ok you probably all thinking here she goes again,and yes i need to get it off my chest.lol.he wont listen when we ask him in from garden  he just ignores us and jumps about barking.he wont stop going on settee, when we ask him to come off he just barks and snarls,if we go to move him he bites and growls really nastily,if we go to put him out of room for time out he goes for us or runs around barking,he gets totally out of control,he takes everything of kids wont let them play he is been really dominant.we have had dog behaviourist round and done everything he has told us but no difference.what we going to do it is out of hand,we have had enough cant wait till he is two.

Sounds to me like Dougal is doing very nicely as the Boss of the house! I have nothing else to offer I'm afraid if a professional trainer can't help! Do you or the children show your fear? If you don't get on top of it now, then nothing magical is going to happen when he reaches 2 I'm afraid. You really need to 'take' control of him! If you act subservient to him he will continue to bully you all. Sorry, perhaps someone will offer something more practical.

> he wont listen when we ask him in from garden  he just ignores us and jumps about barking.

How do you ask him in from the garden & when/why?
If you only call him in when he is having fun (hoping to chase that cat that's just appeared on the fence/having a jolly good time digging a new hole in the lawn/doing the 'zoomies' for the fun of it etc..) then you really have to make yourself MUCH more appealing than whatever it is hes doing, ie, jump up & down exitedly in a playfull way waggling a toy around (LOL, or whatever makes you look fun to be with), also make a habit of calling him in when he is doing nothing, so coming back inside doesn't automatically mean the end of fun.
If he is not really doing anything and refuses to come in when you call him, simply offering a treat/toy should do the trick (eg. call 'Dougal, biscuit' then as he comes towards you say 'in' - use a different word than what you have allready been using as he's learnt that the word you currently use means nothing!).

>he wont stop going on settee, when we ask him to come off he just barks and snarls,if we go to move him he bites and growls really nastily,

If you don't want him on the settee, then don't let him get on it - as he approaches the settee with a veiw to get on it, say 'no', if that doesn't work lead him into the kitchen for a 'time-out'.

>if we go to put him out of room for time out he goes for us or runs around barking,he gets totally out of control,he takes everything of kids wont let them play he is been really dominant

keep a lead on him in the house, when you want him out of the room calmy take hold of the lead and walk him out, don't grab his collar or shout at him.

>he takes everything of kids wont let them play

Don't leave him unatended with the kids, stop him from taking the kids stuff by not allowing him to do it in the first place.

>he is been really dominant.

He is doing everything he's learnt that you allow him to do.

>we have had enough cant wait till he is two.

His behaviour will get worse & worse as nobody is teaching him what is expected of him.

It is true I am afraid a good deal depends on how you do something not what you say, a dog, contrary to popular thoughts do not speak English. My dogs tap on the door to come in and my OH will go to let them in complaining that he has had to get up, the dogs then go back up the garden not improving his mood. If I let them in I greet them will words spoken in the sort of voice you use to a baby, the words are not important it is the body language and the tone that does the trick, they come straight in.

BTW you don't ask a dog you tell it, and you tell it like you expect it to obey, but once it does the slightest thing toward doing what you ask you reward. I.E. If  you say when he is on the chair "dog get off" even a slight move or a lifting of the head should have you saying "Oh good boy, off you get I have a nice piece of cheese in the kitchen come and see, and move to the kitchen calling your dog in a light and pleasant voice, if he arrives, reward, if he does not ignore him.

The way I work with my breed may need to be changed for yours but you have to find away of taking the control from your dog, he will not change; he is having a wonderful time thank you.

I wouldn't say he's dominant, just spoilt and untrained!

You can solve the sofa problem by using a baby gate at the living-room door and keep him out when you're not in there. If you're in there then you can prevent him getting onto the sofa in the first place; put a dog bed or blanket in a cosy corner of the room and train him to lie there instead. The gate also means that he can be kept out of the room when the children are playing; then he can't steal their toys.

Unless you're proactive about training him to behave properly nothing will change when he's two, other than being a two year old spoilt dog instead of a one year old spoilt dog. His behaviour won't magically improve!

Consistency is the key - if he's sometimes allowed to get away with an unwanted behaviour and other times punished for it, he'll only be confused and defensive. So decide what behaviours are never wanted, and work at making sure he never gets the opportunity to practice them.

