This is in my local paper today

http://www.southwarknews.co.uk/00,news,15432,185,00.htm

now im around the corner from this estate so of course im going to be a little worried that this will be extended,

If I am completely honest (and wee bit selfish) then I would say  I don't like the idea that I may never be able to let my dogs walk free or play on the green across the road from me again

I do take them out most of the time off a lead if we are just going across the road to the green  which is within an estate ,

I don't believe it will help with the anti social behaviour of the teens with these dogs it will only hit people like me who's dogs are very sociable and well trained ,

They say the wardens will be enforcing this well they all finish at around 9pm ish so the thugs with the dogs will just come out in between these times like they already do ,

Also most thugs with dogs when approached by wardens would simple give a load of verbal abuse and walk off.

We are a very built up area with some very unsavoury places that you would not want to walk in at night for safety reasons  even with a huge Rottie,

So to me this would mean that I would have to walk my dogs to a VERY unsafe badly lit local park  to let them run free,

Please feel free to give your thoughts on this I know a lot of you would always walk your dogs on leads regardless ,

But some people like myself do let one dog walk beside them freely while your holding 2 others,
I know my dog and I feel I have good enough control over him to allow him to walk with me this way,
Of course im not stupid and I wouldn't do this with him when the school kids are turning out of if theirs kids playing on the grass areas only as I know some kids are scared and I don't want people to be afraid of him, for the most part when his out he don't take a blind bit of notice of anyone anyway,

So what do you think will it help with the anti social dogs , I have my doubts,

Arrrrr its made me so mad and to think i went to the council to try to get some waste land in a park fixed up and see if they would allow us to use it for dogs Agility it dont have to cost much i would help clear hte blooming area myself and help build some jumps and an A frame and anything else i know a few people with dogs who would love to help, the council turned us down flat instead they now want make sure that no dogs get any good exersize unless you go to muggers corner thu to a local park, it makes me mad i feel the are discrimenating against dogs,

when the youth around here start killing other kids they builde them a youth club, when they start hanging round the streets with their dogs they ban the dogs from free running,

why not give them somthing possative to do with their dogs,

Well I for one would not dream of walking on a road with my dog off a leash. I see it all the time on a busy road I drive down to get to the country park, it has wide grass verges and so many people walk dogs off leash there but it is a max of 20 mtrs to the road and dogs move so fast, my heart is in my mouth every time I drive there. Having killed a dog on a road through no fault of my own..It ran straight out from behind a hedge into the path of my car, an awfull thing and I sat with it in the road waiting for a vet as it was too badly injured to move but it died in my arms before he could get there. (When the owner arrived he said those immortal words "He's never run off like that before")...It only takes once for a dog to die like that. It takes but seconds for a dog to run into the road and no one can ever be 100% certain thier dog will not suddenly see a cat, squirrel, bitch in season etc.. and run! I am sorry if you will have to walk further, I know it's easy for me to say go to the enclosed park I do not know your circumstances but I think it is only fair to have dogs safty first and foremost in mind.
On the topic of controling the thugs late at night, no I don't suppose it will do anything to stop it. Sad fact of life that so many have a fearsome dog as a status symbol. I am lucky to live in an area with little trouble and I feel sorry that you have to put up with these idiots. They make it bad for everyone alike. And how short sighted of the council not to take on board any idea that may make a diference to those who really want to improve things for dogs!! Keep battling away at them..one day they may come to realize it's a good idea.
Aileen

im not worried about walking futher and i didnt mean walking dogs on the main road our local big park is a very Dangerous place at night its mostly full of gang members and crack heads so I would not be happy to go their at night, im talking about the green areas on my estate  across the road from me there is a huge green and thu the flats there is a large park its these places I use at night as I feel a little safer that im closer to home ,

Believe me the area is very well built up theirs alleys and side roads and flats everywhere your never going to be walking around to much traffic as its just not big enough ,

I do trust my boy to walk free by me and he listens well he would not chase a cat as we have 2 and we have a squirrel that I feed in my garden daily so he would not bolt on me I feel safe at that anyway he no's the route we take and just gets on with it,

