/play with any puppy.  It may take many months or even longer before he will accept another dog in the home, regardless of how friendly he is when out for walks.

The bonding with your son may or may not happen....with mine the bond is with myself first & OH is next in line.  I do think its whoever mainly feeds/walks/train with them that creates the stronger bond.  So you could work it that your son does this with the new puppy to build this bond.

Hi Wendy
I know there aren't any guarantees, but I can't see any reason why he would not bond with another puppy in the home.  He's not at all territorial, and we have had people visit with their dogs and it's been fine. I think he'd be delighted to be honest as he's clearly missing our labrador :(  With regards the bonding, my son has already agreed to to the feeding, walking, training :)

I should perhaps add, that he's a show type himself.  (blue roan - which I've been told are the friendliest though I can't see what the colour has to do with anything so perhaps that's stuff and nonsense ;)  )

What does the son himself like ?   I know you can't give an 8 year old the final say but if it is to be "his" dog then really it has to be "his" choice - within limits.  

Of course if you can manipulate "his" choice to be the same as yours so much the better !

> What does the son himself like ?   I know you can't give an 8 year old the final say but if it is to be "his" dog then really it has to be "his" choice - within limits.   <br /><br />Of course if you can manipulate "his" choice to be the same as yours so much the better !

Think I just found the quote button :)  He likes what he's read about the beagle, and that's what he's said he'd like.  They do sound like lovely companions for children, my concern is simply the off lead bit.  My son wants to be able to take 'his dog' for walks in the park opposite our house, on his own. This is quite difficult to explain in such a way that wouldn't make me seem completely irresponsible, but it's not a flat park, and it's not busy.  From my front room window, I can see the park (there are no houses opposite) ... I can see trees, a big bank, and bushes, and beyond that is a large flat field, a quarry, and then streams, ponds etc. He wants to be able to play in and around the bit opposite our house with 'his dog', making dens etc.  so my concern is that if he had a beagle, the beagle might prefer to chase the squirrels than play in the bushes with my son.

It will be 'his' choice ... sort of :)  Once we do decide on a breed, and then find a good breeder, I will of course take him with me to 'choose' his puppy ... or to let a puppy choose him :) 

Cavaliers are pretty sturdy really - mine have done 5-8 mile walks (when adults and fit) with hubby with no trouble. And my friend who bred my boy could tell you dozens of stories about how hers all tear around the beach rolling in the sand (or the dead seagulls). One of hers recently flushed a roe deer stag and nearly drove him right at my friend! But if you don't fancy a Cav, why not go with another cocker, if your present one is the sort of dog you like? :-)

>Thank you.  A friend of mine has cavaliers, and they are very sweet, but seem rather delicate.  I'm not sure they'd be robust enough for our lifestyle e.g. I can't see one tearing along the beach in the persuit of seagulls with our cocker spaniel, or rolling around in the sand with him. My 8yo is nearly 9 and is tall and strong for his age - he can manage our cocker spaniel on the lead easily enough.  Our walks do tend to involve quite a lot of water, mud, ball chasing etc.

I think we probably are leaning most towards another cocker, but I wanted to consider other breeds too.  Truth be told, another cocker spaniel would probably be the one that's most suitable to pretty much all that I've said except that deeper instinctive intelligence that a labrador seems to have, that I miss.

Two of my children now have their own dogs, the eldest had his at 9 and my daughter at 81/2.  My main breed is the Large Munsterlander and as much as we would of liked one for my son, we felt that this wasn't the right breed for him.  After much consideration we decided on a NSDTR (Toller) and neither my son or us as parents have been disappointed.  My daughter we felt could cope with a Munsterlander and her dog is now 1 year old.  I was concerned about the bonding as I'm the main person responsible for the day to day care of the dogs and am around more than the children.  They do feed and walk the dogs with me when time permits, sometimes its easier for me to do this, for example when the evenings are dark.  They both attend the training classes for ringcraft and odedience, and the Toller has now started agility.  I try to support the training that they are doing but step back from actually do it for them, it is hard not to step in sometimes!  The result is that the dogs have a very strong bond with their respective owners.