Ok just remember you have a puppy on your hands - pups are like toddlers...you need to teach them boundaries and be persistant so they understand what they want.  If you wait until he's 2 I can honestly say you'll have a monster on your hands.  Dogs generally calm down around 2/3 years old because you've put in 2/3 years hard work.

Start with the calling in from the garden - you have to be more exciting than all the fun things around him.  Have a squeeky toy/tin with treats in that you can shake for him and treats at the ready.  When you want your pup to come in the house go outside and call him - squeak the toy rattle the tin etc spend time getting his attention.  If you act all fun he'll soon come up to you to investigate.  Once he does hold his collar or attach a lead, feed him a treat and walk him indoors.  Now make indoors fun - play a game of fetch or give him lots of fuss when inside so he starts to like the idea of coming in - now practice, practice, practice.

Furniture - stop him before he even gets on the furniture.  If he looks like he's going to jump up - give a firm 'off' command.  You can gently remind him what 'off' means by holding his collar and getting him to put all four feet on the ground.  When all feet are on the floor tell him he's good and feed him a treat.
If you have trouble getting him off the sofa keep a light house line on him so you can hold the lead and guide him off the sofa - again when all 4 feet are on the ground, praise and feed a treat.

Taking things off the kids - when he takes things what do the kids do???  Do they chase him around to get their things back?  If so this is the best game ever for a pup!  When he takes something get the kids or yourself to start doing something exciting the other side of the room - turn you back on him and rustle paper or squeak a toy etc - he should eventually get bored (this may take 10 mins or more) and come and see what you are doing.  When he does hold his collar, praise him and give him a treat.  While one of you holds him and gives him fuss the other person collects what he had run off with.

Everyone in the house has to be consistant and trust me it does pay off.

Good Luck

Lucy

Hi,

I would say as others have that he's not being dominant - he's just learned what works, for example the garden, if it's not been made fun to come in from the garden but rather the end of fun, he's learnt that by barking and running around he can evade the getting in, at least pro-long it.

I understand that these behaviours must be frustrating but it really is down to training, patience and consistence.  It's really improtant to set him up for success so that you can reward good behaviour.  Can I ask what the behaviourist suggested, how long you tried the things they suggested and what if any difference there has been, even if things were made worse?

In the meantime I would only be putting him out in the garden with a long line attached to him so that you can bring him in if he doesn't respond to you verbally asking him to come in.  However I would also work really hard on making coming in from the garden a good thing, set up training sessions so that you aren't asking him to come in when you are in a hurry and need him in now.  Make it a game, reward him for coming in and then go in the garden with him and have a game, then do the same inside.  You could also get the family involved with having some recall games - if he's on dry food you could use all of his evening meal to do this.  All grab a handful of his food and play the recall game, each calling him to you in turn and rewarding him with a piece or two of kibble.  Start with this indoors and when he gets the idea of the game move rooms and then have one of you just outside the door to the garden etc.  It's also important to have a specific recall cue rather than just using their name.  We use our dogs names in so many situations that it doesn't always mean come to me - so you should use a cue that always means the same thing, so his name to get his attention and the 'come' or 'here' or whatever you want to use.

It's also important to try and use his name only for good things, so many people use their dogs names to tell them off and then wander why they don't respond to it some of the time. 

With regards to the sofa I would be teaching him a reliable 'off' again using the house line.  To start with I would show him what I want by encouraging him off with a yummy treat and saying the 'off' cue.  When he has got the idea I would start using the food as a reward if he responds to your request.  If he doesn't then use the long line to remove him from the sofa and either ask him to settle on his bed, if he knows that, and if he doesn't then teach him a bed cue.  If he starts getting vocal in any way then calmly pop him out for a time out for a minute or so, then bring him back in.

Are you  taking him to training classes ?
Are you tiring his mind aswell as his body ?

I am sure it is very wearing to you but he sounds like lots of fun !!

Just a quick tip to add to the advice you've already been given (very good advice btw!)

When you call him inside does that also always mean end of fun/play?  If so, you can understand why he won't always come.