We sometimes sit on the wall across the road and socialize our dogs with the people in the flats and the dogs will play on the big green their its good for them im upset that all this may be stopped ,

also iv just thought as my house is on this councils deeds as being part of the estate across the road i could get fined for having my dog on the pavement outside my own house this dont seem fair to me

I don't like the idea that I may never be able to let my dogs walk free or play on the green across the road from me again


Reading the report it is not very clear to me at least whether the green areas are included in this too, it would be an absolute travesty if dogs were not allowed on the green areas to run, chase balls and play with their owners and other dogs, dogs need to be able to exercise properly. Walking on pavements and roads I can understand that, dog fights are becoming a major issue in built up areas with lots of dogs it may well become a problem, and some people do use dogs to intimidate others a loose dog could very well frighten a lot of people some breeds more so than others.

Hopefully it will not become a legal requirement where you are, I do think these things just tend to hit the hot spots, if it does then all I can suggest is a flexilead or even a training lead to give a good trot if your dog wants, and then lots of garden ball play to run off energy, I agree it is not fair, the minority of bad owners always spoil it for the good, but somehow dogs have to have their exercise and that needs to be thought out too,  not many people can do a 5 mile road walk to make up for the lack of free exercise.

I'm with Carrington, I read it as on the acctually estate which would imply on the roads...Maybe I read it wrong.

Hi,

For what it's worth my view is that all dogs must be on lead at all times, other than on private property or in parks where they are allowed to run free.

My rationale is that you cannot trust any dog 100%. My dog, for instance, would strongly object to another entire male coming up to him when on the lead- some dogs don't mind, others do- mine is one of them. I have experienced a number of people walking the street with an off lead dog (often staff or similar) saying- "oh don't worry, he's fine". What they cannot seem to grasp is that their dog is fine precisely because it is off lead and can control its space, whilst the other dog it is sniffing around, mine in this case, cannot. This is just the kind of situation that can lead to a nasty fight.

I'm sure that you are able to control your dog very well, but there are many who cannot and don't really care too much about the consequences. Bottom line is that we have to have consistency in application of the law and what is more, for the reasons already explained, it makes complete sense to keep all dogs leashed when walking the streets. Every time you walk yours off lead on the street you set a precedent for irresponsible dog owners to do the same.

With regard to the green space near your house, you are the victim of the current trend for status dogs. I know what it is like to have to make the effort to find a space where my dog can run free because I have a 20 minute walk either way to my local park, every day. En route my dog stays on the lead, and I'd much prefer for others to do the same. I feel safer and so does my dog.

>For what it's worth my view is that all dogs must be on lead at all times, other than on private property or in parks where they are allowed to run free.

Thank goodness, for the wellbeing of dogs, that's very much a minority view.

>their dog is fine precisely because it is off lead and can control its space, whilst the other dog it is sniffing around, mine in this case, cannot. This is just the kind of situation that can lead to a nasty fight.

And if your dog was offlead too, and able to maintain his comfort zone, the chances of a fight are much reduced. Dogs on lead are more defensive-aggressive than dogs offlead. Even when both dogs are on-lead they're more likely to bristle defensively than if both are off-lead.

ETA: Not on the street, naturally, because that's against the law. But in open spaces (not playing fields) without livestock, then off-lead is better than on.

JG,
My post referred to instances of dogs interacting on the street. I live in town, the other poster lives in town. Clearly if one lives in the country different "rules" apply. Since the poster does not I felt it more pertinent to limit my reply to what I, at least, felt to be relevant. 

lol this is the Acctually estate,
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_NpINLHeo8rM/R6HXKfMJlyI/AAAAAAAAN4A/P1D85ShTFZc/s400/44.JPG

heres how it started,
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2005/09/29/exclusive-death-of-an-urban-dream-115875-16186738/

heres how it ends
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aylesbury_Estate

i belive they must mean the whole estate ,
and my worry is as i said , if this thing get rolled out to my estate, although im classed as being on the estate even tho its across the road and all away from me that means my road my pavement is all part of the estate so i coould be fined for standing outside my own front door say like im getting shopping from my car outside my front door my dog will stand on the pavememt waiting for me no lead just waiting for me, i could then get a fine for having my dog off his lead on the estate,

saying- "oh don't worry, he's fine". What they cannot seem to grasp is that their dog is fine precisely because it is off lead and can control its space, whilst the other dog it is sniffing around, mine in this case, cannot. This is just the kind of situation that can lead to a nasty fight

well in this situation i would not allow my dog to sniff anyother dogs my dog will come when told and walk at heel i once had a huskey attack my rottie when he was younger he was free running in greenwich park and my boy was off lead as he came i put my dog on lead while the owner told me no dont put him on lead as i did it the dog attact mine why was that, ?

