Hi,

I'm new to this forum so sorry if this is the wrong place to post this or if it's been covered before (which it probably has!) I've got a new Jack Russell puppy after sadly losing my old JRT to cancer at 15yrs old, 2 & 1/2 months ago, which was devastating!

I've had him a week & he's 8wks old. Today for the first time I had to leave him to go to work, however he has been left alone at least one a day since I've had him as I've had to go to Tesco or something & I've also put him in his 'area' (he's got a fair size part of the kitchen with his bed, bowls, toys & training mats) to do things upstairs or housework etc as I wanted him to get used to being on his own. He initially cried for a couple of minutes but as I don't make a fuss over leaving him in there or when I come back he soon settled down.

Today I went home at lunchtime to feed him, let him out in the garden, play with him etc, (& intend to do this for the foreseeable future) but I do feel bad at leaving him (he will be alone for 4hrs, give or take a few minutes, depending on traffic) but I have no other option & used to leave my other dog with no problems however he was 15wks old when I got him & Milo's obviously younger than that.

I know I'm opening myself up for criticism & believe me if I didn't have to work full time I certainly wouldn't do! Anyway, I know a lot of people think that even 4hrs is too long to leave a dog but my question is (sorry it's taken so long to get to the point!) what's the difference between me leaving him while I'm at work & someone who shuts their dog in the kitchen (for example) over night, when they'd be on their own for longer than 4hrs?

Thanks

"what's the difference between me leaving him while I'm at work & someone who shuts their dog in the kitchen (for example) over night, when they'd be on their own for longer than 4hrs?"

The difference is that the dog has already been left overnight and then is left again.

But mine hasn't as he sleeps in the bedroom with me so he's not on his own at all overnight, just while I'm at work.

> what's the difference between me leaving him while I'm at work & someone who shuts their dog in the kitchen (for example) over night, when they'd be on their own for longer than 4hrs?

The difference (assuming you work during the day). is that dogs sleep through the night just like we do so being in a room on thier own doesn't make a difference (they know weather you're in the house or not).

My dog much prefers to have company and would not be happy being left for 8 solid hours during the day, yet has no issue with being alone in the livingroom over-night. If he wakes before us (not very often, he likes his sleep!), he'll be waiting at the foot of the stairs - he knows we're all upstairs despite being sound asleep before I go to bed :)

Not necessarily ridgielover. My dogs are with me day and night as they sleep in my bedroom and I work from home. I think what the OP is getting at is that if I shut my dogs in the kitchen at night what would be the difference compared to someone who leaves their dogs during the day and not at night - OP correct me if I'm wrong!

IMO the difference is that during the day you would be interacting with the dog, feeding it, taking it for walks etc. and giving it mental and physical stimulation, whereas at night there wouldn't be the same level of interaction because you and the dogs would be sleeping.

Mine seems to sleep through the day & plays at night! :/  He's always asleep whenever I go to let him out of his area, whether I've left him alone for 20mins whilst I'm upstairs or whether it's an hour while I've been to Tesco! I make sure I play with him before putting him in there so he's had exercise (& once he can go for a walk I'll make sure I walk him before I leave him) & he just seems settle straight down & go to sleep.

He's not left alone for 8hrs solid & won't be as I'll continue to go home at lunchtime, although it's 8hrs in total.

what's the difference between me leaving him while I'm at work & someone who shuts their dog in the kitchen (for example) over night, when they'd be on their own for longer than 4hrs?


You're still in the house and not gone. Dogs do know the difference -or very quickly learn it. Your big problem is going to be house training of course.

i just cannot understand why anyone who works 8 hours a day would get an 8 week pup! couldnt you have got an adult rescue who is used to being left alone? i dont want to sound harsh but i always wanted a dog but waited until i only worked part time and until my kids were teenagers! it was a long wait but worth it. couldnt you give this poor pup back to breeder? 2 lots of 4 hours alone is too long!

I don't mean this to come across as rude, sorry if it does. What made you get a 8 week old puppy when maybe a older rescue dog would suit your work habits a bit better?

