The GSP is absolutly awful, not a kind face at all and god knows whats going on with the back legs!

As for the cavalier link somebody posted, next to the pucture it says 'undocked' well since when was the cav docked?!

oddly my breed has more skin in the new illustration, than it really should have!!! LOL oh and the gay stern is simply awwwwwful :( :(

Did I miss something? Is it silly season already? or are the KC having a joke?? I have been looking through more standard pictures and I agree there are some dire pics in there. Loved the Chicken drumstick leg on the leo..... Reminds me must get my dinner out of the oven! lol

Hmmm.. well I actually think the SBT drawing is a good representation of most people's idea of how a Stafford should look, and sight fitter looking than a lot you do see in the flesh!
No pump handle tail in the pic though?

The Bedlington painting is awful :( :(

I can see it was done from a photo in the picture library, but it bears little resemblance to the original :(  there is no excuse for this, it's a clear enough photograph :(   Bedlingtons are supposed to look lithe and lathy, they are surprisingly heavy when picked up, the painted one looks more like a cart horse :(  and it also looks as tho it's had a wallop on the backside :( 

Several other painted breed pictures are appalling :(

If an artist is going to paint breed illustrations the least they can do is become familiar with the breeds, the breed standards and typical representatives of the breeds.  Speaking from experience here too ;)

This is the standard letter that has been sent out to all who have complained about the poor illustrations now used in every breeds standard up on the KC website!

"Dear XXXX
Thank you for your comments regarding the breed illustrations on the Kennel Club website. The Kennel Club has made the decision to replace the photographs on each of the breed standards with illustrations as it had experienced several copyright issues with the photos. This revision ensures that the Kennel Club holds the copyright to all of the images on the breed standards, thus resolving this issue.

The illustrations are intended as a general guideline to the identification of each breed for the average lay person, which can then used across a number of areas of web and print publication, rather than as a perfect specimen of the breed.

We are sorry that you are not happy with the illustration for your breed but the Kennel Club has no plans to amend these illustrations at present.

Yours sincerely

James Skinner
PA to the Secretary"

I wonder how much this has cost the Kennel club...
To get these drawings done...

Presumably less than dealing with copyright issues :-)

Did they honestly intend to convey that the British Kennel Club doesn't own enough suitable photographs of the different breeds to be able to use them on their website and in publications?    They sound like some tin pot organisation that have just come into existence! :( :(

> I wonder how much this has cost the Kennel club...
> To get these drawings done...

Not a lot if the illustrations are any guide ;)

>Presumably less than dealing with copyright issues

Hmm. maybe a certain company wanted their photos back :)  quite a few breed standard photographs appeared to have been taken at Ch Shows by a well known sponsor ;)

Lol Abbeypap, well if photos are the problem then we should all send them pictures of our dogs with a letter saying they can use them for their breed standards :-)

We wrote to the KC and got the same standard reply. Why didn't they ask the breed clubsto send in a selection of photos that were not copyright?
The Basset Hound has a new interim standard - but the Basset picture shows excess and exaggeration - all the things we have been told to avoid! Talk about sending mixed messages!

> Thank you for your comments regarding the breed illustrations on the Kennel Club website. The Kennel Club has made the decision to replace the photographs on each of the breed standards with illustrations as it had experienced several copyright issues with the photos.

Hmmm, that's odd. If there are 'copyright issues' with the photos then why are there no 'copyright issues' with the drawings taken from the photos? Drawing/painting/sculpting from a photo is an infringement on the copyright of the photo, unless specific authorisation of the copyright holder has been given/granted/leased. (I'm an animal portrait artist and have come accross this myself)

Sonds like a porky-pie to me....... I think the illustraiotns are there for the KC to distance thierselfs from people moaning about the 'state' of pedigree dogs, ie. removing any photographic 'ammo' of 'exagerations' that could be used in argument against them.
It's not on really, the KC should be proud of photos of pedigree dogs - REAL pedigre dogs, not hide them away behind paintings :(

ETA simply flipping the image, so the dog now faces the opposite way from that in the photo, (which is what has been done to the Mastiff pic) is not enough to get around any 'copyright issue'.

> Hmmm, that's odd. If there are 'copyright issues' with the photos then why are there no 'copyright issues' with the drawings taken from the photos? Drawing/painting/sculpting from a photo is an infringement on the copyright of the photo, unless specific authorisation of the copyright holder has been given/granted/leased

Good catch mastifflover!

I haven't thought about that one for so long as I take my own photos.    Have seen a few people at local shows and markets (not dog shows ;) ) who have paintings of dogs and I recognise the photo from a book   have given up mentioning it as they just think I'm a busy body :(

They seem to have used a lot of different artists (a lot of different styles and media used) maybe they're hoping it will be too difficult to pursue?

The guidance from the picture of a flatcoat could be would be to say to potential judges, "DO NOT under any circumstances place a dog looking like this! It is so anotomically incorrect that you can use it as a club competition to spot the faults" However the KC seem to have missed this sentence from the revised standard ........

> I haven't thought about that one for so long as I take my own photos

LOL, that's why I take my own photos now :)

The Lagotto, what's happened to the poor dogs back leg, I've never seen angulation like that in any breed!

I think there is also a big difference between showing a photo of a real dog, which obviously will have its faults and virtues, and that of a drawing attached to a breed standard, the mere placement suggests that the illustration shows all the physical attributes which are ideal in that breed.  There could be a lot of very strange judging decisions if a judge goes by some of these drawings! 

