Cher isnt content being left with her pups.  If I leave, then she decides that she must remove them from the box, away from the heat lamp, and ignore them.  If I am there, she is a lovely mom.  I stayed up all night last night and she nursed and groomed them no problem. 

The moment I leave, She has to move the pups.  She isnt attentive to them either, and just whining at the door.  Now I havent been back to work since she had them, and I took Wednesday away since I had to go out of town for an appointment.  So I was gone all day, and the next day is when she started this.

The one pup isnt getting any bigger, and only weighing in at 5.5 oz.  The others are closer to 8 oz now. 

I have the stuff to bottle feed, and I do have another nursing bitch, so I could put Rufus on Casie.  It is mainly Rufus she isnt bothering with while I am away from her.  The others, she at least (for the most part) lets them stay in the whelp box.  He was lathargic last night, and I had taken him to the vets to see if I could get some fluids in him. 

Just looking for advice on what to do here?  Should I put Rufus with Casie?  (she seems like she wants to take care of him, very motherly Casie is).  Should I continue to force the issue with Cher, and make her look after him?  I have to get back to work shortly (although I am temp, so the schedule is dependant on what I can do, not what work says I have to - but once I take a shift, I have to work it no matter what)  I am also nervous of putting Rufus in with Casie since her pups are a good week older, and already over the 1lb mark. 

Please help, going insane! 

no real advice Kory but i really hope rufus is alright.

I'm afraid the obvious answer is not to leave her.  I presume when you go to work someone else is there but at night you probably need to sleep with her, which is what I think most posters do.

How old are they now?

They were born this past Sunday, so 5 days now

Ohh ok, well I'm with Isabel I'm afraid I wouldn't leave them at all for the first 2 weeks...I would also worry about leaving someone else in charge...Is she a first time Mum? Sometimes they are very reluctant? There is a possibility that the one that gets ignored has a problem you can't see? Sometimes they seem to know more than we do! But I'm sorry, I wouldn't even be leaving them for 2 hours, never mind a full shift or even 2-4 hours...I am so paranoid anyway...sorry...

I am thinking the same thing.  Yes, she is a first time mom.  And this is a large litter for the breed (3 pups).  I think I am just going to go pick up my pay at work this afternoon (gone 10 minutes) and then come straight back. 

I dont think I could leave her for 10 hours for a shift at work.  Rufus is the one I am rooting for, the one I have fallen for, so its hard that she is choosing him to ignore the most. 

I just wondered why you have been leaving her? I am surprised that you have been a member of this forum for over a year and must read quite a lot of the advice given....without doubt all breeders would consider staying close by, and by that I mean sleeping, eating, everything! next to Mum and pups for usually 2 weeks at the least. I'm sorry if it sounds harsh, but surely you wouldn't expect to leave Mum and pups as early as 5 days?(or even as early as 3 or 4 days if you've been doing the shift work you say?)

No, I havent been working.  I just need to go back to work at some point.  I have been off work since before she gave birth to her pups, about a week before.  I left her because I had a specialist appointment, that I couldnt cancel.  My mom was here, and I thought she would be fine since she also loves and trusts my mom. 

I work as a temp, so my work, when I do get shifts, isnt scheduled per say.  I call today, to see if I get a shift for tomorrow.  It is all very casual.  So if I dont go back to work until they are 8 weeks old thats ok, since I dont technically "work" anywhere, just where the temp agency sends me on that day. 

It doesnt sound harsh, not at all. 

when my last pups were born i had the whelping box in my bed room so i could stay there all the time for the 1st 3weeks ...if i needed a bath i got my oh to sit with them ..i even hated having to go to the loo and leaving them ....and when we got them into the living room at 3weeks i sleept on the settee till they all went to new homes :)  ....its a hard job but worth every bit of no sleep (plz remind me i said that in 2weeks time lol lol) xx

Ohh ok, I misread it then...I though you were leaving her for shifts, sorry! I would seriously watch the little one(chap is it?) that seems to be having problems...keep a very keen eye on them(Mum and that particular pup) like I said he may have a problem that isn't apparent to us and if Mum thinks he's not going to survive she will leave him out. The other thing to consider is that it's YOU she has a bond with, someone else is always second best, however close they seem? So she might be reacting to a sort of seperation anxiety she feels when you leave her. Others can be there for the loo trip or quick shooting out for something..but YOU are her number one support act and she needs you! As the litter grows and become more independant then so will her need to have you there. She's a first time Mum and probably feeling a bit bewildered and lost! Hope everything goes ok, take care, Dawn

Yep, what newfie dreams said ;)

also,
Just a thought, but personally I wouldn't have a heat lamp with mine, they have a den type of whelp box, nice warm box in a secure dark place (under my stairs!!!! ) with warm vet bed and a large fleece blanket fixed with clips over the top of the box, hanging down in the front and almost reaching the front bit (6" hop over) which keeps it nice and dark and warm and a thermometer (room temp is at least 75 for the first 2 weeks).  I can still see into the box, but mum feels very safe and relaxed and tends to stay with the pups and keep them warm.  If extra heat was needed I'd put in a heat pad ;) Puppies go into a more open style of den in a pen as they start getting out and about ;)  I don't leave mum until at least 2 weeks and then only for about an hour with OH ;)

Is it possible to try covering her whelping box to see if that helps her relax?

Has the vet checked Rufus over ?  listened to his lungs?  checked his heart/palate?

