never asks about her pup

Would anyone think this is caring/normal behaviour for a potential owner?

No, that is not normal, but.......... I know when I send updates photo's I generally get an e-mail back saying how lovely the pup/s is/are and thank you for the update.  As this woman has not replied to an e-mail maybe she just enjoys the photo's and does not realise she is required to reply? If not the breeder will be worried at disinterest, some people are like that, and don't think of others feelings.

I can remember a discussion not so long ago about a poster being worried that the breeder did not send photo's or updates at all, and it came about that many breeders do not do this, they have vetted the owners feel happy and now it is just time for them to wait for their pup and a lot of those people are very good breeders, so is it not fair to also think a potential owner can act the same?

Just playing devils advocate, sometimes things are not as cut and dry as they seem, but then again, perhaps the lady is just disinterested, or maybe unhappy about something? Or maybe not right for the pup? These things should be sussed out whilst vetting, the position now is horrible for all concerned. :-(

I can see your points Carrington but I know that if I felt I had to dig deeper into why things weren't going as I'd expected or figure out excuses for someone then TBH I wouldn't rest easy letting that person have my precious puppy.

It is all very unfortunate by the sound of things :(  Such reminders of how things can develop when we have matings planned are useful to all.

As mentioned previously by another poster, there are people that exist that are what was termed "British Stiff Upper Lip".  My Grandmother is one of those and this reads to me like a conversation with her and how others perceive her!!  That aside, her particular personality trait has never made her any less of a responsible dog owner and she adored her pets over the years.  They were also well rounded and disciplined because they knew exactly where they stood with her, at all times, just as we Grandchildren do ;-)

In addition to the concerns about the hip scoring, I just see this as the lady in question doing some research.  If she has taken the time to approach a vet BEFORE even taking the puppy home I see this as an extremely good sign.  JP as it stands are very likely to take a Vets word over that of a breeder because in their eyes the Vet is the person 'Qualified' to pass judgement.  You wouldn't call out an Electrician if you needed a Plumber would you?  As a livestock breeder myself, I know there are often occasions where the breeder has a greater insight/experience into some particular areas but JP doesn't necessarily realise this.

With regard to keeping up communication either during or after the sale of the pup this should purely be a nice to have in my opinion.  If you are happy that your criteria for providing a responsible, permanent home has been met then personal character preference shouldn't really come into it.

Obviously the puppies welfare is paramount here, that is something we all seem to agree on, but im not sure in my mind these things would make me reconsider homing a puppy with them but again that is just my opinion.

Regards
Leigh

I agree that a breeder has to be happy with their choices for their pups. :-)

I guess over the years I have learnt that people often don't act or think the same as I do, some are upset or offended by things I am not and misunderstandings happen all the time, I think as already said instincts are vital, but watching the interaction between puppy and potential owner is the key along with criteria, I guess I don't understand how unless someone downright lies and that is found out later how that interaction which must have been pleasing at 3 weeks, can go from being good to now being unsuitable?

Floradora, Is there a reason why there has also been no viewings since the pup was 3 weeks old? Has the potential owner not wished to come, distance too far, or no interest, or have you just not wished for more viewings?  Frequent viewings also put breeder and buyers minds at rest throughout and you can soon tell if the PO is not as you thought.

When I had paid a deposit for my pup and before actually, I was very excited, \i text and mailed everyother day to see what stages my lil girl was at and fortunately the breeder was happy to do it for me. Someone who is not excited or in contact about their puppy, IMO is not normal.
I too would suggest you go ith your gut instinct and refund her deposit. If you feel guilt towards her think of your pup and how you wouldn't want it growing up with someone like her. Most peoples gut instincts turn out to be right,I think it's the right descision. :)

>Most peoples gut instincts turn out to be right

true. and even if this lady does want the pup you will always wonder if you made the right choice, best to find someone who you are comfortable with. i know the puppy buyers from mine have ran down my drive to get to their pup and have beamed from ear to ear with pride and i have felt more than happy with how they have been.

