I would like some opinions on this.

I have been present at 2 different matings.

the first one the dogs were introduced, let to sniff each other, let to run about and play and essentially have "forplay" and eventually in their own time (about 30 mins) mated naturally, tied etc. Both dogs had never been bred before, this resulted in 10 healthy pups and a complication free pregnancy.

The second one was totally different and I was alot more bothered by this.

The bitch was brought in, faced away from the rear door, the dog was brought in, bitch kept facing forward. there was no fun stuff and essentially he hopped on, the handler helped the dog guide him self in and that was it. in the human world this would be nothing more than rape. I felt really bad as my poor girl did have a clue what was going on!! She was too a maiden bitch but the stud was very expereienced.
I dont want this to have scared her mentally for the next time, as yet we dont know if she took yet as we have another 10 days till go till scan day.

What.. if any.. so people have any preference to how they mate dogs, i understand some studs are very valuable and cant chance a bitch snapping at him.. but thats what a muzzle is for and checking first that they will get on.

which way is more normal.. or is it just down to the owners?

The way I've always known is for the dog and bitch to be first introduced with the dog on a lead and the bitch loose, so that she (on unfamiliar territory of course) is free to move away whenever she wants to. After a few minutes of this the dog would be let off the lead to flirt more actively. After another couple of minutes, if all is going well and the bitch is showing signs that she's ready and willing, but a little nervous and pulling away when the dog tries to mount, she'd be held by the collar to steady and reassure her, and prevent injury to the dog.

So a bit of both, really. Management and control, certainly, but also allowing freedom to exhibit natural behavior, for the experienced owners to recognise whether they've got the right day.

I have only been to one mating and it was something inbetween the two of your experiences. They met outside and got aquainted, then were taken inside where the whole thing was much more clinical. To be honest although she was a maiden bitch, I doubt whether she would have been mated had she not been held, she lives with a male at home, and was not about to submit to the dog. Luckily he wasn't put off by her and a successful mating took place.

In a perfect world I'd love to see whether she would accept the dogs advances if given time although I have no doubt if she hadn't been steadied the first time she may have bitten the dog!

I have always allowed my bitches to flirt with the dogs. They first meet on leads before being let loose to get to know one another. I will put the bitch back on a lead, making it easier to control her, once the male ets very interested ;-) By control, I mean I hold her in place so that she doesn't walk halfway across the garden/room, not to hold her in place unable to refuse the dog.

> which way is more normal..

Depends what is normal to each of us I guess.

I have taken my bitch to an esteemed judge/breeder to have my bitch mated, and was amazed at how clinical it was.

However, when I have bitches visit, I allow play and "getting to know."

My boy is experienced, and won't waste his energy if his first sniff doesn't produce whatever it is he's looking for.

Although, it's obvious that he knows they are there for him.  He sits close, licks ears, and makes friends.  If he was human I would call him a "smoothie"!

LOL

your boy sounds like he has it sussed!!

Indeed.. thats the word i was looking for, clinical. we were in and out and done within half an hour! Poor girl was atleast looking for a pick up line first!

I am planning on keeping a male from this litter.. and should be be the sort where people like him enough to want to breed to him i know i wont do it in the clinical way of which he was concieved!!

I tend to find that if a bitch goes for a dog without calming down after time then shes not ready. I have heard of milk crates wedged under bitches and they dont even get to see the dog. In my experience a bitch has been excited on a return visit to a stud in a more natural way with pregnancy resulting every time a more relaxed stress free situation is better for all concerned, but with a mating how you describe my own girl missed 3 times.

I've only been used to the 'clinical' way in my breed, although I usually let them have a look and say 'Hi' before the deed is done. 
My bitches are good natured and I know that I take them at the right time, but I've also seen nasty bitches with owners who are unable to hold them and so can completely understand why owners of winning dogs don't want to risk them getting bitten due to owners' incompetance.

With me its always been a period of play and flirting first. I have a bitch that lets the male half mount and then runs off for further teasing. I don't allow this to go on for too long though, the poor males can get flustrated. So I generally have to hold her steady after a while but thats the only human contact we have, apart from holding the pair of them steady in the tie.

In my breed the first scenario you gave is the norm with handlers only holding the tied pair to prevent the bitch rolling over and injuring herself or the dog, as quite a few bitches find the tie irksome.

Also if a bitch is standing bu keeps moving at the crucial moment then holding the bitches collar, or a hand under tummy to stop her sitting to make things easier is fine, as if the bitch was really adamant not wanting to be mated then she could object.

I have attended and helped in a mating such as you describe for the second scenario in a large guarding breed.  It was the males first mating.  Subsequently I boarded a bitch going to this male and when the stud was brought to my house (the studs owner couldn't board the bitch), and allowed them to meet, play and then mate quite happily, but she was a very friendly easy going bitch.

I was told by the people in that breed that some bitches that are dominant and would not allow a strange male to mate them even if obviously ready.

Well i have dobermanns... so a fairly large woofs!!

I am just hoping it was all good and i get some nice pups in a few weeks time! Fingers crossed and on the count down for her scan!

Neither is the wrong way to do it, if people want pups from a well established stud then they may have to have the no nonesense approach, IMO it is really in the hands of the stud dog owner as to how it is done.

My personal preference is that I have always had the stud and owner come stay with me, (I know I am lucky to have that option) my reasoning is I like the dogs to know each other, to flirt and for my bitch to tell the dog when she is ready, not have some test or owner decide when she is ready for mating, I like things to happen naturally, it also has given myself and the stud dog owner a good bond too which I personally like.