Dogs on lead are more defensive-aggressive than dogs offlead

not the case with the Husky in greenwich park my boy was not more than 6 months old when he was attack and the owner was acting like i had done wrong by putting my boy on a lead wen his dog was coming at mine ok i think maybe if i had not had leaded mine maybe they would have just had a sniff but my boy was not agresive in anyway to the huskey it was him who came and jumped my boy

>ok i think maybe if i had not had leaded mine maybe they would have just had a sniff

There you have it.

Hi,
My beef is with dogs unleashed in the street, not in the park or in other open spaces where dogs are allowed to run free. Though in a park I would give any dog on lead a wide berth and try to ensure my dog does the same (the leashed dog might be in heat or injured, or it may have behavioural problems).

I can see what your problem is and why you are worried. We are all suffering because of an irresponsible but highly visible group of status dog owners.  You will probably be aware of growing efforts to introduce dog control orders into many London Parks and, at the very least, to severely curtail areas where dogs can run free, penalising all decent dog owners. In my area i have experienced a growing number of children (toddlers) who stand and cry at the mere sight of my dog - well behaved, on a lead and totally under control.  There is a lot of anti dog feeling about. I guess the only way forward is to campaign for responsible dog ownership, setting ourselves the highest standards and leading by example.

well you no what if it happens then i will have to deal with it and i will be calling on all you CD'ers, here to help me with your good advice on all the reasons that dogs and owners would benifit from having the perfect piece of wast ground up the top of burges park which is already fenced off and is just left for fly tippers, its a perfect place to bulid some Agility stuff for dogs and if we could get some people interested in it them im sure other would come and we may be able to help teach as least some wanna be hard teens with dogs just what their dog and them selfs could achive,
i am going to start putting together some facts for my local council, and try to get some people on my estate more interested , if their banning the dogs playing on the estate i shall no star a protest (in a nice way) that we need a space for our dogs to run and socialize i think its a great idea we have southwark dog wardens doing dog shows at local parks so why not an agility comp?

i have experienced a growing number of children (toddlers) who stand and cry at the mere sight of my dog - well behaved, on a lead and totally under control.  There is a lot of anti dog feeling about. I guess the only way forward is to campaign for responsible dog ownership, setting ourselves the highest standards and leading by example.

i hear you iv had the same with children and adults where i live their is a huge African population and most of them run screaming at the sight of a dog, in the last few years theirs been an influx of muslims and i was not allowed on a bus with my ebt asa the drivers were muslims thay really hate dogs , theirs shops i cant go to if i have my dogs as they wont serve us cos they no my OH has the dogs waiting outside and iov been holding one of them before i get their

I guess the only way forward is to campaign for responsible dog ownership,

so true JG would you think my idea could be concidered a good way forward,
most kids around here dont no that their dog can be tought anything else other than to bark and be agresive i would like to hope that i could change some of their minds and make them see gain a posative corntrol over their dogs ,

good on you chelzeagirl you keep at it. I think your idea could help some of these young people learn better things to do with their dogs than some do now and maybe a bit of self esteem from their dogs doing something well that they have trained them to do  also.
(hope that makes sense.)

You were not in the wrong, all of us have to put our dogs on a lead at some point in the park, I would hate to think my dog would get jumped by another every time I did this.

At that moment, given it sounds as though the Husky was moving towards your dog with intent, leashing yours was arguably not the best way of managing the situation because your pup's behaviour would change and this might have been misread by the Husky. Also your boy was at that magic age of 6 months where he would smell more interesting/threatening to other dogs, particularly adult males. That's probably why the Husky made a beeline towards him. If the Husky was also a male it is possible that he smelt competition, because your dog was being put on a lead and partly focussed on you, he did not behave respectfully/appropriately enough towards the Husky and got a vigorous telling off- as many 6 month male pups do- especially by adult males. If, however, it was a full on attack then the Husky owner was at fault. Bear in mind that a good telling off can look and sound awful. I am making the assumption that the Husky was a male? As you say, had you kept your pup been kept offlead it might have all been okay, but we cannot know that for sure.