> I guess over the years I have learnt that people often don't act or think the same as I do, some are upset or offended by things I am not and misunderstandings happen all the time

And I guess in a nutshell that sums up the desired relationship between puppy breeder and puppy buyer. A good, comfortable and trusting working relationship where neither party needs to suffer from 'niggleing doubt'.

Or...... as my wise friend says about all relationships " For every plum ...there's a pudding". :-)

The right match is out there for this particular ( dare I say plum without dire consequences?)  but not neccessarliy with this OP or her pup. Some may have taken quite a shine to her. :-)

Thank you for all of your helpfull replies. I am going to send this ladies deposit back tonight. She was fine before whelp when we met her and also fine when she visited the pups but now she has turned into a jekkyl and hyde character. Nothing is good enough for her, she is not sure that the pup was right, she wanted pick of litter and was put out when I told her she was 4th down on the list. Nothing seemes good enough for her. She has shown no interest at all and thanks everyone for your help.

i think you have made the right decision. i believe in fate and this puppy has obviously not met his new mum and dad yet, hopefully they will be beaming with pride and squirming with excitement as they should be

I think you have made the right decision aswell.

> Thank you for all of your helpfull replies. I am going to send this ladies deposit back tonight

I think it's the right thing for you - hard though it is.
good luck, Teri :)

Thank you all, I will keep you posted. X

If my bitches could just just deliver ONE puppy, the one I would have chosen from a litter and that's all..none to sell...... I would be delighted. 

Same here Tooolz..  when having a little I would love just one that makes the grade. 

The person's personality is vital to me also and slightest doubt even if found to be wrong later wouldn't matter...  unfortunately I have to like them also it isn't enough they can look after the puppy. 

Go with your gut you would be upset if you didnt.

> I would love just one that makes the grade

We're so alike in many ways Blue......you must be young, tall, size 0, clever and gorgeous like me and Teri? :-)

Can I join too please?  I definitely fit that description!!  Yeah... right! :) :)

> Can I join too please

Only if you were born within spittin distance of Glasgow Green.

i dont breed but i would go with my gut feeling.
if it was me i would want a good relesionship with all my puupy buyers so i could keep in touch.
if this woman cant be bothered to answer a simple e mail i wouldnt give her a puppy.

I think you're doing the right thing and hopefully know you will be able to find the 'right' home for this little pup.  There can be nothing worse than worrying about how a puppy is coping in its new home when you get no feedback from its new owner.  Perhaps she's got the hump because she doesn't have pick of litter?  Hope she accepts the return of her money gracefully.

>I'm sure if you re-read you will see that it was a by-product not a desire.

So not to have that is not essential?

> Nothing could have been further from my mind Isabel.

I am glad to hear it as your comment about "just to get a sale" did seem to imply something different.

> I breed puppies now and have done for the last 30 ish years...if and when you are in the same position...

Do you mean again?  I have not bred a litter for 8 years and may not for some years again but I would imagine my criteria will not be any less than it was in the past.

>please feel comfortable with who ever you wish to sell them to.

I do, that is what vetting is all about. 

> never asks about her pup
> Would anyone think this is caring/normal behaviour for a potential owner?

No false modesty here :-)  I believe I make an excellent home for my breed, in experience, life style and understanding of their needs but I never felt the need to make on going enquiries from the excellent breeder that I made contact with for the last Cocker I bought other than the two visits, one prior to the litter and the second to make a final choice.  I just never felt I needed constant updates.  When she is mine she is mine and she will not lack for care I can assure you.  Similarly, I don't encourage or discourage my buyers to seek updates or more visits and I have found some do and some don't.  I don't think either is "normal"

i agree i would give her the deposit back good luck with this problem and keep us posted

> Nothing is good enough for her, she is not sure that the pup was right, she wanted pick of litter and was put out when I told her she was 4th down on the list. Nothing seemes good enough for her.

It seems to me then she might actually be glad to get out of the arrangement which should make things much easier for you.