I am lucky and work from home most of the time, so my current dog has not ever been left for more than a few hours, lucky him! On the odd occasion when he has been left for several hours, however, he doesn't seem too concerned on our return, and usually he is asleep when i come in, if ever i am going out for a few hours i make sure he has a stuffed kong to entertain him in my absence. Many (probably most) people work full time and their dogs manage very well.
It might not be the best thing, but it is surely the best you can manage, and you are coming home for exercise and play at lunchtime (if ever you couldn't manage that, you could ask someone to come in and take him out for you). So long as you make sure your dog gets plenty of exercise when he is old enough and lots of training and play when you are home, i am sure he will have a very good life, like so many dogs whose owners work full-time.

What about getting a dog sitter to come in for a few min morning and afternoon to play and let him out. Also after he is out of quarantine is there a puppy creche near you, I met a lady near me who runs one and thought of using it if ever we can't manage to juggle our routines to fit around the dog, at least the dog gets to socialise.

When I had my first dog as a puppy I was out at work all day, I did have the neighbours who came in during the morning, my OH tried to get back most lunchtimes and the days he couldn't we used to have a dog walker/sitter (for an hour), so between them it worked.

I am lucky now and work from home or at an office where I can take my dogs, but in answer to the person who asked the question why would you have a puppy if you worked all day - it is because like me they probably could give the dog a good home.

You will be feeling really guilty but as long as you take time to come home at lunch time, when you are home at night make sure you give your dog loads of love and attention and training.  It is going to be the house training that will be difficult if you don't have someone coming in during the day - is it possible to get a neighbour or friend or relative who live close by to pop in during the morning and the afternoon, just to break up the day for him?  Or more expensively a sitter or waliker?

It is different at night because you are in with the dogs and there is a difference, they know you are at home and dogs do sleep at night.

It isn't easy but it can work, and you are not a bad owner because you work, so don't feel that way, just make sure you make up for it with the right stimulation and training and love and care when you are there.

In reply to tina s

i just cannot understand why anyone who works 8 hours a day would get an 8 week pup! couldnt you have got an adult rescue who is used to being left alone

Most older rescue dogs suffer from seperatioin anxiety and would not be a suitable dog to be left alone.

I had a puppy when I worked full time and he was definitely not neglected, and judging by what the op said neither will this dog be.

Hi madders,

the differences between overnight and being left during the day would appear to have been suitably explained.

As mentioned by others, house training will be more difficult - pups need to be let out to relieve themselves regularly, much more so at such a very young age and this not only for the owner's convenience but also for the pup's comfort and wellbeing.    Animals don't like to make a mess or be near one and are much more content to toilet outdoors, even more so when they begin to learn the basics of 'asking out'.  

Young pups of course also need regular meals and, equally essentially, thorough socialisation.  None of this will be easy with an absent owner for the greatest part of the day.

One this young should not IMO be left unattended for a period of 4 hours even once daily but since you now have the pup IMO the best advice is to arrange for someone to visit the pup mid morning and mid afternoon each day in addition to your returning at lunchtime.

Teri

For housetraining purposes someone will need to be able to take the puppy out into the garden every hour or so - have you a neighbour who can come in and do that?

The difference between being left alone during the day and being left alone during the night is really quite simple. Dogs, like us, are diurnal. We're active during the day and sleep at night. So being left alone when you're naturally asleep is different to being left alone when you're naturally awake.  Besides, if a dog is distressed during the night and needs to go outside the owner will wake and respond. If the same thing happens during the day when the owner is absent, the dog will have to suffer till the owner returns, which could be several hours.

I currently work full time (hopefully over the next year my hours will reduce) but I have never had any problems with new pups.  I always have a week or 2 at home with them, they are in my room at night while young - actually my Akita is on my bedroom floor as I type and she's nearly 4 lol.
I have never had any problems house training any of my dogs - we have 7 between 3 people.
My dogs laze about all day whether i'm home or not.  They have regular walks, lots of training - I run my own training club, go to shows and at the evenings and weekends they always have someone with them. 
At lunch time 2 of us make sure we arrange our hours so the dogs get 2 hours of us being home - play and training takes place in this time then they rest until someone is home 3 hrs later.
They are certainly content, well rounded, fantastic dogs which are all a credit to their breeds!

> At lunch time 2 of us make sure we arrange our hours so the dogs get 2 hours of us being home - play and training takes place in this time

I think that makes a big difference to someone popping home for 30-40 mins and trying to fit in making a sandwich with whipping the dog round the block.  I also think it makes a big difference when your life is devoted to dogs as oppose to attempting to have a social life beyond them that might involve going to the pictures or a meal or visiting non doggy friends on anything more than a rather rare occasion. 
I am sure people can make a success of it but I am not sure many realise quite what a devotion it will entail.