Reading about the problems in your area and thinking about my borough too (croydon) its horrid the problems that have developed.
I really feel for you with the stuff you are saying you have to put up with with your dogs but can well belive it.

Ahhh Croydon your not far off from me then ( the land of Ikea lol i know my way their thats itlol) so you can relate to what im saying lol i was once told by a cab driver from peckham now living in kent, that when peckham was lovley Brixton was the bees knees and concidered posh, i think its croydon sounds like the bees knees and posh myself being in peckham, but i know it also has its problem areas also,

have to make that clear, when i drive thu from crystle palace to get to ikea i feel like im somewhere better than the slum of peckham lol, but im sure their may be places round your way that are not so nice, i did a fair with carters fair one year in Shirley got lost on way home using public transport and ended up walking round your red light district lol, we got one of these on the front line ,

lol sorry a jokes come to mind lol regards to red light areas lol i cant give it away latley let alone flog it lol

its mine and OH 19 year aniversary tomorrow hes off to clean his mum garden im off to seaside in kent with dogs to visit my mum and take her blood presure pills she will need, :-)

gotta say mum wont be best pleased me bringing all 3 dogs so i need to take a nice piece offering by way of a few new dvds ,  but how could i leave a dog behind you couldnt do it could you , :-(

You went to Shirley (which is in Birmingham) and went back to Peckham via Croydon? You got very, very lost!

shirley croydon i think i got a train to west wickham thats the directions i was given but was a very long bus ride from station and the fair didnt tell me i could have got the bus from outside the park ground to croydon central where the shopping centre then a 3 what ever it was bus from their straight to peckham , i went all back to west wickham at 11pm to find the last train had gone and i had to wait for a bus to take me back to the fair ground then i rang a mate who was brought up their her mum still lives thier to help me find the way home i ended up near the shopping center at around 2am, was about the last time i went and work for them without having a car lol

omg i am not suprised you got lost if you were looking for shirley and ended up in west wickham. you poor thing. So glad you saw the sights of Croydon yep we have the good the bad and the ugly as yyour found out. Well I hope you saw some of the good LOl!
Next time you head for Ikea perhaps you had better pm me so I can make sure you dont get lost and From what I hear there are similarities between the problems in our the two areas.

i also done a fair near the sugar loaf pub i think form what iv seen i like croydon but them i dont live their and dont see what you will see , i had my best boot fair at croydon and my son has performed many times at fairfield halls , gosh its been all go on my street tonight we had a police dog searching ca xar and their were 2 big vans of police i have cctv up as a dererant to the keyer whos doning my car and i see 2 youths on it running past then sirens then police dog was searching a car their were 3 big cars and 2 vans,,, then just now the dog 3 doors away who barks at everything was going nuts and i just looked out to see the 2 lads with their mobile phone lights facing her grass in her front lawn so the have thrown their drugs into her garden they see me and have now gone im guessing i wont get a lay in when day breaks as they'll more likley be back looking for their stash, lovley round here isn;t it lol

after the run around direction i got i wouldnt have been surprised if i had av ended up in Birmingham :-O

What a shame your idea was turned down.It sounds like one of those things that would really lift peoples spirits.I suppose the council are worried it would be another place for the louts to hang out and ruin the peace.As Merlot said,never give up.See if you can get some other dog owners on your side and present your idea again.As for the other thing,it sounds as if it's still in the "thinking about it " process,even though they have got a date in mind,they've said that residents have a chance to have their say.If they do decide to bring in bylaw.then really you have no choice but to comply.I don't see them being able to collect any money,in reality though.I don't think anyone is going to hand over 50quid,just like that,and those who are taken to court because they have been warned over and over,are not going to be the type to pay up

My pet hate is dogs off lead on any kind of street. I personally would never take the chance with my dogs, not ever and I have to say I don't really understand the desire to walk a dog free. A lady I was homevetting had her cocker spaniel killed because she let it out of the front door, to jump into her open car which was immediately in front of that door with the boot open. The dog had done it hundreds of times, but this time something caught it's attention and it ran straight in front of a car. This I may add was a very very quiet road. She was very unlucky that a car was coming at that precise moment, but to my mind that it why we don't take the chance.

