http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8032485.stm

As it is rat poisons are a danger to pets and wildlife, and stronger ones will be more so IMO. I don't know if there is any petition or anywhere to protest against the restrictions on the stronger poisons being lifted. What is needed is people to dispose of food waste responsibly instead of chucking it on the street (the number of times I have had to remove cooked chicken bones from fast food places from my dog's mouth....) and some good working ratting terriers to sort the rats where the biggest problems are... not poisons. Ratting terriers are quick - poisons are often slow and/or unpleasant kill.

Thoughts?

Tricky one - in areas where rats are already resistant its already too late...

On the whole I agree with you, encouraging people to dispose of food waste/compostable waste more responsibly would do a lot, but then a lot of people are battling with local councils refuse collection rotas that mean food waste is sat outside for a fortnight at a time.

More and more people are being encouraged to compost as well, which done well is fine but done untidily can easily provide rats a des res and 'all you can eat' buffet..

Sensible use of the poisons we already have would go a LONG way - they are not nice, and they are not always appropriate and I do think in situations where terriers ARE safe, they ought be used (though Im not seeing local councils providing terriers to their pest control officers..).

In most built up areas, in factories, hospitals, restaurants..... terriers are not a practical option (in a lot of council carparks with their delightful raised shrubberies placed right next to overflowing wastebins, a terrier or two and some judicious hole blocking/smoking them out would be ace, ditto many school grounds!).

In those instances not only does poison HAVE to be used, but it has to be used properly and that means a routine management of pests, rather than only putting poison down when populations explode, putting poison in the right places (ie where rats actually go and will eat), making sure that there are not alternative food sources...

All too often companies (never mind individuals) try to save money by doing it 'diy' and popping trays of poison down in places rats wont eat it in sufficient quantities, (big cause of rats becoming resistant), or NOT tidying up/removing alternative food sources (again so rats dont eat enough poison... increase in resistant rats).

I dont think stronger poisons ought to be made widely available but from the article it looks like that ISNT whats being requested anyway.

Not sure what poison they are planning on using but i am totally against it if its the one which they often use for rabbits.
As some of you may recall our Lab Bentley was PTS due to poisoning and its more than likely that it was Phostoxin
http://www.rentokil-initial.com/sds/rentokil-products/SDS100ehp.pdf

There is no test for it and there is no antidote for it, hence why i am still amazed its allowed on the market for commerical use. Our Golf Club who put this down didn't follow the correct procedures and have admitted this.
How many other people who have authorisation to use this product will not use it in the correct manner??

What happens if a rat dies from what ever they use and its on ground level, are they going to make sure all rats are cleared away? They can't possibly do this, what if a dog or cat picks up this poisoned rat, how is that going to affect them?? This is what happened to Bentley, he caught a rabbit which had it in its system..

I agree that poisons shouldn't be used and a few good ratting dogs would help the problem a lot more. In Wigan they cull the squirrels and a friend who lives in Haigh Hall brought his dogs back from their walk. He noticed one looked a little lame. Went out to feed them an hour later and she was dead. The Vets post mortem showed a poison similar to warfarin and lots of blood in her nose etc. They think that she had picked up and ingested part of a squirrel body. This is an area where there are lots of dog walks.

Oh Alison, poor dog and owner..
See its things like this that they do and forget to think about the most common consequences. What would of happened had this been a child? They pick up all nasties off the floor as do dogs and put them in their mouths before you can stop them..
I bet your life there were no notices about to say this had been done and advising people not to walk or even close the area off??

I very much doubt children are likely to eat a dead rodent.

And poisons can be flavoured with Bitrex which most people find tastes utterly vile, and have dye in them so you can SEE someones eaten it (blue allll around theface and hands).

In any case, professional pest controllers being allowed to use a poison is a WORLD away from Joe Public being allowed to use it!

I dont see a problem with this poison being legally available to professionals for use in certain circumstances.

The fact that there are already problems with non qualified persons using already legally available poisons is a different matter and one which i agree ought to be dealt with, however that could be done.