Yep, ditto what Dill said! :-)

maybe she feels the need for a den, especially if she's anxious eh? ;-)

LOL @ newfiedreams :)  mutual admiration society or what? :)

Crespin,

Forgot to say, if pup is lethargic from not getting as much food, try a little warm boiled water with GLUCOSE POWDER mixed in, about 2 tablespoons per half pint and give just a couple of mls.  This will give him both liquid and a bit of a boost and may give him the energy to feed more enthusiastically from mum.

Is your girl a family pet? I mean does she live as part of the family? I made a big mistake of making a quiet whelping box away from the family for a couple of my girls, not thinking that they may want to be a part of the household and within the hubub of the family. They kept trying to remove the pups all over the place or didnt want to stay in the whelping box at all. It wasnt until I moved them into the lounge where we all live as a family that they settled and were happy with their pups. Now, when we have pups, they whelp in the lounge in their box so they can be with us all the time. Just an idea

xx

Forgot to say, my stairs is in the living/dining room so right in the centre of things but also secluded ;)

She is a big part of the family, not used to being away from me.  Until 3 months ago, I hadnt been working at all, home basically all day with her.  Only stepping out when I had an appointment, or went for a coffee. 

Her whelp box is in my bedroom, where she is used to being, although I think she would rather have the pups on my bed!  than in the whelping box!  My room is where I do spend most of my time (I got everything there!  Except a stove and fridge, if I did, that would be wonderful!) 

I try to only step out from her when I have to go to the washroom, or when I have to go make something to eat, just the day I had the appointment, I couldnt do much about, but I thought with my mom being there, that she would be ok. 

> Has the vet checked Rufus over ?  listened to his lungs?  checked his heart/palate?

Yes, when I was at the vets with him the other night, he had everything checked.  The vet said to bottle feed him (which I had been, until Cher accepted him back) and that he was a bit lathargic, and hungry.  But nothing overly wrong with him (apart from being very hungry and a bit lathargic). 

> GLUCOSE POWDER

Will see if mom can go out today and get some for me. 

untill you get glucose powder sugar can be used .

i normall have mum and pups in my bedroom but this time this bitch is going to be in the living room as she always sleeps in here  and i dont want to take her out of here if it could stress her ....my worry is the kids ??? yougest is 9 ...thay will have to spend time upstairs :):)x

I wonder if getting hold of some 'nutri-drops' would help? I wouldn't give her to the other doggie to raise, he would be far better off with Mum and you supplimenting him....

Crespin,

Can't add to the advice you've already had. Just to say I'm rooting for you and the little ones and really hope that Rufus pulls through. x

Well, I weighed Rufus (as well as the other pups) and Rufus, has gained 2 oz!!!!!  He is almost up to the 8oz mark. 

I have been giving Cher cottage cheese, every 2 hours.  I also have her on Clavamox (an AB the vet gave her), and she is getting a multivitamin.  I got to figure out where I can get the items you mentioned, so I have been phoning the pet stores to see, but no luck as of yet. 

But Cher seems to be a better mom, now that I have been increasing the amounts of Cottage cheese, and adding the vitamin.  She is with the pups right now, and they are all feeding well off of her! 

'nutri-drops' can be got on line , just type it in google hun xx glad to hear rufus has put weight on :) xx

Good, can you relax a bit now before you keel over?? ;-)

Crespin,

Glucose powder can be bought in supermarkets and chemists here, I think in Canada you might also have glucose liquid ??  But I wouldn't know the dilution rate for that :(  

Great that he's put on weight :-D  that's the way to go :)

Sounds like you need a relaxing cup of tea and some chocolate :-D   this puppy business is very STRESSFUL !

> Sounds like you need a relaxing cup of tea and some chocolate :-D   this puppy business is very STRESSFUL !

You got that right! 

I have to send mom off to the store tomorrow, to get some more cottage cheese, so I will add some glucose powder to my shopping list for her.  hehehe. 

don't forget the chocolate ;)

Got lots of that!  Thinking of a triple B treatment, they rock!  (Book, bath, bag of chocolate!) 

You guys who breed are truly amazing! People who want to breed dogs for the wrong reasons and those who are jumping on the bandwagon after "that" documentary should be made to read some of these threads. I was going to breed from my girl until she failed her gonioscopy now I am going to write out that deposit check to the breeder of my new pup and send it along with a care package ( chocolate, coffee, more chocolate and cake):-) Good luck and god bless all  those furry little bundles!

Cher was back at the vets today, she went off all food, and has been throwing up today.  Her stomach was also making very very weird noises (hard to explain).  They now have her on sulcrafate (sp?) 3 times a day, and she got fluids as well.  Pups seem to be doing good, and all are feeding well and gaining weight. 

Crespin,

Keeping fingers crossed for you and Cher. So Glad pups are doing well.

Hi Kory. I hope Cher is better this morning,big lickie kiss from Lillie. Im glad Rufus is getting on ok now, and has gained weight. x

Cher ate this morning, but is still having trouble holding food down.  I have to go to my vets this morning with a friend of mine while she scans her bitch for pregnancy, so I will let them know whats going on, and see if I can do much more than the meds she is on now, and the "slurry" like food she has to get.  I just dont want her starving, or being sick, looking at her is hard, when she isnt feeling good. 

But, the upside (if you can call it that) is that she let me do her nails this morning with no fight (normally she is a terror!).  So I dont know if its good or bad.  But I got nails done in a minute or two, instead of fighting with her for long periods of time. 

(normally she is a terror!).  ........bless her it does sound like shes not well :( ..my dog only let me do stuff that they dont normaly like when their unwell too....fingers crossed she will make a speedy recovery xx