Great idea for the agility park by the way. Keep at it :)

K

Oh,yes I totally agree about being on the street with a dog off the lead,it's just too unpredictable.I think chealzegirl is wanting to walk her dog off the lead in the local green areas,or have i read the news item and her post wrong.

Well it could be worse- how about the poor dog owners in a town in China having to deal with having a one dog only rule!

Keeping dogs on leads is a must unless in a field ,gated park somewhere away from peoples homes. Without the danger of cars, there are kids on bikes playing about then the dog poo issue? I would never have my 3 running free on a estate way to populated for my piece of mind.

Keeping dogs on leads is a must unless in a field ,gated park somewhere away from peoples homes.

im affraid if i followed that rule then my dogs would never in their lifes be allowed off a lead,
even our  local park is close to houses and is not secure
http://www.frithstreetgallery.com/images/cache/1af8da0c94bbc2316eb15d4b73fb7a18a06537dc

and in this park your ment to keep you dogs on leads , but of course most people dont,

im affraid id have to go a very long way to find a field around here,

also i was talking about the green areas withing my estate i am careful which time my dogs go out so as to avoid to many people only because i dont want to get Jacked for my dogs realy,
so early morning and late evening is best time,

Arrrrr its made me so mad and to think i went to the council to try to get some waste land in a park fixed up and see if they would allow us to use it for dogs Agility it dont have to cost much i would help clear hte blooming area myself and help build some jumps and an A frame and anything else i know a few people with dogs who would love to help, the council turned us down flat
Hi I don't knw what facilities you have in yur area, but firget the councul. They are in too much trouble if things go wrong. We approached a local cricket club, and have use of their field. We really need to also buy a bomb proof metal storage container to place there because transporting the equipment was too difficult so we've not run any sessions this year.  The cricket club has a bar so they can make money out of us and consider us part of their community, we sgrred £20 per hour for the field but the crisket clun never asked for it as long as we suport the club by buying drinks, sponsering events etc.   It's nice cos young people come with their dogs because they can walk from their homes.  So it might be worth trying to find localish privately owned land rather then council owned.

well seeing you do live in a city- very built up area you should demand somewhere or get a petition from people in the area to have a dog park just for dogs! they have them in America? Us dog owners pay council tax ... The new RSCPA code of caring for a dogs mental state says they have to have off lead roaming to play & sniff about? In a North Devon village Torridge council? I think they have decided to ban dogs on the beach and there has been up roar about not letting dogs off lead too. There are many areas around here though to take dogs not just the beach.

>The new RSCPA code of caring for a dogs mental state says they have to have off lead roaming to play & sniff about?

I don't think it does, soes it? Can you find a link?

Hi sorry I'm rubbish at putting up links but found the wording its the new animal welfare Bill;

Number 3 states-'To exhibit normal behaviour patterns' I suppose the local lot around here have made it out to be a given right for a dog to be let off lead... To be honest I do think its cruel when people don't let their dogs off lead? 

Well thanks Magicayou do live in a city- very built up area you should demand somewhere or get a petition from people in the area to have a dog park just for dogs! they have them in America?

that's just what I was thinking!, now that they have already turned me down on this, before their new rule , and they now want to try their rule out ,
I want to aproche the council on my idea futher with regards to their rule, i belive we could and should work together to try to make a differance to how people can train their dogs,
i really think that some of the nice teens iv meet with dogs would bring them to the area i have in mind and it would show them that they can do great things with their dogs and lets face it im talking about proberley a load of terrier breeds staffs and staff x;s , so treats i would say would be the way to train their dogs , anyone got a terrier thats not got a great sense of smell and egar to please ?
i think kids could be turrned around and bad owners and dogs could be helped,

ohhh see how i get carried away anyone got a letter idea on how to put this to my council as i dont really have all the words to say what i mean!

any ideas?