I've found with my dogs, even my 12 week old pup that as long as they have routine they're fine.

In the past I have had to go into the office all day and as long as they got walked morning and evening they were fine but  it meant not having a social life as I couldn't leave them on evenings and weekends.

I now can work from home most days and have two grown up children at home so they are never left for very long  but even when we are here they just sleep most of the day.

I do think that having your dogs upstairs at night makes a huge difference to them .  Mine wake up several times a night and have the reassurance that I'm not far away.

I work in a small office and the majority have happy well adjusted dogs and work full time. 

Hi

I had 2 weeks off work when i got my pups so i could settled them into a routine and gradully left the pup for a few hrs though never all day even though the adult dogs would usually be left ( with kongs, treat balls, food, the sofa etc)

Now she is older, they stay indoors for a good 6 hrs , i have tried coming home for my lunch now but it unsets there routine the neigbours also comment on the fact when there left to it they are quiet

I am not sure i would a 8week old puppy on its own all day or even if they had company i would , I feel they need so much input in the first few months that say 8 hrs on there own would be far to long at such a young age

I would also like to note, i would of considered a rescure dog/olser dog but most charietys will not re home to people working though i cant see how being stuck in a cage going mad  all day and being let out for a short period is any worse then being left in a cosy house with toys and other dogs
Henc why i brought 2 older breeding bitchs and 2 puppies

Also dogs dont have much sense of time, one of mine goes mad if i leave the house for 5 mins and leave her for a few hrs and she is fine, But this is her routine!

I hope it al works out

Between us we leave the dogs for about 4 hours a day. But because of this we try not to leave them at week ends. People say "the dogs are ok in the week" yes but  I won't leave them at the week end too!!!

Does any one ever use the "I cant leave the dogs" card to get out of family "do's"  NO.. me neither :-)

> Does any one ever use the "I cant leave the dogs" card to get out of family "do's"  NO.. me neither

smiles and chuckles as I raise my hand.

I leave my dogs when I go to work.  I cant come home on my lunch break, and I am gone 10 hours when I am at work. My mom and I live together, and I dont know how often she is in and out, but they arent with someone all day every day. 

Gotta work to pay for my dogs. 

I leave my dogs when I go to work too, for as much as 10.5 hours a day Monday to Friday, and my dogs and I live alone together - the three of us and two horses.  I have someone come in to them twice a day (I pay her), on her first visit in the mornings she lets them out into their 'pound' for a pee and a pooh, then on her second visit early afternoon she takes them into the manege where they can have a safe blast around for the best part of an hour.  Before I leave them in the mornings they have the run of the main yard then when I get home at night we either go out to do stuff or they can blast in the manege or just have the run of the main yard.  My dogs are 11 years and 19 weeks.  At weekends I am usually with them all the time except for the odd hour, but I make a point of having 'doggie time'.  I usually turn down family/social stuff in favour of being with my dogs - I expect I'll end up a solitary figure with little human contact as I get older but I will have the best company in the world - my dogs.  My various dogs over the past 20 years have lived like this and I have never had a dog suffer for it.  My current 19 week old pup never has a toileting mishap and hasn't done since he was 15 weeks old.

I know there are folk on here who think I am wrong in what I do.

Although I can see it is necessary, when you chose to do this, to devote your non working hours to your dogs I can't quite see it as healthy for humans to go without good levels of interaction with other humans.  We were created as social creatures too :-)

But I'm with humans all day long at work, and they are horrible creatures!

Sorry, that was a bit flippant.  Some of my friends will come round to my place for something to eat, maybe we'll take it in turns to cook or we'll have a take-away.  On finer days we might meet at the local pub and eat in the pub garden.  We might go out for a few hours and take our dogs with us - several people walking with several dogs, some people without dogs just walking with us too.  Sometimes I'll go to a friends house and take my dogs (though as I have 2 to take this happens less often - it's usually easier for them to come to me, plus I have bigger dog-safe play areas that they can't damage).