I hope that the judging does not go by these photo's otherwise i will have to chop 6 inches off my Newfies legs !!

The Yorkie has a real photo so the KC must be telling porkie pies !!

Peanuts

The below is taken from the artists website, think we can work out how many 200+ will cost :)

>You know that your breed and it's long term future would benefit from professionally drawn images to enhance your written standard.

>Here is a price guide, which is a small price to pay for the long term serious problems,
>avoidance and prevention of different 'types' developing within your breed due to lack of uniformity and misinterpretation of words, if it hasn't happened already. 

>48 images - 2,500.oo UK Sterling
>24 images - 1,250.oo UK Sterling

:-O

Glad I found this thread, I saw the new paintings/drawings the other day and thought how awful they are.  There isn't even one of an undocked dog for my breed!

What a waste of money these pictures are! Even if they cost a tenner each! My grand-daughter could do as well!

Why do we need them any way? Well other than as a guide to what the breeds should not look like.

Have just heard - the Kennel Club are removing all the images from the breed standards

Where did you hear this? I am glad the pictures were terrible.

That contradicts the email replys they have been sending out to those that have complained, but would like it to be true.

This is the latest reply we received

Following feedback from users, the Kennel Club has decided to remove all of the breed images at the present time.

Regards
James Skinner

well there is no such thing as a perfect dog so how do they expect to be able to draw one??

There's a "blue print" of the perfect, or should I say Ideal dog :)

yes but how is that to be drawn by an artist on paper? the results of the new drawings show that what is written in the breed standard has obviously been misentepritated by the artist

No, The artist drew a picture from a photo she had been given... :)

Reply to Mastifflover's post of 4th Feb:

>>If there are 'copyright issues' with the photos then why are there no 'copyright issues' with the drawings taken from the photos?<<

Two years ago, I received an email from the Kennel Club, saying that they were "having illustrations done of all the recognised breeds" and "looking for pictures to be used as references for this."  The KC asked if they could use a photograph of one of my dogs and stated "The picture would only be used as a reference for the illustrator and we would not use it for anything else without contacting you first."

I gave our permission for the photograph to be used - (we own the copyright as well as the dog!) - and asked if they would let us know where we could find the illustration if our picture was used.  I think the KC have got around the copyright issue - I imagine that they have sought permission of the copyright holders to use the original photograph as a "reference" ... we retain the copyright for our photo ... but the KC now has the copyright for the "illustration".  Cynical me thinks that the KC also very nicely avoids having to pay for photographs ... because they haven't actually published the photograph!

I have not heard from the KC since, about using the illustration of my dog ... but my dog's illustration has been used by them ... on the front cover of a dog show schedule, on the KC website and now, on my breed's Breed Standard page!  I think what the KC meant, when they wrote to me "we would not use it for anything else without contacting you first" was with reference to our photograph ... NOT the illustration.

My breed is a docked breed.  Looking through the new Breed Standard illustrations, the docked and undocked examples I have seen are illustrations of two different dogs.  Not so my breed!  The KC has "stuck" a full tail on the end of my docked dog!  And it is does not depict a typical tail carriage in my breed!  (Needless to say, the Breed Clubs have written to the KC)!!

>> ...simply flipping the image, so the dog now faces the opposite way from that in the photo, (which is what has been done to the Mastiff pic) is not enough to get around any 'copyright issue'<<

That's exactly what they have done with the illustration of my dog!

Have any of you noticed that the illustrator is using many of the KC breed illustrations in the portfolio section of her website ...

http://www.jvkfineart.co.uk/portfolio.asp

I hope that judges looking at the breed standards, especially for previously docked dogs, will read the TAIL clause, as well as look at the picture ... as the two do not always "agree", as is demonstrated in the Australian Terrier breed standard: "Set high and carried upright as straight as possible, giving good overall balance."  But look at the KC illustration for the undocked dog!

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/item/65

Regards

"Charmer"

Charmer, if you have given your permission for a photo to be used for reference, flipping the image & painting it is in breach of your copyright.

>I imagine that they have sought permission of the copyright holders to use the original photograph as a "reference"

I had a very narrow escape with a photographer after taking a drawing from a photo. I had changed a few things (even changed the sex of the animal in question), but after seeking legal advise I found that I was still in breech of copyright as it was obvious my drawing was taken from the photo (despite the changes I had made). I was lucky in that the photographer offered me the option to pay for the use of the photo, if I hadn't taken that offer I faced being sued for a LOT of money. I was suprised at just how serious breech of copyright is.
Unfortunately, most of us get caught thinking that if the artist makes changes then they are within thier rights and it's classed as 'for reference' - but that is not so.
'For reference' doesn't cover copying a photo and making some changes.

GSD - much better than the last pic. Only criticism would be that it's a little short in the body, but no roaching or over exaggeration anywhere.
The dalmatian looks weird! The GSD is definitely one of the better ones :)

BOXER i have never seen a boxer with what looks like a tribal tattoo :-D

That your dog, Dave?  Very handsome.  I hope he is better behaved than you and doesn't annoy the wife too much ;-)

yep thats my girl :-D

> yep thats my girl :-D

Whoops :-D

The illustrations have now been removed from all the breed standard pages.  Where the photograph(s) and then illustration(s) used to be, there is now this link:

To view photos of this breed please visit the Kennel Club Picture Library

Charmer