To be honest I do think its cruel when people don't let their dogs off lead? 

One of my dogs will only be let off lead in certain places. He is a rescue terrier and has a brilliant recall at home and in wide open fields where I can see for miles but anywhere he can disappear into the undergrowth or where we may come across livestock he stays securely on lead. His hunting instincts can take over and he is off into the wide blue yonder. He wears a hunting bell so I can hear him but once his nose is down to the ground, or if a rabbit or squirrel appears across his path he is oblivious to anything else. In areas such as this he is walked on a harness and long line and I think it would be far crueller for me to let him off lead and know there is a very good chance that I wouldn't get him back and would be risking his life if he got to a road or came across livestock as I can practically guarantee that he would chase them and I am just not prepared to take the risk of having him run over or shot by a farmer.

My other dog spends most of his walk off lead and has a great recall so it does really depend very much on the dog itself and I don't consider I am being cruel by keeping my terrier, and others, safe. It would be great if he could be off lead more but that's not a chance I am prepared to take.

you just summed my dog up Harley see my 2 oldest 4 year old rottie and Ebt are great off  lead but i am very carful when it come to Tai my younger EBT, son of Ellie. we dont have to worry about livestock but people he would run to anyone and while im giving the command to sit stay to the other 2 i would have to run to catch my younger so theirs NO WAY ! he's being trusted for now, he has has his moments where a goup of people walks by and he listens and comes so i knpw he is learning but with him i know its when it suits him that he'll come back, so he's always on a lead till i belive he'll be safe,

i have to worry about him getting stollen around here as thats what would happen if he was out of my sight for more than a second,

iv had the Gypse boys paying alot of attention to my bullys since iv had them and as their well known for dog doghting round here i worry they'd want my dogs for bait, sound fare fetched but its what you here around the estate and the gypse camp up the road has been raided twiuce in last year and dogs have been seized, i know because my friend live on their doorstep,
sorry bout spelliniv taken my bipolar meds today as i felt myself slipping to depression now i feel slugish it will pass in 48 hrs lol hope you understand what im saying lol

> To be honest I do think its cruel when people don't let their dogs off lead?

Why?

My dog NEVER goes off-lead (due to public-perception), but he is free to sniff about where he wants to & run when he wants to (obviously while on a foot-path near a road he has to 'walk nicely'), . I have legs, which means I can go wherever he wants to go and at whatever pace he wants to, the only thing is, he's attatched to me via a long-line.

> Number 3 states-'To exhibit normal behaviour patterns'

Sniffing/eating turds, eating dead animals, rolling in animal poop, sniffing people crotches, etc.. are all 'normal behaviour patterns', but sociaty accepts the fact that dogs should still be under control and stuffing thier nose into Mrs Smiths crotch is not very nice. Loose dogs can be a nusiance (thanks to ignorant owners & owners that can't be bothered to pick -up after thier dogs), which is why it appears that increasing numbers of places are bringing in 'leash-laws'.

If ALL dog owners respected the fact that the rest of society, including other dog owners, do not want dogs running at them, pooping all over the place and generally being a nusiance, then laws like this would not be needed and the responsible owners could continue to let thier dogs off-lead.

> To be honest I do think its cruel when people don't let their dogs off lead? 

having now had my on lead boy attacked twice by an off lead dog i cannot agree. any dog with aggression problems or even just questionable manners and recall should be kept on lead at all times.

Oh dear opened a can of worms with my last post! oops....

Yeah fair enough if the dog is liable to chase livestock or get into a fight then yes to be on a lead, like my EBT he was free roaming over the hills of north Devon until he did an unforgivable thing so he's been on a flexi lead since he was 5 yrs old, but when not a soul about- I do let him off as he will come back if I see another dog coming towards us.

Maybe its the farmer country girl in me but I feel it is a sad life for a dog to be attached to its owner for the whole of its life that's all. I meet people on walks and see their dog really wanting to interact & play with my 2 youngsters and when I inquire why is it kept on a lead- if the owner says it doesn't come back or would get aggressive I say oh right, but some owners have said; oh no I have never let it off lead ever?  I just feel for a dog not to be given the opportunity to bound about at full gallop for once in its life its a big shame. You see real joy and happiness.  About the comment about rolling in pooh and sniffing people well you watch out for things like that and call them back, take along pooh bags for when they go...easy. That's all about having your dogs under control and management surely?  