Just thinking about your comment about how you would choose a rescue could the same not apply to your boy ?
Would he beable to select an appropriate rescue he bonded with that of course assuming you would feel able to take on a rescue. Not something I have felt able to do yet
Have met a couple of tollers one walks regularly with us  and seems to be a great smallish dog , fun and with intelligence and nice temperament

> Hi Wendy
> I know there aren't any guarantees, but I can't see any reason why he would not bond with another puppy in the home.  He's not at all territorial, and we have had people visit with their dogs and it's been fine. I think he'd be delighted to be honest as he's clearly missing our labrador :-(  With regards the bonding, my son has already agreed to to the feeding, walking, training :-)
>
> I should perhaps add, that he's a show type himself.  (blue roan - which I've been told are the friendliest though I can't see what the colour has to do with anything so perhaps that's stuff and nonsense ;-)  )

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Puppies can be a bit much for adult dogs, especially the initial biting stage.  Our male, (although he was very friendly with other dogs whilst out walking), did not like my female puppy when she first arrived.  It took over a year before he accepted her, instead of pretending she didn't exist.  Now they are older, at 5 & 6, they absolutely adore each other.

It must be really hard for you all, with missing your labrador.  I am only saying this because its not always an immediate 'bed of roses' & would hate to think you end up disappointed that your 4 yr old dog doesn't bond with a puppy immediately.  It can sometimes take time.

I don't think the colour makes a difference to their personality...its more about which breed line's they are from...behaviour probs can be carried down the line.  Its more important to find a reputable breeder that you trust & to meet the prospective parents/ask loads of questions/expect the breeder to ask you about the care of the puppy.  Also make sure, if you do go for a show type cocker, that they have done PRA/FN/BVA/KC health tests.  Good Luck with your decision. x

> He likes what he's read about the beagle, and that's what he's said he'd like.&nbsp; They do sound like lovely companions for children, my concern is simply the off lead bit

Topsy. Beagles are fantastic, but as part of the scent hound family as others have mentioned - recall can be a problem. Everyone says their dogs sniff and follow a scent but until you live with a scent hound you don't perhaps appreciate how it dominates their every day life. I've been saddened by the amount of owners I've met, beagles & bassets who never let theirs of lead.  Be grateful if it gives chase to a squirrel (they go up trees) not mile after mile for something you can't even see. I always 'attempt' to know where mine are and don't walk on if I don't. Locally people think they are both called biscuit! They will recall and I'm not a total failure but it is constant work in hand. Good luck with your choice

Thank you for this encouraging comment :)

I am possibly being overly optimistic, but I genuinely think he will be fine.  When he joined our family as an 8 week old pup, our labrador was incredibly gentle with him ... I will never forget her picking up the tiniest little stick and prodding him with it, encouraging him to play with her, and teaching him how to behave, never once growling at him but once butting him gently and once holding him down, again very gently.  I guess he was taught by a beautifully natured dog, and yes, I miss her very much :(    It is wise to be cautious, but over the years I have introduced cats and dogs to our family at different ages and it has always taken care and patience but has never been difficult or not worked, so I am hopeful :)

> Just thinking about your comment about how you would choose a rescue could the same not apply to your boy ?<br />Would he beable to select an appropriate rescue he bonded with that of course assuming you would feel able to take on a rescue. Not something I have felt able to do yet

Um... my experience of rescue is that it would not really be as simple as that.  I could possibly do this with younger puppies, but an older pup or young dog is likely to have had a difficult start in life, and may need a different sort of owner than a child.   Does that make sense?  I won't rule it out and will take a look at our local rescues.

> Two of my children now have their own dogs, the eldest had his at 9 and my daughter at 81/2.  My main breed is the Large Munsterlander and as much as we would of liked one for my son, we felt that this wasn't the right breed for him.  After much consideration we decided on a NSDTR (Toller) and neither my son or us as parents have been disappointed.

Thank you for your reply. It's encouraging to hear of another family where the child has their own dog and has bonded with them.  I don't know anything about either of your breeds but will take a look at them too.  Is the Toller as big as a labrador or smaller?  Thanks :)

> If it was just me I was getting another dog for, I'd go to a local rescue and choose an adult dog with the eyes that spoke to me,

Then why not do th same with your son, but look at adult bitches (so likely to be fine with your cocker boy who was used to a boss girl), from a shortlist of suitable bitches let your son and the dog choose each other.

The other advantage of an adult of say 5 years is that your son is less likely to be leaving his dog behind when eh leaves home for Uni etc.