Attended gsd show in St Helens today as a complete newbie and spectator. My companions and I were disgusted by the noise and prompting from outside the ring. There were moments when we were shoved out of the way by people trying to get their competing dogs attention. It was so bad that the judge stopped the event to ask the crowd for quiet but as soon as the show continued they started up again. In my opinion the judge should have disqualified any dog that was being prompted (it was obvious which ones as they were using the dogs name ) Is this so regular an occurence that the judge just continued even after warning the crowd. There was a German judge in one of the rings today, what as great impression he must have of us.

Why don't these comments surprise me ? It is all part & parcel of the trend to show GSDs that are not trained to do anything but run round the ring here in the UK. When I was showing my GSDs they were also Obedience trained & needed no one to get them to gait at the end of the lead. There is some outside attraction at the bigger shows in Germany(like the Sieger)but as the spectators are in the stands of football stadiums it is a totally different thing plus of course all GSDs have to have working qualifications as adults(no matter how some people allege(on this forum they are obtained)

All the dogs were very well behaved and I'm sure would have done quite well on their own without the over enthusiastic owners. One dog was given a 4th position and the judge said that although the conformation was correct, in his opinion the dog was slightly agressive and the owners would need to think twice before showing it again. Surely this dog should not have been placed at all. The total experience showed how serious this showing is to the breeders and not all the fun that I thought it would be.

One dog was given a 4th position and the judge said that although the conformation was correct, in his opinion the dog was slightly agressive and the owners would need to think twice before showing it again

Please don't take this the wrong way, but when did the Judge say this. Did he give a verbal critque, as I didn't think this was allowed in this country?

We've had this (verbal critique) at a Boxer show (open breed show) when judge is from the continent.
I found it very interesting to learn on the day why the judge did what they did. What they thought of the dogs
and to actually have those placed dogs infront of the judge whilst giving the verbal critique on the class.
They also did the 'normal' written critique which appeared in the dog papers, obviously here you'd only get the top 2
max critiqued.

It is unusual I must admit - I wasn't showing that day but a spectator - but I did think it was very good.
As the other exhibitors/spectators know on the day why dogs have done so wel or not so well.

We had an Italian judge and every single owner in the ring he spoke to and told what is good and what is not and I have to say I liked it.
Everybody got something to takeaway with them when it came to judges opinion wether they got placed or not.
He even gave advise on handling of the dogs if he felt the handling made the dog not been shown to its advantage!
He would replace the paws of some dogs to make them stand nicely if he felt they were stood in front of him unbalanced :)...

My girl had hurt her leg that morning(possibly jumping out of the car) and had a very slight limp so little I had not even noticed it.
We were told we should withdraw from competition by the judge as how ever much he liked her she had a slight limp so he can not place her...
Most people did not even see the limp and we were actually guessing which leg it is(different people saying different leg)but by the end of the day it was more sore and obvious so the judge definately knew what he was looking at when dumbing her because of the limp hardly anybody even noticed!

In the next ring another judge was running around the dogs and one had an awfully bad limp and at no point did the judge say a thing but let it run around etc with the others do it's individual part and back to running in the final selection.

Our judge is very respected in the breed anyway but after that day I really like him and his way! He is a very funny man as well, lovely to watch his judging and how he connects with the dogs (and the owners).
He also definately placed the dogs not the "faces" on the other end of the leads.

I think I have gone off the topic, sorry!

I thought it was great that the judge gave his opinion verbally to the crowd on the placed dogs. They also made comments on the handling skillsAs a newbie we got to know what they were looking for and what faults the dogs may have that made them not have a first. Made it all seem very fair for all. They had 2 judges an English and a German in different rings, judging classes seperately but both gave their critique on presenting the prizes or tropies. The German judge had have his say through a translator but said he was very impressed with the standard of all the dogs and made his judging very difficult. I presume then from what people are saying that this is not the norm. I would have liked things to go one step further and the placed dogs and owners to be named. As newbies we did not know the dogs nor from which breeder they were from.  

> I thought it was great that the judge gave his opinion verbally to the crowd on the placed dogs.

Glad it wasn't an entirely awful day then :-)

Firstly, dont worry about the German judge being shocked about the 'double-handling' ( that's what it's called) .....he wont be - this is fairly standard practice I'm afraid. At one time there was a great deal said by the KC about stopping the practice but the clubs just threatened to break away and have their own shows so now, it's not allowed and sometimes stopped at general all breed shows, but at breed specific shows it still goes on.
Secondly, the reason why names of owners and dogs are not given verbally in the ring, is so the judge cant be corrupted or influenced by knowing who is who...a debatable point :-)
That's why they print catalogues for the show containing all the info, you can follow the classes and placements at your leisure using the numbers worn by every exhibitor. 

I didnt know that the judge couldnt give verbal critiques, at the first couple of open shows we made a point of talking to all of the judges and see what they thought of our girl and how we could improve what we were doing. Infact a couple of breed specialist judges for our breed was talking to me in the middle of the ring for about 10 minutes, we were the only ones entered in that class though, so nobody elese had to wait. Had no idea that they werent allowed otherwise we wouldnt have asked

Sound like it happens quite a lot.

You can always ask a judge after judging has finished for their opinion. It's not the done thing to keep other people in other classes waiting. Most judges will happily tell you why they placed your dog where they did, and how to improve things.

The critique took place at the end with the prize giving. As the judging was already done and just presenting the trophies I don't see how naming could create bias. Sorry as newbies we did not know that there was a catalogue. Will know for next time although I did think that there would have been a programme of events on sale, but we did not see anything like that. Are they usually bought ahead of time? It did not appear to have held anthying up by doing this, they did not do it for all the dogs just the winners. Someone was furiously taking notes, so I presume this was for the critique for the other competitors. Please forgive my lack of knowledge, I'm looking to you guys to help. I will get there in the end, just a bit faster for your help hopefully.