Not saying kids are going to eat a dead rodent but with the toxin i'm talking about just picking up a dead animal with the poison in it can be enough.. There have been many cases in the States where its more readily available where children have died from the poisoning.

The people who placed the toxin down were themselves trained people who had a licence to use it, they just didn't use it correctly, signs should of been placed up around the golf course, which remained open even after this was placed down. Not to be used within certain distances of public footpaths and farms, again this wasn't done either.
Its not available for the GP to buy or use it, so this is where my concern is when people who know how to use it correctly don't abide by the rules and regulations.
As i said its that dangerous it can kill.. Its basically what they used in the concentration camps.. So nasty nasty stuff.
Added: To note that Cyanide is less toxic than the poison i'm talking about, and this was banned for a while, maybe still is i don't know.

I use Brodifacoum regularly..at the moment it can only be used indoors, however mice and rats that have taken up the poison can still go outside and then die :/ As a professional pest controller and a member of the BPCA i have to ensure that i search thoroughly and remove all dead rodents to avoid secondary poisoning. Rats are becoming an increasing problem everywhere but where i am in the country we have no known problem with resistance.

We use a strong industrial poisen for rats in our garden and I have not lost a cat or dog yet! you just ensure its out of reach of a dog or set in a brick built or heavy duty bait trap.
We are inundated, in the loft we had 38 mice this year as well.

Local council's bait v. carefully and on Parish council sites here in the village no problem, but, with two weekly bin empties the population has exploded!

That and increased use of composting where some people have provided warm, moist food rich areas.
What was the saying you are never more than 10 foot from a rat!!!

My two dogs, run a mile thank goodness..

I can't believe the problems we get now that there is fortnightly bin collections - my mum's block are inundated with rats and environmental health have had to be called in :-( 

> can't believe the problems we get now that there is fortnightly bin collections - my mum's block are inundated with rats and environmental health have had to be called in

Are they not closing their bins properly?  We have had fortnightly collections for years and whilst the neighbours and I have sometimes had problems around the compost heaps none of us have ever had an instance of them getting in the wheelie bins.

I'm not sure the whole country has wheelie bins yet - but they are brilliant for keeping rubbish secure so you don't get rats...and cats... and foxes.... ripping open bags to get to food rubbish etc. I am presuming these are fortnightly collections but not with wheelie bins. Where I did live we had fortnightly collections for black bins and fortnightly for blue - alternate weeks - and no problems. :-)

It's an old Glasgow tenament so it's just bog standard dustbins - the binmen have to bring their wheelie bins through the close, out the back, up the steps, empty the bins into their wheely bin and take it back out through the close (there have been numerous complaints due to the binmen not cleaning up after themselves, ie dropping stuff all the way out).  The bins are shared with the close next door so it's not just 8 flat's rubbish, it's 16 and the next building is a bid dodgy.  At present I think Glasgow still has once a week collections, but nearly everywhere in Scotland is now looking at fortnightly from what I gather.

I have a fortnightly bin collection and we had maggots last summer - so now I need to be careful what is going into the bin now that the weather is hotting up.

> I have a fortnightly bin collection and we had maggots last summer - so now I need to be careful what is going into the bin now that the weather is hotting up.

A bin with a good well fitting lid should keep the beasties out.  It's difficult though when you share it, ensuring everyone is tidy though isn't it.

I lived in a Glasgow tenement (well a couple of different ones) when I was a student - and round the bins was ALWAYS a mess, and they got full really quickly - weren't enough bins for flats, esp not flats with students sharing - so a fortnightly collection from those would be a nightmare. They need to equip the tenements with a wheelie bin per flat for rubbish, and one per flat for the recyclable paper if they're going to do fortnightly collections. It's no wonder they're having problems.

Where we are it is wheelie bins but a fortnightly collection for a mum with two or three kids is not enough. we are ok we are two! But a couple of Mums around here have nappies galore, bring back towelling nappies I say.

For a family of 4 or 5 it should be plenty.  The whole idea is to make people reduce the amount of waste they produce and by and large these adaptions to collections have been successful so clearly people can do it when they try.