Chelzeagirl I live in the area too, and although I understand why you feel the way you do, something has to be done don't you think? I'm so sick of my dog being attacked by other dogs, sick of phoning the rspca and the police about dog fights, sick of dog mess on estates, sick of the anti social behaviour and a******e owners!

You'd hope that the dog warden/enforcement would have an ounce of sense and your concerns about being fined for getting your shopping out the car (btw you either live in The Aylesbury Estate or you don't so it's either/or you say you live across the road so I don't really understand?) would be needless, but as someone who was RAN after by a PCSO when my dog wee-ed on the grass and asked me to pick up my dogs mess (there wans't any had she bothered looking!) I understand why you're concerned. It's always the people who do things by the book that get done isn't it?

Isn't there a dog run in Burgess Park? (no I wouldn't want to go there at night either lol) I go to Kennington for the dog run and the chat. I'd be up for putting pressure on the council to get you some space for agiltiy, (I'd definitley come and help!!) there is the dog club just off Walworth road, they might be able to help as well. :)

Also worth noting Southwark will quite probably be bringing in compulsary ID chipping for all council tennants. I'm quite pleased with this news as lots of these owners don't chip their pets so that if they're arrested or the dog's found they can deny ownership, thus getting themselves off the hook!

> Southwark will quite probably be bringing in compulsary ID chipping for all council tennants

Is this an alternative to ID cards and will it be done by Dr or the vet???? :-D

Now there's a thought! I don't really fancy having either for myself! ;)

But yes for the DOGS!

>I just feel for a dog not to be given the opportunity to bound about at full gallop for once in its life its a big shame. You see real joy and happiness.

LOL, you haven't met a Mastiff have you! :-D
Weather a dog actually wants to bound around is dependant on the dogs breed & individual energy levels & preference. I have a low-energy breed that would rather spend 2 hours LAYING DOWN  sniffing the grass than have a gallop. If he wants to gallop or run full-steam ahead (rare occurance), he can, I just run with him, which he thinks is absolutely great fun :)

On the weekend my dog managed to escape throught the front door (hubby thought dog was safely asleep in living room & left the door open while loading the car ), with the opportunity to run & romp the streets as he pleased, he decided to lay on the front lawn to watch the car being loaded. His idea of a good walk is a chance to sniff around the floor and generally enjoy the fresh air in a sedate, leisurely manner, occasionaly he'll have a little run, but not very often, so I have no guilt about keeping him on-lead :)  If he was a high-energy dog, I would find somewhere else to walk him and let him off.

Hello Amelie
welcome and welcome to CD's ,
my worry was about if this thing gets rolled out over  other estates not just about the Aylesbury i am Actually on the Friary estate Peckham but I was referring to if the rule gets passed on to other bad estates like mine as we have same issues as Aylesbury ,
And although I am living in a house across the road from the friary estate I am considered to be part of the friary by the councils deeds so that would make my road and the pavement outside my house also part of the friary,

I know their needs to be something done about the dogs and teens issues but don't think it fair that good dogs and owners should suffer,
Why should my dog not be allowed to run and play because of the idiot teens who think its cool to let their dogs run amock,
I was born around and brought up around Bagshot street Kinglake street my Nan was one of the first to move into Ravenstone house when they were first built as we lived in the prefabs across the road before that,  she lived their right up to 5 years ago with my mum till she died aged 84,
Then the council kick my mum out whos disabled and left her homeless, hence why she now lives in her caravan holiday home in season and has to live with me from November to March,

Is their a dog run in burgess park as I don't know where that part is and im their everyday I was told today by them blokes in red that I had to put my girl on her lead and where I was their was no one about I just think some of them have nothing better to do , had I been an aggressive looking hoodie with a staff x pit I doubt they would have had the nerve to say a word ,

I think ALL DOGS should be chipped that idea I thinks a good one and southwark are great when it comes to this as each summer they have their little events dog shows where you can have your dogs chipped for free iv had all mine done via them so they are trying ,