Hi Madders

I don't work full time, but do work three full days a week.  When we moved, I made sure we were no longer than 10 mins in the car from work, so I go home at lunchtime on the days I am at work to let our GR out and have a play and run round (with me!).  We had him as an 8 week old puppy - I took the first week off work to settle him in and then for the next three weeks had two "lunch hours" so he wasn't alone for more than 2 1/2 hours and obviously he was being fed more frequently, (considerate workmates) and then to coming home at lunch time.  He is (and this is not just my opinion, but the breeder, puppy/dog trainers, friends, family and various people we meet!) a very well adjusted, sociable, friendly, no separation anxiety (goes to kennels fine and comes back fine too) and is an all round gorgeous dog.  I know he doesn't bark when I am at work as I have asked our neighbours who are about most of the day.  Most of us have to work, whether full time or part time, and IMO that shouldn't preclude us from having a dog.  Mine is the first I have had (my husband has had lots) and I wouldn't be without him for the world.  All the best with him.

> Some of my friends will come round to my place for something to eat, maybe we'll take it in turns to cook or we'll have a take-away. On finer days we might meet at the local pub and eat in the pub garden.

OK I shall stop worrying about you :-)

Jacey I agree with you :)  No the person that I work with isn't.  I'm happy working fulltime and being on my own with my dogs.  My mum was only saying the other day how shocked she is to realise that it really doesn't bother me.

When I get home though my time is spent totally with the dogs.  When I have gone home at lunchtime to see how they are doing they've looked at me with such disgust in the middle of their yawns that I've woken them up.

> I also think it makes a big difference when your life is devoted to dogs as oppose to attempting to have a social life beyond them

Dont get me wrong i think the world of my dog and he is a big part of my life but i wouldnt let him stop me from doing anything, i just work him & whatver im doing around each other.
I have someone whos life revolves around her dog and quite frankly i think its disturbing and sad. People arent even that bad with their children :-O

> I have someone whos life revolves around her dog and quite frankly i think its disturbing and sad.

My life revolves aorund my dog, I am not disturbed! It's my choice, not something that has been forced upon me. I don't see how choosing to revolve your life around your dog is any different than relvolving your life around any other choice, ie, going to the pub, playing sports etc... I am very happy with my life as it is and would not feel as fulfilled if I spent time in the pub/nightclubs/coffe shops etc instead of with my dog :)

Obviously it comes down to personal choice but i think everybody should have time to pursue other hobbies/activities whether it be when bringing up children or looking after animals.
What i was refering to as disturbing was the way my friend is with her dog. Treating it as if its a human. A said, i adore my dog but i do realise he is just that - A dog

i agree

Most people who have dogs work full time and if they dont they are very fortunate , i have to work full time i dont get a choice, i need the money to pay for them!!
Dogs get used to their enviroment and routine , so will ur puppy

me and my OH both work full time , my dogs get left from 9 - 1 then they get taken out for a walk at lunchtime by my dad , then left from 2-6 and are both fine, we have a 2 year old Bullmastiff and a 4 month old dog de bordeux pup

Saying that , i will spend my evenings playing with them and giving them lots of attention

its personal preference

> Most people who have dogs work full time and if they dont they are very fortunate

That's not my experience of the majority of dog owners - I'm almost sure if I think long and hard enough I may come up with one or two who work and have dogs but certainly can think of none who work full time.  Many friends and relatives have waited until they were in a position to either not work at all or work vastly reduced hours before bring a much longed for puppy into their lives.

While it is very true that dogs are adaptable to the situations in which they live, IMO it is better to put a dog's needs first when deciding whether or not we should have one.  As it happens I don't think it is in the dog's best interests to be left unattended for lengthy and regular periods and so therefore should not be a case of 'personal preference' but more of 'suitable circumstances' which are the deciding factor for someone getting a dog now or waiting a few years.

regards, Teri

> That's not my experience of the majority of dog owners

I dont know anyone who owns a dog and doesnt work & thinking of how many thousands of people own dogs in this country there is no way the majority are out of work. People jhave been slated on this forum for contemplating a dog with no income to pay for it :-)

> 'suitable circumstances'

If the dog shows no sign of distress and is otherwise happy then that is a suitable circumstance.

> thinking of how many thousands of people own dogs in this country there is no way the majority are out of work.