*Keep a box of treats by the back door
** Always reward him for coming inside
***Don't always shut the door behind him - it's helpful if he learns that coming back inside doesn't always mean end of fun
****When he comes in - make sure you bring him past you to a position from which you can shut the door (even if you don't shut the door you still need him to hit a specific position/place each time)
*****When he is safely indoors, with the door shut, spend a couple of minutes doing something interesting with him.  It's quite a good time to practise positions - sit, stand, down, wait etc.

If you are gong to training class - highly recommended - they will help you get a 100% recall.  Once you have this you should be able to call him to you, wherever you are.

hi, we put his collar on as the behaviourist asked us to, we gently take him of but as soon as we turn our back he is on .so off he comes again,then back on he gets then out off room he goes,two minutes later he comes back in does same again then he gets nasty snarls, so out he goes and this is it all time.its like this all day every day,he knows it gets our attention so keeps going,he gets loads of attention all day,he is with us all the time,even in garden we are with him dont know what to do next as we deo our best to make sure he is not bored.   

>he knows it gets our attention so keeps going

There's your answer! You've accidentally trained him how to get your attention - and, for a dog, just like children, any attention is better than none.

Your next task is to train him how to cope without yor attention.

thanks for advise,kids wont chase him they to young we have stopped doin it getting to tired running round dining room table unless its a sock as he swallowed one a couple weeks ago so off to vets we went £150 later we got sock back lol.he just goes for everything they got,even their ride on toys he will drag round garden.we try keep him in when they are out but he whines and barks so its trying to see if he genuinely wants out or wants to be with them.we always go with him but you got to be quick he wont listen when you say no or off.think dog training classes are next.

how do we do that,we dont know if we are coming or going lol.do we just ignore him then instead off keep taking him off.

Without seeing his behaviour, and how you react to it, it's impossible to tell you what you should do.

Basically, humans are the species with the higher intelligence, so we're the ones who need to predict another animal's behaviour and prevent it doing the unwanted behaviour in the first place. Easier said than done, I know! But if you know he'll do something 'wrong' (ie, what you don't want) in certain circumstances, your job is to make sure that circumstance doesn't happen.

If he growls when you want him to get off the sofa (for example) don't let him on the sofa in the first place. That doesn't mean he can't come into the living room - it means that at the moment while he's in the living room a responsible adult has one eye on him all the tme, and is aware of his actions. When he approaches the sofa he's prevented  (even physically by being unobtrusively held down) from getting on it by being praised and getting attention while he's still on the floor.

Do you see the principle? It could take weeks of 100% consistent effort on your part, but it will work, as long as he's rewarded for doing what you want and not rewarded (and attention, even negative attention, is reward) for doing what you don't want.

hi, we put his collar on as the behaviourist asked us to, we gently take him of but as soon as we turn our back he is on

Do you mean the behaviourist asked you to remove him using the collar? Unusual as most behaviouirists would suggest a long line or similar rather than suggest taking the collar but perhaps he or she saw something we can't. Was your behaviourist a member of the APBC or APDT? :)

Agree with many of the comments on here... you need to prevent him getting on the sofa in the first place and also do lots of rewards and attention for him being on the floor. But this will take a huge amount of dedication and commitment - for example you can't do it in the morning and then not do it in the afternoon....have you tried using something like silver foil on the sofa, which some dogs dislike?

yes he told us to put his collar back on as we took it of as it was causing line on his fur.there is always someone in living room as there is four adults in the house,even if we see him start to go on we say no off.sometimes he listens other times he ignores and straight on,we can tell him to get off one then he comes off and jumps straight back on our other one.he even jumps on you when you are on it,he will run from hall straight onto your knee before you get a chance to stop him,the behaviourist did his training at university,he is used by our local vet.

I am sorry to hear of your problems, you must feel like you are living in hell.  I wonder however how much your FEAR of dougal is taking control of the situation.  When you are fearful a dog will take complete dominance of your life.  How would you deal with this if it was your child bossing you around and bullying you?  Imagine Dougal as a young teenager using his newly found size (ie bigger than you) throwing his weight around, would you react in the same way.  As others have said he is being the boss, having him on a lead is a good way of controlling his actions.

Step back and take a deep breath and calmly control the situation. Use no communication of reward to him only use OFF or NO.  Using his name is reward as you use his name to praise him to.  Then when you have him where you want calmly on the floor do not speak to him just totally ignore him until you are ready.  Have you tried clicker training?   