Would you like an Agility course then for you and your dogs to enjoy I know a few of my friends think  it would be great there is a great spot up by Southampton way at the end of burges  park when the dead end road is that's already well fenced in with a gate and it's a nice little area to turn it into something like this I believe,

but as someone who was RAN after by a PCSO when my dog wee-ed on the grass and asked me to pick up my dogs mess (there wans't any had she bothered looking!)

lol sorry cant help laughing at this same thing happened to my OH once and the man insisted he pick it up when OH pointed out it was wee he was told "well you shouldnt let your dog do that " Doh,
lol
their an African man whos a pcso on our estate and he is so scared of dogs that even when i walked thu the flats one day with the puppy he ran into a bin chamber and was screaming i wouldnt mind i had the pup on a lead and wernt even going toward him but he was in their calling out " i beg you i beg you leave me leave me" i walked straight ahead in the direction i was going and he had run to the left of me and i was well out of his way while he was still their making a fuss , some of them are just plain idiots, theirs one around here who thinks an EBT is a pit bull terrier, wanted my name and address and everything i honestly thought he was kidding till his mate came over and said he wernt thankfully he new a little about dogs and assured his mate that mine wernt a banned breed,

a better idea it to ban the kids off the estaes not the dogs but of course this wont happen,

Hi there,

I'm not sure whether I'm right but it is possible that the PCSOS are overstepping the mark by asking you to keep your dog on a lead in Burgess Park. I was not aware that dog control orders had been issued for that park.

Of course, they are trying to introduce them and would have you believe that they are enforceable. I know of other parks in the borough where park wardens have attempted to make people put their dogs on lead but could not enforce it because no control order had been issued for that park. Likewise, there were signs in certain parks telling owners to keep dog onlead. Those signs had to be removed because they were illegal and dog control orders had not been issued.

In your shoes I would contact the park authorities and ask about the status of Burgess Park.

I do understand your concerns about going there after dark. I wouldn't care to!

Edited to say that my second para is not clear. If orders have been issued then they are enforceable but a desire to see them in place by certain authorities is not the same thing.

their are signs at the parks entrance at burges and at my local park saying dogs to be kept onleads but people including myself dont do that as i see everyone has their dogs off (well if their friendly that is)
keeping dogs on leads and restricted all the time would this just not make for unsociable dogs?

i ask the warden today what harm she was doing and who she was bothering he just grinned and said well it should be on a lead to which i said "why"?, he didnt answer me and i just walk off i just think some of these people the little bit off power they got goes to their head, like some traffic wardens i had a real stroppy one the otherday while on double yellow lines outside asda i ran to cash point leaving my son in car i was a minute no more on getting into the car this warden rushes up to me saying , "you almost got yourself a ticket then darling" ( as my pet hate is when people old enough to be you kid call you Darling, or babe,)
so from this he gave me the right hump with his cocky self , i looked and said "oh did i really" yeap he said your on a double yellow ya no, (well must be the blonde hair made me not notice them doh)
he then looked in my window screen to see i actully have a disabled badge , stupid cocky git didnt know what to say, i just looked on with raised eyebrows!
hopfully he wont be so quick to be cocky nxt time,

anyway this
there were signs in certain parks telling owners to keep dog onlead. Those signs had to be removed because they were illegal and dog control orders had not been issued.

interestes me as these signs are on all parks round here are they really illegal and how do you know if and when a dog control order has been issued in a certin park?

Thanks for the welcome - I meant to say I'm new! :)

Those red tabarded nazi's (!!) are terrible aren't they? They're 'community wardens' or some rubbish, traffic wardens really. Give people a smidge of power and it goes to their heads hehe.

I don't know if there is a dog run in Burgess Park, I can't recall seeing one either but wasn't sure, they're doing it all up though so I think it'd be a really good suggestion to put to the council. Might be worth writing a letter to Southwark and Boris about it. I know it's a pain but if they're going to say no off lead then they have to provide somewhere for dogs to go offlead. I'd think it cruel not to let them off too.

I'm going to dog club next week so I'll ask them if they're ever asked for agility, you would have thought so really.

I say ban kids too!! ;)