Hmm, I probably have met quite a few thousand of them LOL - and, like me, they don't go out to work :)  Oooh, and there's a difference between not working by choice and being 'out of work'

> People jhave been slated on this forum for contemplating a dog with no income to pay for it

I can't recall anything on those lines but TBF just because someone doesn't physically go out to work doesn't necessarily equate to no income - many people these days work from home and I'm sure several posters on here have mentioned taking their dogs to work with them too :)

> If the dog shows no sign of distress and is otherwise happy then that is a suitable circumstance

If the owner is absent then they're unlikely to see such signs ...

Like Teri I don't know any dog owners that work fulltime -or if they do, they have a partner at home.

I also work all be it part time but even that I work round my girls. OH has his own business so works his socks off!!!
I choose to work late afternoon shifts and nights so the most my girls are alone is 1.30pm till 5 on the days when I do a 2 till 5 or 2 till 10 shift. OH is usually home by 5pm if I am at work with the very rare 5.30. On the days following a night I sleep on the sofa so they know I am around (Or even not at all..I never do two together!)
I would never sell a pup to someone who worked full time. I think it wrong to leave a pack animal so long alone. If they have other dogs for company it's not so bad but I don't like it.
I work my days around my dogs, I am not fanatical and we have a great social life but the dogs needs come first and I often turn down days out because of the girlies. I have a great friend who lives noxt door and she will often on dry days supervise my garden if I leave them outside, with access to the kitchen/utility.
To take on a dog is a lifetime commitment and yes I think most "dog lovers" run thier lives according to thier dogs needs.
Sorry but I think your dog will be less than happy in this  situation and though it will probably adapt and cope it would be happier with more company.
Aileen
I am not looking for arguments here it is just how I feel....maybe I am wrong but who knows.

> I am not looking for arguments here it is just how I feel....maybe I am wrong but who knows

If you're wrong you're certainly not alone Merlot :)

I'd not let a puppy go to a home where everyone in the household was out for lengthy periods.  I know circumstances can change and perhaps someone who didn't work before or only worked a few hours a week could find themself having to take on more hours just to put food on the table but I don't think it's right to bring a dog into a household where that situation already exists.   Better then to perhaps volunteer to walk or train with a rescue centre until such times as a stable and commitment free period in our lives develops :)

seems like lots of people have opinions on this one!!...i wish i didnt have to work!

my dogs seem happy and healthy to me and get lots of exercise , we are fortunate we have a lunchtime dog walker ( my dad!!)  and that was partly the reason we have 2 dogs now to keep eachother company while we are at work

As long as my dogs seem happy to me and not distressed , i am happy to leave them while i am at work , i have found if they get a long walk in the morning , they sleep during the day anyway while i am at work , so works for everyone !

if dogs were in a rescue centre  they get hardly no attention atall - isnt it better for a dog to be in a loving home but left for a while then stuck in a rescue centre with no love or home??...

> seems like lots of people have opinions on this one!!...

It does LOL.  Many of the members on this forum are also breeders and it is difficult to separate a view point held from that stance from one held as an owner only :)

Since I have strict criteria for how my own pups will be raised, it's quite naturally reflected in how I recommend others are too.

> if dogs were in a rescue centre  they get hardly no attention atall - isnt it better for a dog to be in a loving home but left for a while then stuck in a rescue centre with no love or home??...

Responsible breeders do all humanly possible to ensure that pups of their breeding do not end up in rescue centres - anyone privileged enough to have one of their precious pups is interviewed and befriended to ensure the level of care they've enjoyed while still with their breeder is mirrored in their new home and, should anything unforseen cause a drastic change in the new owners' circumstances, pups - regardless of age - are welcomed back by such breeders.

regards, Teri :)

if dogs were in a rescue centre  they get hardly no attention atall - isnt it better for a dog to be in a loving home but left for a while then stuck in a rescue centre with no love or home??...

The dog in my avatar was bred by me and came back to me when his owner's circumstances changed. She was both emigrating AND having to work long hours in future so the dog came back to me where he would not be left alone. Rescues don't ever enter the equation for dogs from good breeders -and many good rescues also don't let their dogs go to people who work fulltime. :)

> have found if they get a long walk in the morning , they sleep during the day anyway while i am at work , so works for everyone !
>

That sounds like the opposite of my dog. he loves his lie in so isnt wlked in the morning but is very active in the night time so has his walks later on and gets attention lavished on him in the evening :-)

I agree with Teri and MarianneB - When I started looking for a dog in 2004 not one resuce center would even considering rehoming a dog with me because I was honest enough to admit that I worked full time, I then found a wonderful breeder who also said she would not prepared for me to have one of her litter if I worked full time

I made one of the best choices of my life in Jan 2005 and started work part time, 4 hrs a day and I brought myself home a wonderful GR !!! Yes I had to give up a lot as I earn half the money I used too but the love of my dog is tenfold over the money and stresses I used to have. The only thing I miss is my foreign holidays as I cannot bear to leave him LOL :o)

I'm fourtunate to be in the postion to do this but if I wasn't and I worked full time I probably would not have brought a dog.