I am hoping that you can sort him.  Not sure what breed he is but maybe some sort of activity would help, agility, flyball?  Any basic training and change of routine may help.  Concentrate on just you getting control first and them introduce the family in by training with Dougal and them.  Pick up all his toys and keep them in a box only to come out for play when you are training with him.

I hope you can work things out it seems such a shame that your relationship has broken down.  Best of luck, and I praise you for trying and not giving up.  Although please be safe.

With a  big dog the NILIF http://search.live.com/results.aspx?q=NILIF&src=IE-SearchBox approach can be a good non confrontational way to regain control.  You are the one in control of the environment and resources.

Some of the answers on here are a weeeee bit scary...

Hes being a brat, you are asking him to do something and he is saying No.

Why is he saying no. Is he saying 'No,what im doing right now is nicer', is he saying 'No I do not understand what you mean', is he saying 'No, your manner/body language/tone frightens me' (or even 'no, you say one thing but your body language says PLAY PLAY PLAY' especially wrt not coming inside).

Regardless of the size of the dog, what kind of 'no' he means - arguing with him isnt going to work. Hes faster, hes got bigger teeth, and sharper reactions. Escalating the issue and getting more domineering with him will make him reciprocate. Aggression begets agression.

Set things up so you avoid these arguments in the first instance.

Put toys away before he goes outside. Use a long leash and teach him that going outside means he goes to the toilet first and plays *with you* afterwards. No toilet, back inside he goes. If possible, split the garden so kids have one part and dog has the other so there are no toys out there for him to get hold of.

With my deerhound if shes being a madam (and she can be) and wants to stay out and ideally... wants someone to come out and chase her, she ignores a recall and loiters near the back door, out of sight from the kitchen door or kitchen window. I wont go out and fetch her, thats playing right into her sneaky little paws - if she doesnt come in when asked i shut the doors and do something noisey and involving biscuits iwth the other dogs. Within seconds there is a deerhound knocking at the door wanting in!

(And if she wants to play outside on her own, since theres none of my stuff out there and shes trained to toilet first, play second, I dont really mind, i just wont stand there with the door open freezing my bum off!)

Also question - does he get enough time outside playing? Deerhound madam unfortunately missed out on a lot of puppy play because of a knee injury and so that is what triggered this 'wanna stay out come chase me' lark. A few months down the line and shes far better as now we do play outside with her every day.

Keeping items you dont want stolen away from a dog, and walking away from him whenhe has something and starts the 'ive got your xyz and you want it chase me and lets have a row about it' saga - and going and doing something else that HED like to be involved with works wonders.

As for the sofa - use a baby gate or close the door if you arent in that room. If you are using that room I would make a point of asking him to do something else if he is on the sofa, not just commanding him 'off' because that gives him the option to say 'no. shant'... and you are back in the argument again.

Instead ask him to come with you and have a game with a squeaky toy, or do some sits for a treat, or pick the lead up and go for a quick clicker session in the front garden/street... ask a question hes likely to say yes to!

Make a point when its less of an issue, of inviting him onto the sofa when you are on there, and inviting him off again for rewards. Your sofa... it can be shared by invitation (or polite request).

Physically dragging him off by his collar is a seriously bad plan. Its just teaching him to up the ante and to expect that when hes in a comfy place on teh sofa hes going to get dragged off (which isnt nice and hurts) and that when he says 'no' you will say 'well ill force you' to which he says 'then ill say no louder' and then you say 'bring it on' and then he says 'ok ill bite you'...... and then he gets put down... (or maybe not then, but maybe when aunty betty reaches out to pet him when hes on the sofa and he thinks 'oh crumbs heres that argument agian oh ill just bite her, they  never listen'...maybe then he does!).

Of course - there are times when someone cannot understand why their dog has such a thing about the sofa - and then you realise the dog has NO comfy bed of his own in a suitable place.. or he has a bed but its tucked away where he cant see anything so doesnt feel safe there, or its in a draught and is horrid to lie on.... so make sure thats not a problem, otherwise you can hardly blame him for wanting a comfy secure spot with a good view of doorways and out of the draughts! (Not saying that is you.. but interestingly my ancient saluki always had to sleep on the sofa, until i bought a beanbag bed which is high enough so its out of the draughts, snuggly so she feels safe and still gives her a view of the doorways and isnt right on floor level where she might get stepped on which is one of her big 'things'... *doh*... took me five years to think of that!)