> It seems to me then she might actually be glad to get out of the arrangement which should make things much easier for you

Sounds like that to me to really.

We're so alike in many ways Blue......you must be young, tall, size 0, clever and gorgeous like me and Teri?

:-D :-D  so true ;-) 

i think you have made the right decision
if she wanted pick of litter, and was not happy about not getting it
she could very well return pup later saying its not good enough
as breeder you have the choice of pick
some people are just beyond

go with your gut feeling.  i had probs with a buyer for one of my last litter. he came round every week to see puppy, then i heard he never walked his other dog and he was ill treated, so i wouldnt let him have the pup!  when i see him in the street i now get death stares, but who cares, the puppy went to a wonderful home near Gatwick airport! x

this is why we have that!! gut feeling .....never ignor it ...it will save alot of heart ach in the end ....i didnt once and yes pup came back to me and i was soooo happy she did ,i found the right home for her :) ....so now i always try and go with mine :) x

Hi Floradora

have sent you a private message.not quite related to thread

thats the bit that would worry me ( doesnt ask about her pup) Hveing a new dohg is abit like having a new baby
you should be excited and want to know all you can.
I would cancel the deal give her her money back and look for a home that you are comfortable with. No one said owners have to be good with other humans but should show care about dogs.

Floradora, I guess the deposit you've had is binding you legally too. :(

No - the deposit is just that.  It is used to "hold" a product but is not in itself a contractual agreement - if the full purchase price was paid then it would be a different story I think. 

No the contract is not legally binding us to sell the person a puppy, it was drawn up by a solicitor for us to be signed by both parties when they leave a deposit, our get out clause is ' the depsoit in non refunadable unless we cannot supply you with a puppy for whatever reason', before certain people jump down my throat about this being unfair on the prospective owner I will advise the reason why we did it this way, a friend who breeds labs took a deposit for a pup at 5 weeks old, she was very happy with the prospective owners, vettings went well ect, she then found out that these people worked full time and other bits of what they had told her were untrue, she sent deposit back with a letter stating why, to cut a long story short the breeder was taken to court, the prospective owners won substantial damages and nearly ruined my friend.

I think the safest and fairest thing all round is not to take deposits.

Or keep all the puppies for yourself, mwahahahaha! :-)

> Or keep all the puppies for yourself

What me??    :-)  How did you know?

I have never had this problem before in all the years that I have been breeding and also my mother with her labs when she actively bred and showed them, I have found in the last 18 months we puppy owners seemed to have changed, we had one put in rescue at 5 months old (it was posted about on CD) even though we keep in touch with owners, obviously some don't want to keep in touch and that is their perogative and I respect that as I have chosen them and felt they were suitable to own one of my precious pups.
I put all prospective owners through a vigorous vetting procedure on the phone, they are then invited to visit the dam prior to whelp and if I feel they are suitable and they feel I am also they are then put onto a waiting list. When pups are born they are all rung and advised and invited to visit at 3 weeks. Obviously how they interact with the adult dogs and vice versa tells me alot before the pups are here.
The little girl will stay with me and will be trained as a working gundog when she is older.

>The little girl will stay with me and will be trained as a working gundog when she is older

aaah that made me smile. meant to be i think

> The little girl will stay with me and will be trained as a working gundog when she is older.

That's great, you would only have worried about her if you'd let her go to people you had reservations about. Hope things work out well with her now. You must be feeling happier now that you've decided against Mrs Grumpy ;-)

I have just come across this thread.

I certainly would not let anyone that I wasnt 100 o/o happy about have any pup of mine.  When I had my litter I had first 'interview' on the phone, if I didnt like them they didnt get any closer. I would certainly have gave back the deposit if I wasnt happy. good on you!

> I think the safest and fairest thing all round is not to take deposits.

Thats why I have never taken deposits.   People's circumstances sometimes change too between putting  a deposit on a pup and collecting it and it can make them feel obliged to you.

Good to hear this pup will now stay with you.  Have you heard anything after returning the deposit yet?

It was meant to be, this little pup has the best home she could want.