I did the same Wizaid. Although, for a few years I gave up work altogether and we just relied on my husband's wage.  We went without a lot of things.  I caught the free bus to the supermarket and used my superior speed to get to the bags of cooked meat offcuts before the pensioners could clamber down off the bus :-)  I think a lot of people who say the must work could probably pare it down a lot if they are prepared to say goodbye to a lot of the consumerism that we seem wedded to.  Perhaps the recession may teach that lesson again.

If dogs could only go to homes where there was a non working person then I think there would be a vast reduction being bred by the very responsible breeders we need, leading to lines dying out which is not in the best interests of the breed or rescue centres being even more full than they are now. 

Many families in the UK now are working families and many folk do have to work. 

I work full time, OH works full time but different shifts and we've done it that way for the past 15 years.  My job is flexible time wise and I work round the corner.

Different people have different priorities in life as to what suits them. There is nothing wrong with folk having a balance between people time and canine time and if some people humanise dogs and treat them better than some treat kids; that's their business.  My non working time is completely devoted to my dogs; just have the one now as we lost our lad last year, but I wouldn't have it any other way.  I find canine company can be much more fulfilling and preferable than some peoples.

> My non working time is completely devoted to my dogs

The trouble is I don't think many working families are prepared to do that. There is no getting away from the fact that many dogs are advertised for new homes or placed in rescue on the basis that "we cannot give him the attention he deserves"
I am not sure if we are running out of homes that aren't all involved with full time work.  There are many homes where someone only works part-time, is retired or, increasingly, works from home.

When the phone rings and the caller says "I'm preparing for early retirement/giving up work and at last, I'm able to have a dog /looking into the facts about getting a dog"....my heart soars :-) What an sensible attitude IMO.

I don't work now, but when I did ( and then only part-time whilst I've bred dogs) - I paid someone to be with my dogs. I cant imagine letting one go to someone who works full time.

It's the commitment, dedication, passion and quality of life that matters. 

If folk have the commitment and dedication needed despite the fact that they work then I can't see these dogs having any less quality of life than those with non working folk.  Not to mention the money too for the very best medical care, training, activities, dog sitters etc, etc.  Not many in the UK are wealthy to the point that they can stay at home and if waiting until retirement before getting a dog, well, I like to be young enough to run round an agility course with my dogs. 

I also think that dogs benefit having another of their own kind in the household and for that reason we usually keep two together.  Two is as much as we can manage to give the quality of life we feel they need while managing other time constraints such as work, etc. 

People only get experience and knowledge by having and interacting with dogs and I'm not convinced that seeking homes with folk who waited years to have a dog is necessarily a better home than someone that works, pays for dogs sitters as and when needed, is dedicated and passionate and has had dogs for many, many years. 

Not many in the UK are wealthy to the point that they can stay at home and if waiting until retirement before getting a dog, well, I like to be young enough to run round an agility course with my dogs.

You all seem to be forgetting the simple fact that somebody NOT working doesn't have to mean there is no income. There's thousands of people not working because they have a partner that do. 99 % of my puppy buyers for a start! And they include a lot of agility people. (The 1 % being those that either work part time only, or where they and their partner work different shifts so there never is anyone away from home full time.)

Spender, when I gave my opinion it was from the perspective of a breeder.

I believe selling puppies is a bit like gambling and I for one, try to minimise my risk by only selling to what I consider the 'ideal owner' and that includes at least one stay at home family member. My puppies - My decision.

If you remember recently there was a person asking advice about buying 2 boxer puppies and then divulged that she works full time.
That person managed to find somone who would supply puppies under those circumstances..but it would most certainly not be me.

Despite a plethora of advice suggesting that this was a bad idea - she went ahead I believe. It probably wont be very long before she's along again with another post. :-(