I think the only way your bitch may be affected by this is if she really wasn't at her peak. I'm sure she will be fine, how a bitch is mated as long as in experienced hands doesn't make any difference to the whelping process, althought it may make a difference to the amount of pups or not at all, if not on her peak days. I'll never forget that story someone once told on here of a bitch being mated not quite ready because the stud was only available then (novice breeders) and the bitch was screaming in the woods having a forced mating. Terrible.

I have heard of two bitches in my breed that have had a forced mating as a first mating(e.g. the stud owner said she is playing up because she is inexperienced)
Both missed so could be said the timing possibly was not right.

Neither of these bitches do not let themselves being mated "naturally" because of the trauma caused.
The minute the male tries to mount the fear can be seen in their eyes and they panic :(
Neither have ever left any puppies because of it so in my opinion the force used really spoiled otherwise good girls and took them out of the genepool for no good reason.

I would not let my maiden bitch being jumped on as described, bitch that has already gone through a mating will know what is going on so might be ok with it but a maiden bitch could be scared by the experience.

We always let the females play with our stud dog 1st, usually no problem, our 1st ever mating with our 1st female was horrendous, she too was forced, we were naive at the time and though thats how it was, her 2nd mating  she was much better but not great, we retired her after this as it wasnt fair to put her through it or ourselves, she was a perfect mum but the mating terrible, the 1st time had freaked her out big time, hope it doesnt put your girl out if you want to breed from her again.

> our 1st ever mating with our 1st female was horrendous, she too was forced

Same happened with me. It was one of the top kennels so I thought this was the norm. Looking back now I am appalled they do this and would never let it happen again. She missed, it was obvious she wasnt ready (mind the stud owners said it was a great mating!!)

The next time I mated her I new she was ready as she made no fuss but when I took her back 2 days later she went mad!!! So no mating............she had 8 puppies.

Our female missed on her 1st mating also, she just wernt ready, we hadnt blood tested etc (we didnt know that existed) her breeder insisted she was ready, now we are more experienced, ye we were also told it were a great mating, NOT

i always allow the dogs to tell me when they are ready, i only move in and hold the pair once they are tied, to help the male turn and then steady them both so they dont pull on each other. I wouldnt feel comfortable with holding a bitch so she couldnt resist, if it doesnt happen naturally there is usually a reason for it i believe, that is just my experiences in my own breed.

I think (like some others have said) somewhere between the 2.
A slightly more natural approach with both male & female on leads and let them sniff each other and go from there. Just holding the bitch more firmly so she doesn't go for the dog at the inappropriate time. If the bitch is really showing bad vibes to the dog then I am a firm believer in natural/fate & she should not be mated at this point,being to early or late(if at all!!)

I wouldn't like to just have my bitch mated wham bamb thank you maa'm. They need to flirt, and be animals. Especially if its her first time, it will make her relaxed and accepting to the stud. Same as horses, you tease first, see if she is ready. You can't force a mare to stand quietly if she doesnt want to so why should dogs? Thats just my preference

I've seen several with different dogs and bitches and it's usually halfway between the 2, like others have said. Sniffing and flirting allowed, but once they 'get down to business', the bitch is held and the dog is helped to aim. In the case of my own dog, when he was used at stud he was so eager he had to be helped into position before it was too late! :-p

I can relate to these posts.
When my bitch had her first mating, we took her to the stud on day 13, he was proven and experianced..she wasnt ready and kept sitting...she was horrified. The stud owner asked us to leave her overnight..which we did...she cried all night for us!! we got a phone call later that night to say thye had mated and tied...she even sent a pic to prove it, but if we left her she would try again in the morning. When we went to collect her, we went a bit earlier and found her tied up in the garden with the dog mating and tied and the stud owner in the kitchen drinking coffee...needless to say I had a few words..as my OH picked up our girl and took her to the car. We got all the paperwork we were meant to have etc..she had a rough pregnancy, but produced 3 beautiful pups.
This year we decided to try again with a different stud, beautiful boy. We were a bit wary when we got there, but the stud owner was lovely, she has 3 girls of her own and the stud. Introduced them on the leads, tails wagging, very pleased to see each other. let them off and out into the garden where they played and flirted and after about 30mins they came back in, had a drink, mated and tied..no stress nothing..it was lovely to watch. We did leave her there as it was a 3hr trip each way, we were due to collect her in 2 days but we got snowed in and it took 4 days!!
She had settled well and was playing and flirting and had 3 really good ties. Now all we have to do is wait for the scan in 3 weeks time. I would leave her again but only if I was 100% sure she was happy about it.

>she wasnt ready and kept sitting

Some maiden bitches, however ready, can be a little nervous when it comes to the actual deed, and although previously flirting and flagging, will sit down at the dog's attempts to mount, or pull away at the strange uncomfortable feeling at penetration. So a little physical support and reassurance to prevent injury (and stop the dog exhausting himself with failed attempts!) are often needed, and shouldn't be considered in the same way as a forced mating.

Good luck hope you get a litter, sounds promising, no stress on your female neither.

> we went a bit earlier and found her tied up in the garden with the dog mating and tied and the stud owner in the kitchen drinking coffee

Thats awful, poor girl.

Glad she had a much nicer experince this time round :)

If its any concelation... regardless of mating style it worked.. she was scanned last week & is pregnant

yay, glad to hear it!