NILIF has its benefits.... but all too often i find that Nothing In Life Is Free often translates to 'Everything Is Really Expensive and Rare'..... and as such interaction and attention are meanly rationed and the price the owner expects the dog to pay is too high, and it becomes yet another 'me human, you dog' domination situation again.

If 'Nothing In Life Is Free - But Shopping Opportunities and Bargains are Frequently Available' then thats fine, but do be wary of harsh programs that deny your dog the right to ask for your attention politely or suggest a game or a cuddle - thats not a nice relationship to be in at all. All too often 'dominant, attention seeky dogs' are bored witless and have no other way of getting ANY attention. Harsh NILIF programs on these dogs make them worse.

Just a thought but do you have wooden flooring? :)

One of the behaviour problems brought about from the change in many houses from carpet to wood flooring is that some dogs don't feel relaxed or totally comfortable on it, and keep trying to get onto sofas for this reason.

RE the garden and not coming back in, many teenage dogs do this - I got over it with mine by calling just once and if they didn't come, shut the door for 5 minutes or so and pretended I was doing something very interesting (playing with a toy or something- don't laugh, it works <vbg> ). Usually the dog comes  in after the 5 minutes and you then have the opportunity to reward hugely and make a big fuss with tasty food and a game.

There are various ways and means - theemx has given another quite similar. I always set up for success so that they don't get into a habit of not returning, and always have good rewards waiting, even now 8 years later I will give rewards even if its just a "good girl"" but often still give a food reward, because it's important she comes in right away as she sometimes barks at the neighbours. She does come in like a rocket and I have good neighbourly relations too :)

Hth a bit

> If 'Nothing In Life Is Free - But Shopping Opportunities and Bargains are Frequently Available' then thats fine, but do be wary of harsh programs that deny your dog the right to ask for your attention politely or suggest a game or a cuddle - thats not a nice relationship to be in at all.

Have to strongly agree here, I do like some of the control without getting into and argument as you put it aspects of NILIF, but what fun is there to the relationship at all if it is rigidly or stingily enforced, without lots of rewards.

Great post.

Great post Theemx!

thanks for your help we are using all advise at moment we will try anything,he is poorly with his heart at moment has been for two days so havent needed to do anything as he just lays there its really sad,we are trying to find out if his heart problem is making him anxious but no one is sure.but we will persevere with him and get through this stage,we wont give up on him he needs us,we adults arent scared of him but the children are  well my twelve yr old is bit wary of him when he starts his antics.xwe not sure how to use the clicker for training him we did buy one but not used it properly.

thank you for the nilif website its excellent some websites bombar you with info that you got to try and remember everything,and i havent got good memory must be age,but this site looks good and easy to follow,when he is better we will use it consistantly,i think thats a big problem in this house not everyone does the same with him so he gets confused,teenagers are the worst,the babies are excellent with him dont really take any notice of him and he is good with them except when he wants to play dollies with them lol.he has had a new bed in living room today so he is nice and snug in same room as us instead of his crate where he went for his naps and peace and quiet. 

hi, no we got carpet in lounge but wood flooring in hall and kitchen,he wont sleep there well apart from his crate thats in hall but he got big fleece cushion and fleece blankets in there, and he now has new bed in lounge to see if that works.

Ah ok the flooring is probably not related, then :)

he is poorly with his heart at moment has been for two days so havent needed to do anything as he just lays there its really sad,we are trying to find out if his heart problem is making him anxious but no one is sure.but we will persevere with him and get through this stage,we wont give up on him he needs us,we adults arent scared of him but the children are  well my twelve yr old is bit wary of him when he starts his antics

I didn't realise he had a heart problem, sorry I missed that. I'd say it is very possible he is anxious and therefore a bit OTT sometimes if he is not totally well. We know for instance that a physical problem can sometimes affect a dog's behaviour.

Lindsay
x

Can his medications have any side effects to make him hyper ?

his medication is a human tablet which has side effects on humans anxiety is one side effect,we asked his cardiologist but he said that there shouldnt be any side effects,im not convinced.would like to know for sure,he was put on an extra heart tablet yesterday as the one he is on isnt helping even though it was one of the best for his condition ,starting to look like we be going to edinburgh for surgery.